Smuggler Archive
Thread: Eureka! Way to implement smuggling using in-game assets!
NOTE: the original post can be found here: http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=lightspeed&message.id=176431
The gist of the original post was that players should be allowed to land anywhere using a system that breaks the planetary (ctrl V) map into grids. You then select grids and, basically, zoom it in until it loads up the current structure placement system. You use that to find a valid spot to land your ship. What follows was my addendum:
OK, introduce customs at all starports. This would be an automatic security check every time you load in to a public starport, but it would ONLY check for illegal goods. It wouldn't look at faction. If you're carrying illegal goods and if - say 85% of the time - the check succeeds, you would be greeted by the local city guard who either levy a hefty fine or automatically attack.
Now, in order to get around this you land outside the city using your idea - the catch, though, is that only Master Smugglers have a 100% chance of succesfully doing this. When you arive at a space station you're given the option to bribe the attendent who will then allow you to bybass the official channels and land on the planet. The bribe would be half the cost of having a chassis dealer make the ship. I.E. a YT-1300 would have to pay 50k in bribe money. The logic is that a larger ship is more likely to attract attention. Once you've paid your bribe, you open up the quadrant screen as described above.
When you do this a new skill is checked - let's call it clandestine xp - and if you pass the check you can land wherever you like. If you fail, however, you're intercepted on your way down and land at the starport closest to the spot you would have landed, only this time the local police and/or stormtroopers are waiting. Pilots would get +5 clandestine xp at novice, and it would go up by +1 with each branch of pilot skill, and at master it would be +6. All told, a master pilot with no smuggler ability would have a +15 clandestine xp, giving a 15% chance of landing succesfully. A smuggler, on the other hand, would get a +10 at novice, and then bonuses all the way up the underworld tree. Say, +10, +10, +15, +20 and a final +20 at master. That would give a master smuggler +100 and, thus, the ability to land anywhere on a planet they choose - thereby avoiding customs checks and allowing them to smuggle.
I reiterate: Allowing Them (Smugglers) To Smuggle.
Also, this would encourage actual space travel between the planets because you wouldn't be able to do this with the travel option.
I seriously think that this is the best SWG idea that I have ever had. Ever.
Post-Script: Yes, I am aware that, as written, this is a JTL player only idea. If that's your main gripe, please be gentle.
Orcajum wrote:
Of the different "ways to make Smugglers Smuggle" ideas i've seen posted, this is one of the most immersive concepts to date. Though, even as a Master Smuggler myself, I wouldn't want a 100% success rate. Remember, Smugglers are not paid both because of the skills they possess and the risks they take to achieve their goals. A Smuggler's skill may help him minimize those risks, but they should never be totally eliminated. If everyone else were to have a 15% success rate, a Smuggler should have a 10-15% failure rate, and likely face even stiffer penalties than others. Remember, the Empire and many other planetary governments strongly disapprove of Smuggling activity.
I must admit, however, that the major fault with this plan is the same one we've continually run into to create a Smuggling environment. Until there is actual contraband (i.e. illegal goods and cargo) that needs to be transported, there will never be true Smuggling. Theoretically, the Devs could drop in the most perfect Smuggling system into the game, on that solves all the problems with transportation restrictions, a detection system, and appropriate consequences attached, and it would all go for naught due to the lack of "true" illegal items.
As of now, the only two things one could say to be actually contraband in-game are sliced items and spices. Spices currently have very little usage or market value, so they wouldn't need to be Smuggled. And I do not forsee anyoone paying 50k bribery fee + Smuggler profit margin for me to move a few guns and armor from one planet to the next. Especially since the likely fine for transporting these would be less than 10k. To me, sliced items are too small-potatoes to build a Smuggling environment around. I don't forsee the developers wanting to "inconvenience" the playerbase for individual weapons and armor. Again, too small-potatoes.
Agreed. So they should make Spice an optional additive - like the BE/Chef ones - that go into buff packs. And make Spices mined by those with Survey IV. Add this starship scans in and omg! Miners and doctors need Smugglers to carry their illegal bulk resources through starports.And what's also nice is that you can't be Master Smuggler/Master Doc.
Sengis wrote:
great thread all top draw discussion. 5 stars, adn a wistful prayer that the devs read our forums adn give a cr4p
Devs don't necessarily need to read these threads...I'm sure they care so passionately about implementing player smuggling that they've had similar thoughts.
Errr....
and looks perfet for exploits like jedi running away from BHs by entering their shipsThe Empire is a government at war. An oppressive government at that. Tax people for goods taken through Starports.
Something like 0.5 creds per unit of a resource, flat rates for each weapon (moving dangerous items? what are you - a rebel?) and crate (I don't care what's in it). Heck, charge double for 'luxury items' like Lokian Wild Wheat, and Dathomir Hides.
To avoid taxes, get your stuff smuggled.
What could happen, (though it takes a stretch of the imagination) is that instead of bribing the Spacestation to let you land, you talk to some Underworld scum on the Spacestation to take you down on a shuttle.
