Smuggler Archive

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HOTDOG wrote:

Done- it still doesn't hold water like you are selling it to me- there are solutions that are being overlooked.

It holds alot of water. We have solutions. What I was commenting on is your portrayal that pvp is not forced as fact within GM's proposal. It is, without a doubt, forced if the smuggler does a mission. I was quoting his posts, you were bringing up stuff out of thin air. Which has more credibility? I'll go with the quotes.

I know these are not options in GM's post- I read it. It says at the very start that the proposal itself is a guideline that may NEVER happen- we are supposed to be discussing ways it COULD happen and exactly HOW to go about it so that it is fair for everyone. That is what I thought we were doing- The options I presented above I have posted at least 3 times but have also been mentioned SEVERAL times by others- and as presented DO make it so a player would have a CHOICE in whether theyrisk PvP or not.

Then make sure when you post 'facts' you say they are 'theories' or something equally resembling the problem that they are not true.

There ARE no universal facts here. GM only posted what he is TRYING to implement. Maybe you should go back and read it again. We are trying to make this happen.

What I quoted came directly from what he wrote. That is fact. What he wrote forced PvP on a player who took missions. I read it, I quoted it and applied knowledge of it instead of bringing up maybes and could bes. Everything in that segment was from posts written by developers, showing how it forced the player into a pvp situation.

Wait, wait, wait-Everyone who uses contrabrand should be wary of getting caught with it. PvE, PvP, whatever. It's the same as going through the Imperial Outpost with a TEF. You just don't do it 'til the tef goes off.

Yes, wary of consequences. Every single consequence here is linked to PVP, it should not be. There should be missions without a pvp consequence, but there is no mention of that in GM's post AT ALL.

It's like avoiding entering the South end of Coronet because you have bad faction with the thugs that spawn there.

I never avoid them. Nor would I avoid bounty hunters.

This is what I don't understand- IF your visibility is high, and you DON'T want to end up on a BH terminal- wait a few minutes before you go barging through the starport with crates of spices and illegal weapons.

Why should he have to wait? That's penalising their game play if they have had no interest at all in participating in PVE. I shouldn't have to say 'Oh, I better wait 15 minutes before finishing this mission or I'll get on the terminals.' That's absurd. You are hindering their progression by restricting their playstyle as they are forced to participate in PvP.

Is that sooooo inconvienient? It is YOU that doesn't want the problem.

I have no problems. None at all. Yet a player who has no interest in PVP DOES. They check it and are in a playstyle they hate no matter what. I on the other hand just waste BH'ers as they come.

You can level 'til the cows come home. Just don't do it in a starport where you can get caught and take smuggler missions that DO NOT give visibility- (Yeah, they do not exist but if we work together they can). Other than that I can't see how you would accidentally end up on a terminal. No server can screw you up THAT bad.

ALL MISSIONS IN THAT PROPOSAL GIVE VISIBILITY. There are no exceptions to the rule. ALL OF THEM. It's not about some pissant starport it's that all missions have a PVP consequence.

and obviously you have never seen Bria's acronym. Better Reboot It Again. It's still not a just consequence.

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The Infamous Caylin Borealis - First Master Smuggler on Bria
One of the Four Horsemen of the Smuggler Apocalypse!
:The Ghost with the Most:

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RohmEnari wrote:

You know, I gotta tell ya, you guys are getting a lot of attention right now and the fact that you are argueing so vehemently is sad. I hate to speak for the Ranger community, but I feel confident in saying that we would kill for the amount of attention you guys are getting right now, even if it meant we had to POSSIBLY face the element of PvP in our profession.

Quit whining and start being constructive. Work together instead of against one another. My opinion on the matter is, if you want to take up a highly illegal profession such as smuggler, then you should be faced with the possible consequence of being targeted for death. I know those of you who are against the idea of PvP hate the idea of someone spitting on youand shouting, "You got PWNED! I RULE YOU!", and then pissing all over your corpse, but you just have to shrug it off and remember that the person that does that is a very VERY sad individual and you should pity them.

Message Edited by RohmEnari on 06-20-2004 02:49 AM

Message Edited by RohmEnari on 06-20-2004 02:49 AM

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It is more then that, it is the idea of being forced into someone elses playstyle. If everyone that is so bent on a PvP ONLY solution would start to respect and work on a combination PvP/PvE respectable solution like the PvE'ers are then we would have this solved already.

