Smuggler Archive

---

Geevo wrote:

Slices

Overview:

The slicing tree is a very useful skill tree that sets Smuggler's apart from all of the other professions within the game. By slicing various items in the game, Smugglers have a unique role in this persistent universe. It allows us a steady income, and allows us to gain small advantages over other professions (i.e. extra mission payout, access to containers, etc.). With the current state of Spices, Slicing is our bread and butter. However, we are only seeing a modicum of the potential for this skillset.

Items and statistics able to be sliced:

This is a full list of things that could be able to be sliced, including ones we already have access to. This list will provide examples for the Devs to choose from to expand our versatility.

Weapons: HAM, damage, range modifiers, speed, condition, and possibly the type of damage
Armor: Effectiveness, Encumberance, Special Protection, Condition
Terminals: Mission, Bounty Hunter, Travel, Data (mostly for information, not changing permissions or anything that would cause griefing)
Backpack: Extra compartment, extra number of items, lower encumberance, scanner immunity
Vehicles: Speed, durability, Condition
Droids: Nearly all modules could be sliceable for similar stats as weapons and armor, extra storage, extra storage for stims and traps, chassis for additional modules, less battery use, etc.
Doors: In dungeons and adventure zones
Bazaar: Lower price (without cheating seller), additional quantities (without cheating seller), new "Black Market" tab for contraband.
Vendor: Non-NPC vendors only (meaning the vending machines) for same items as the bazaar, and maybe to increase the amount you get for offering an item (without cheating the merchant).
Containers: Locked containers, magseal containers, other loot type items ordungeon compartments (locked, storage devices), possibly somethiing with resource containers.

Uses for slicing:

Slicing could be used to place contraband items on the bazaar or on a vendor (assuming the are truly made illegal) in a new black-market style tab. This would see limited use except by fellow Smugglers and low-level dabblers. Yep, this is nice and is far more like slicing as seen in the EU

Slicing is a great way to use existing terminals to place "Smuggler Missions" on. By slicing the terminal, you gain access to these "Smuggler Only Missions". Placing "Smuggler Mission Terminals" out in the open is blatantly wrong and non-immersive. Same

Slicing could be used to crack into a Bounty Hunter terminal to remove a name (Jedi or Smuggler), or maybe to change some of the information to stall the Bounty Hunter or lower the bounty amount to make it less desirable. It could also be used to add someone (any player) onto the terminal that would be available to only Master Bounty Hunters or Bounty Hunters with Investigation IV. The reward would be determined by the terminal based on the targets skill (up to almost the same amount as a Jedi), however there could beacost that could be double the reward. Hmm, I'm not entirely sure about this, as Caylin's idea of identiy cards has just as much merit. There's one or two problems with this idea; the first being the image Caylin managed to conjour in my head, of a smuggler slicing away at a terminal while a BH is standing next to him, browsing through the missions and seeing the smuggler's one of the marks; perhaps changing the terminal they need to slice to a different one would be more apt? The other and indeed major problem is the adding of people to terminals - this completely goes against the idea of consentual PvP, flushing it down the toilet; I can't see the Devs going for this at all. Either way, I think Caylin's idea of an identy card should be offered as an alternative.

Slicing could be used to access data (the true use of slicing in the Star Wars universe) from various data terminals such as guild halls, player structures, harvesters, etc. Note that this would access data, but not change it. Information can be valuable too, but we do not want a breaking and enering style of use. Again, this is far more like the slicing seen in the EU, it does however seem more of a **edit** bit when compared to something like the experimentation system below. If everything else gets done, then yes, this would be another nice addition, but shouldn't be a priority imo.

Slicing could be used for droids for a variety of affects. We can be interdependent on DE's by giving them the schematic for a Droid Upgrade Kit in the same way we are dependent on Weaponsmiths and Armorsmiths. Nice idea, has potential to further both professions

For the GCW, the security terminal could be moved outside of the bases and the Smuggler would have to slice the terminal for the group to enter (think of Endor with Han trying to open the door to the shield generator) ... it would also have to change the order requirements for base destruction to Smuggler being the first step.Already commented on this, still think it's a nice idea.

Changes to Slicing:

This is a list of several potential changes to slicing. SOme are dependent on other skills and slicing abilities.