That way, only one model is needed (and we already have landing shuttles) and the shuttle can take off and go away (because your scummy-friend is flying it). Your ship, officially, is still in dock with the Spacestation.
It removes the coolness of seeing your ship land, but it would be technically far easier to implement.
Hope that helps.
Tinkergirl wrote:
Oh, and we've been told that there won't be other ships landing on the ground because of the size of a patch it would take to send all the ship models out to non-JTL users.
What could happen, (though it takes a stretch of the imagination) is that instead of bribing the Spacestation to let you land, you talk to some Underworld scum on the Spacestation to take you down on a shuttle.
That way, only one model is needed (and we already have landing shuttles) and the shuttle can take off and go away (because your scummy-friend is flying it). Your ship, officially, is still in dock with the Spacestation.
It removes the coolness of seeing your ship land, but it would be technically far easier to implement.
Hope that helps.
The taxing system would be great - it would act as a money sink for the richest players and it would be a perfect incentive to use smugglers. There would be a huge player backlash, though.
As far as having crowded landing zones - well, first there would be quite a lot of risk involved in doing this for a non-smuggler and even for a smuggler because, as was said, a master should have some chance to fail. Second, it's expensive enough that players wouldn't want to do it all the time. Third, the restrictions would be similar to placing a deed - possibly even more strict. You'd need a perfectly flat place to land your craft. Finally, there could be some restrictions on where players could land on the adventure planets - for example, the space around the village might be invisible to the station's sensors due to the force.
As far as keeping players from using the ships as instant getways when they're in a dangerous situation, it could be set up where landed ships need to be prepped for launch. At a starport this is done for you - your taxes at work - but if the player lands outside of a starport they need to do it themselves. It would basically be a wait of 30 seconds to a minute until they could launch, and they cannot be in combat while they're prepping.
Although there are a good number of JTL ships it wouldn't be that difficult to patch them out. Anyway, if they patch through those ship models they could use them on the ground to really enhance the atmosphere. The Rebel bases could actually have some Rebel ships, or Nym's could have a landing area with some NPC pilots that give ground/space missions. If they patch them out a week at a time, as was said above, it wouldn't be much of an inconvenience.
The idea about adding critical failures to the bribe is great as well. That would really keep the numbers of people using this to a managable level and it would add a lot of excitement. Also, one of the fails could be a sting operation - the space station lets you land, but when you touch down there is a group of angry NPCs waiting for you.
Here's something else that I just thought of: there would be a time limit on how long the ship could be landed. The rationale would be that the planetary authority does sensor sweeps for unregistered ships every so often and if they find one they impound it. The player then has to go to the nearest starport to launch and possibly pay a fine. Maybe you could increase the length of time that you're on the ground by paying a larger bribe at the dock - "Hey, when they pass the sensors over grid 56-12 send a power spike. There's some good money in it for you." Of course, the cost would get exponentially larger for each hour, topping off at, say, 8.
Thanks for the feedback everybody
I've been trying to think of how this could be implemented for smugglers without JTL, but I'm drawing a bit of a blank. Honestly, I never even imagined being a smuggler without considering space, so my view is admitedly skewed.
Edit: Fixed some spelling. Some horrible horrible spelling.
Message Edited by ValiantHalibut on 03-07-2005 09:48 AM
Tinkergirl wrote:
Taxes.
The Empire is a government at war. An oppressive government at that. Tax people for goods taken through Starports.
Something like 0.5 creds per unit of a resource, flat rates for each weapon (moving dangerous items? what are you - a rebel?) and crate (I don't care what's in it). Heck, charge double for 'luxury items' like Lokian Wild Wheat, and Dathomir Hides.
To avoid taxes, get your stuff smuggled.
Dathomir is a Restricted world... therefore the materials from there should not be taxed - but treated as an illegal item.
(I still think having stuff seized is ok if it is illegally modified or is an illegal item. I know that players would complain but it would add a bit of spice and danger to situations - and you could always try and blast your way out - better dead then seized right?)
A Smuggler, on being detected should have two options:
FIGHT
- win andyou keep the goods, but gain 'Law Enforcement' visibility
- die, and you lose the goods and face a hefty fine - eg 10% of your entire worth
- Law Enforcement vis brings you NPC arrest and seizesquads. If these squads succeed in killing you, you get the 10% fine
RUN
- you dump the goods and escape, but you gain Crimelord visibility
- Crimelord visibility puts you on player BH terminals. If teh BH kills you, he takes 10% of your worth
THis way, no Smuggler is forced into PvP, but also don't have to sit there like a lemon if boarded.
The system could be expanded on, giving you prestige points for each succesful evasion, and having that pretige rating viewable by players, allowing the best smugglers to sit at the top of the profession. And if you really wanted to make things interesting, you coudl then factor in a 'grassing' ability, ie a player can inform the enforcement NPCs doing the contraband scans that they need to heighten their awareness for a 5 minute period, which halves the success rate for Smugglers. What does this do? It allows you to grass up your competition. If Han is top Smuggler, and Talon,ratedat No. 2, sees him approaching a scan, Talon tips off the guards, grassing Han up, and shunting Talon up the ladder.