It is not the PvE'ers that are holding up this discussion, we are ready and willing to come up with a solution to incorperate and respect both styles of play... it is those that feel their style of play is more important than anyones else that is holding the discussion from going into the solution stage.

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KodaVeers wrote:

good post

but some of the complaining has been general public as well due to the fact that if they get caught with illegal goods enough times they will go onto terminals as well. And the NPC issue was an idea to keep those who prefer not to PvP cuz they can only kill AI happy..

Did you read my suggestion above...what do you think??

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majorslappy wrote:

GM and the rest of the great smuggling community,

Please think about this just for a few momments in relation to the PvE and PvP issues surrounding the proposed changes to smuggler.

If Smugglers commit illegal acts, legal authorities should track them down and arrest them. CorSec, FedDub, etc.

If smugglers betray the trust of their criminal counterparts (Jabba, Valrian, etc.), then those criminals should hire BHs to hunt them down.

If the illegal act is committed, then have the person hunted down by someone appropriate to the jurisdiction and have it be someone that makes sense for the play style of the player. If the player is neutral or covert, have them hunted by one, two, three, or more NPC bounty hunters that are leveled appropriately to the level of visibility that the smuggler has at the moment. Master Bounty Hunters (I am talking the NPC equivalent here for the moment) would very likely not hunt low level criminals because said criminals would have very little reward offered for them. If the player is overt, then have them hunted by player BHs. Change the BH terminals so that BHs cannot take missions lower than appropriate for their level. If they are a master, leave all the low level criminals off the terminal when the MBH views missions. If the player is covert rebel or imperial and they are scanned and made overt, add them to the BH terminals for the duration of the time they are overt (until they find a recruiter and go covert plus one hour).

If the illegal act(s) creat a lot of visibility, then the criminal's faction for the appropriate jurisdiction should reflect that and the local authorities should act. For smugglers specifically, Underworld should give them the ability to have paid informants (a regular fee perhaps to the local authorities?), payoffs to law enforcement, bribes to local judges, bribes and payoffs to Spynet. Allow a smuggler to use Underworld to lower his/her visibility with that kind of influnce. Perhaps use faction to change visibility by lower faction in the appropriate area. I am wanted but I spend most of my time on Correllia so I use my 5000 CorSec faction (and lower it) to lower my visibility by "bribing" CorSec to reduce my visibility.

Now, all that being said, I don't want to PvP. Player on Player combat is nearly always powergamer on powergamer with one or both of them with 1 million credit composite, 500 thousand credit weapons, uber loot from every dungeon they've ever had in SWG, and they are buffed/stuffed/spiced to the gills. I have no desire to play that game. And please don't tell me to simply not be a smuggler. You choose to be a MBH or whatever your profession and you can play it PvE OR PvP as well. I would suggest to you that you play your MBH the way you want to and leave the PvE'rs to play theirs they way they want to. Pleae don't build a game mechanic that forces me to be something I don't want to be.

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HOTDOG wrote:


I don't like the idea of adding BHs to the terminals- if they break the law enough they will end up there themselves. Giving a player to ability to put another player on the terminals WOULD lead to outright griefing.

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Ternque01 wrote:

Are you even thinking here? Want to know the difference between a NPC and a PC BH? A PC BH does all the things you mention. A NPC BH does all the things you mention plus 1-5% decay on all of your precious armor and clothes. NPC BH's are more expensive in terms of your losses. If you are worried about wound/armor griefing, don't use feign death. Take the death like a man.

I know the difference between a NPC BH and PC BH, it is very simple and quite easy to understand:

NPC BH - PvE Playstyle

PC BH - PvP Playstyle

There it is, it really is that simple. We are not trying to force NPC BH on the whole comunity, we are not trying to force our playstyle on anyone, we have gone out of our way on countless posts to show you we do not wish that. Yet post after post after post on here there are PvP'ers (not all mind you, alot seem to really want to work out a good solution like the PvP smug's also) that ONLY want their style of play, they only want their way.

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Herms wrote:
If i read this right smugglers will be forced to pvp?

The thought of having some uber leet 12 year old boba fett wannabe tracking me down to 'pwn' me does not appeal in the slightest.

This content needs to be balanced more to the non-pvpers as there are far more people that dont participate in PVP than do.

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Yes, I agree... it needs to be balanced. Funny that PvE'ers seem to make up the majority of the population yet we are not demanding a complete PvE smuggler, in fact we are going out of our way to try to provide good content for both styles of play.

That is all weare asking, a good balanced smuggler revamp that gives great content to both parties.