- Creation of a new slicing system that would mimic crafting experimentation complete with 'slicing points' that would allow Smugglers to choose a wider array of stats to slice and control over how much of each stat gets sliced scaled by level of the Smuggler and how many points he/she has to use. Yes! I think this is a great idea and should be the most pushed for item on the slicing list! It by far out classes the simple 'pick-o-slice' idea by offering players more choice, requires them to think more about what they're doing/having done and is far more fun imo. Other benefits over pick-o-slice is that it won't screw over none masters -If Pick-o-slice was implemented, it'd mean that nearly all buisness went to masters, leaving those at Slicing IV high and dry; It won't remove the chance of failure (of the customer's expectations that is) and thus still leave those greedy WS and AS with extra purchases to ensure that slice is right .

- Pick-o-Slice at the Master Smuggler Level A no-no, see above.

- Re-certification for the use (not just crafting of) slicing tools to FAN's at Novice Smuggler and Clamps at Slice 3. Logical, makes sense.

- Create a "Slicing Station" that would work as a crafting station, allowing a smuggler to have more tools and space available to him/her to allow the Smuggler acces to bigger and better slicing options. Hmm, aslong as it only increased the chance of getting a higher slice, rather than increased the slice cap-remember that a 35% increase on a weapon is a large one! (part of the reason many feel we undercharge for slicing). This would be especially handy for a smuggler's personal weapon when making the slices on that.

- Remove the ability to slice non-mechanical objects (i.e. a Stone Knive, where are those wires?) It makes sense, but it could be a headache to implement and will reduce people's options to grind. Either way, the text detailing what we're doing while slicing perhaps needs a change?

- Change the interface to be more interactive between Smuggler and Client, as in the new ID interface This would be great if implemented with the experimentation system!

- Move slicing terminals to Novice Smuggler and Locked Containers to Slicing 1. Containers are held for ransom because people know that Smugglers need them to advance. Yep, logical, fits with the smuggler missions being hidden on normal terminals

- Increase item description to include the specifics on the modifications. This would be handy, especially for large orders, although if the ID interface was implemented wouldn't be required for the average customer; A nice addition, but not mandatory for that smuggler esq feeling.

---

This is the second time I've writen this out

/emote shakes his fist at the lithium board, "I am logged in damn you, I am!"

Anywhoo, no idea if that helps, hope it does.

P.S. Thought I'd mention that I've not commented on the other two trees because I agree withand want to see everything in the Underworld tree implemented and I'm not all that opinionated on the dirty fighting tree and am content to let everyone else sort that out.

Message Edited by WesBelden on 05-31-2004 02:46 AM

I already made a similar post in the thread started by Caylin, and I'll make another one here (I'm kinda confused why we have 2 almost identical threads ...)

I still think that all players that use sliced items and are under influence of spice should get some type of TEF, that would make them attackable by NPC security forces and NPC stormtroopers. Or something like that. And give smugglers some type of smuggler mask scent type of skill. It might be esier than scanning everybody, which we know is pretty much impossible.

I am not talking about PvP TEF - that indeed would be problematic. I'm talking about more of a NPC TEF, something similar to what makes Valarian thugs and Desert Demons unhappy every time I walk past them - a some sort of a flag that my character gets with negative faction points. (may be TEF is a wrong word to describe it. oh, well) Walking around with illegalt items should be like walking on Lok in pre- Vehicle Publish days -- it should seem like every law enforcement NPC is out to get ya. And since there is no scanning invovled, this would be happening a lot more often. This might be that something that would force regular players to seek for somebody who can "mask" their illegal items - smugglers.

That, of course, brings up another issue -- what is an illegal item? is slices and spices enough? shouldn't there be outlawed weapons, armor, power sources, minerals, craft, droids, etc.?

---

JediKozel wrote:
I already made a similar post in the thread started by Caylin, and I'll make another one here (I'm kinda confused why we have 2 almost identical threads ...)

---

1. One guy can't normally see all sides of the problem.


2. I'm competitive, if I see someone with another document, I want to one-up them to make my version and everything I do the best, making it better for everyone involved.


3. It's not organised by the correspondent who is supposed to be representing you and the community, and a jaaded view on my side could be a bad thing for everyone else (Example: The Imperial Crackdown fiasco).


4. Alot of it iscopiedfrom mine as it is pretty much complete, while the crew working on this directly have other concerns they had to take care of, before submitting their contributions. So some of my stuff was used as filler. I'm sure more unique stuff will come in soon. I also copied some of my stuff from them.


5. They can also be competitive, they see what I have and try to one-up me it's a vicious circle.


6. These guys do not have an official position, so there is nothing about a hidden agenda that can be brought up.


7. I was hellishly tired, and I lacked the willpower to work on this much for quite some time. Geevo 'stepped up' and I appreciate it immensely. Since then I've regained a bit of that drive, so that's how my version came into existence.

Those are a few. I've sent both links to Thunderheart last night to his Email. So I'm hoping he will pop in tomorrow if he has the time in this thread, or my own.

Message Edited by Smuggler_Caylin on 05-31-2004 01:33 PM

Message Edited by Smuggler_Caylin on 05-31-2004 01:36 PM

---

Smuggler_Caylin wrote:

---

JediKozel wrote:
I already made a similar post in the thread started by Caylin, and I'll make another one here (I'm kinda confused why we have 2 almost identical threads ...)

---

1. One guy can't normally see all sides of the problem.


2. I'm competitive, if I see someone with another document, I want to one-up them to make my version and everything I do the best, making it better for everyone involved.


3. It's not organised by the correspondent who is supposed to be representing you and the community, and a jaaded view on my side could be a bad thing for everyone else (Example: The Imperial Crackdown fiasco).


4. Alot of it iscopiedfrom mine as it is pretty much complete, while the crew working on this directly have other concerns they had to take care of, before submitting their contributions. So some of my stuff was used as filler. I'm sure more unique stuff will come in soon. I also copied some of my stuff from them.


5. They can also be competitive, they see what I have and try to one-up me it's a vicious circle.


6. These guys do not have an official position, so there is nothing about a hidden agenda that can be brought up.


7. I was hellishly tired, and I lacked the willpower to work on this much for quite some time. Geevo 'stepped up' and I appreciate it immensely. Since then I've regained a bit of that drive, so that's how my version came into existence.

Those are a few. I've sent both links to Thunderheart last night to his Email. So I'm hoping he will pop in tomorrow if he has the time in this thread, or my own.

---

Translation: WE ARE WORKING TOGETHER and providing various options to see what works best to provide the best possible solution to the Smuggler Revamp

those are all very good points, and it's always interesting to have 2 different points of view to consider ... different being a key word. You guys managed to create 2 almost identical documents. If I were to write a brief review on your documents, it would be identical.
I'm not saying it's a bad thing. just weird, that's all. I just happened that it would be more "interesting" if there would be 2 absolutely different documents and community would be forced to choose.
But, we've been repeating this wants-and-needs so many times already, that I can see how there is only one document with minor differences .... hmm ...

anyway, I still think we are digging our own grave by asking for contraband scans at starports or other checkpoints. We all know that devs agree, but can't make it work. We should consider other options. And personally I think that giving everybody with a illegal items -5000 faction standing with all security NPCs (Corsec, RSF, Stormtroopers, etc.) is the answer. People caught might simply be fired upon or slapped with astronomical fee - whatever. This wont be a scan. Just another PvE event, that will be happening in NPC cities everywhere (and you need to enter a city to catch a space transport). This should be easy to implement. This already happening with thugs in Bestine, Mos Eisley, Moenia, and Nym's Stronghold (if you have negative Nym faction), just to name a few.

If it were a flag that is fine, if you are saying that one slice should automatically alter my 5k corsec faction to -5000, permanently, you have another thing comin

Thats what you are essentially saying we should do. It's a little more complex than that. There is faction, and then there are flags.

I don't feel it is an answer, only smugglers seem to stand to be penalised for the most part, where what we need to do is bring other players to smugglers.

I don't see how asking for contraband scans is digging our own graves, we just haven't found the method to accomplish it yet.

An example would be a random ticket taking a player to an instanced room when they travel, to be scanned. This decreases the amount of stuff they have to look for and monitor, while also accomplishing what we have set out to do on the whole. Accomplish scans, a fake destination on the ticket to be the simple trigger that is almost exactly the same as the process they have now. It would be random enough that every player would have to wonder if that was the time they were going to get yanked and scanned.

Message Edited by Smuggler_Caylin on 05-31-2004 03:23 PM

TEF shouldn't come with an item. A player should have a tef. just like GCW. If you use an item, you should get a TEF. it will make you attackable by law enforcement NPCs, who wouldn't care how and where you got what item. all they see is a "red dot" that should be dealt with. Just like a player walking up to a rancor lair - they don't care who you are and what you have. You are just another enemy. Unless you have "maskscent".

Again, every time any item was used, it would have to check whether or not the item was illegal...any item...on any person...anywhere.

---

Smuggler_Caylin wrote:
Again, every time any item was used, it would have to check whether or not the item was illegal...any item...on any person...anywhere.

---

hmm, you right - it's still based on an item. darn.

What if we make smugglers "contagious" -- you trade with us, you get an illegal TEF. This would be a gamble for us - what will people be afraid of more, not having their gear sliced, or having a TEF agaisnt CORSEC and the likes. Any idea on this approach?

Well, honestly I don't think it would work well due to all the workarounds. vendors... house storage... droids...