Smuggler Archive
Thread: Risk vs Reward: Spice, Buffs, and Food
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Chavabegga
Tue Jul 27, 2004 1:45 pm
#1
As we all the current system serious lies in the favor of food and buffs. Spices have a horrible downer and are not nearly as powerful or long lasting as buffs or even some foods. Spices are also illegal and if you rebel can get you turned overt. So what makes spices even a little bit desirable?
I would like to throw out there the idea for how to change spice. With current buffs you can be boosted to 2500 over your stats for 3hrs and with brandy you can be boosted to 800+ and for 40min. There are no downsides to these aside from having to find a doc and not being able to eat any more food and currently by the time the brandy wears off your stomach is mostly empty.
With spice, you can only take one, it lasts no more then 13min and then you have a downer that leaves you crippled. They have no advantages over food and buffs which is why no one uses them,
What I propose is that the limit on spices be removed. You can take as many as you want BUT after the first spice taken there is a random chance of an overdose. You could pop 10 pixies and have an amazing HAM or you could pop two, OD, and then go incapped with the full downer timer.
How many times have you been sitting there with your pixie running watching your mind shrinking while a muon sits there waiting to be used? If you pop it you could be dead or you could be victorous and have a great stat boost going for 10min. Horrible downer coming up but you had that anyways because of the pixie.
Well thats just an idea I had. Will never happe but I thought I would share it.
Planeseeker
Tue Jul 27, 2004 2:51 pm
#2
Strangely enough, I wondered why this wasn't put in to begin with (please take note of the word "wondered" as I wonder no longer). I always thought that being able to take as much as you want was fine, but the chance of an OD would be greater for each one after the first.
IMO, if I were going to implement this, I would allow for the ability to consume multiple spices at a time. However, I would still limit the actual buff cap (full for the first, 1/2 for the second, none for each after that other than increasing the timer before the downer), otherwise you would have people taking as many as possible to get the highest stats they can get, solo the DWB, and have a ton of Mando armor all over.
As another side effect, I would have spices cause your stomach to get smaller, meaning that the more spice you consume reduces the fill rating. Or, as an alternative, causes you to become "hungry" and makes you eat food more frequently or go into an immediate downer/incap. Just a couple of thoughts...Please discuss.
Graby
WayneInAustin
Tue Jul 27, 2004 3:01 pm
#3
There's no way you should be able to do unlimited spice. I would say "up to three" maybe, with the possibility of an overdose growing each time. I think trying to tie it to stomach fill would be too complicated (as if this would get implemented anyway!).
Maybe something like this (I didnt spend much time on this.. it's just for thought)......
Eat first spice: No chance of overdose, 15 minute upper, 3 minute downer
Eat second spice: Chance of overdose 30%, both spices extended to 20 minutes from second eating, but downer 5 minutes.
Eat third spice: Chance of overdose 60%, but if no OD, then all three spice buffs extended to 25 mins from time of eating, but downer 10 minutes.
Overdose would result in immediate jump to the downer: either 5 mins or 10 mins, based on the above.
This is also probably too complicated to be implemented.
I also think that the power of the spice should be increased somewhat... else chef foods are STILL a better option.
Planeseeker
Tue Jul 27, 2004 3:06 pm
#4
WayneInAustin wrote:
There's no way you should be able to do unlimited spice. I would say "up to three" maybe, with the possibility of an overdose growing each time. I think trying to tie it to stomach fill would be too complicated (as if this would get implemented anyway!).
Maybe something like this (I didnt spend much time on this.. it's just for thought)......
Eat first spice: No chance of overdose, 15 minute upper, 3 minute downer
Eat second spice: Chance of overdose 30%, both spices extended to 20 minutes from second eating, but downer 5 minutes.
Eat third spice: Chance of overdose 60%, but if no OD, then all three spice buffs extended to 25 mins from time of eating, but downer 10 minutes.
Overdose would result in immediate jump to the downer: either 5 mins or 10 mins, based on the above.
This is also probably too complicated to be implemented.
I also think that the power of the spice should be increased somewhat... else chef foods are STILL a better option.
I just threw out my idea for some discussion as well.. I agree that tying it into the stomach is pretty much a given that it won't happen. I do like your idea, with maybe the addition that after the 3rd, the downer would potentially db the user, but that would mean the actual buff would have to be pretty high to risk it. I say potentially db, definately incap (dude, you just ate the most acid ever!!!), but that is just my opinion.
Graby
FrankLee
Tue Jul 27, 2004 9:28 pm
#5
We don't even need anything that complex.
Let us 'chain' drugs, the same way the real addicts do.
You pop a muon, you're high and dry for a while. Then you crash. Your mind bottoms out. While your downer is _still happening_ you take another to get back up to 'happy' and you're good for a little longer.
Timed right, the drugs end up not having as great an effect if chained, just like the real thing.
Also, careful review of present spices could lead to a kind of sequenced drug use, where you use one drug to get up a bit, another to get something else going, but also to eat up the previous downer... combinations could go 5-6 drugs long, and start over again. It'd also serve to emphasize the gradual scale of spices 1-4, where you want to keep getting tougher drugs to keep squashing the downer effects with more potent chemicals.
But hey, what do we know?
Let us 'chain' drugs, the same way the real addicts do.
You pop a muon, you're high and dry for a while. Then you crash. Your mind bottoms out. While your downer is _still happening_ you take another to get back up to 'happy' and you're good for a little longer.
Timed right, the drugs end up not having as great an effect if chained, just like the real thing.
Also, careful review of present spices could lead to a kind of sequenced drug use, where you use one drug to get up a bit, another to get something else going, but also to eat up the previous downer... combinations could go 5-6 drugs long, and start over again. It'd also serve to emphasize the gradual scale of spices 1-4, where you want to keep getting tougher drugs to keep squashing the downer effects with more potent chemicals.
But hey, what do we know?
MadnessLives
Tue Jul 27, 2004 10:25 pm
#6
I think Im gonna be standing by the Theed Starport.
Whispering "Gold" to all the shady looking folk!
Let's create a drug epidemic, make em illegal (oh wait they already are!)
Drugs should give more of a kick then food!
Or maybe foods should have a side effect! The fuller you are, the slower you move! Brandy how about after 2 you get dizzy and fall down!and Buffs the more you use em the less they work, just like steriods!
WayneInAustin
Wed Jul 28, 2004 7:51 am
#7
Yeah... I always thought it was funny that the more Brandy you drank, the higher your focus went.
"Look, there goes Way'ev-Da stumbling into the wall again!"
"Yeah! But he did it with such great Focus!"
"Look, there goes Way'ev-Da stumbling into the wall again!"
"Yeah! But he did it with such great Focus!"
Syzygy-Gorath
Wed Jul 28, 2004 7:58 am
#8
WayneInAustin wrote:
Yeah... I always thought it was funny that the more Brandy you drank, the higher your focus went.
"Look, there goes Way'ev-Da stumbling into the wall again!"
"Yeah! But he did it with such great Focus!"
I'm still trying to figure that out. Have the devs never been drunk? Do they not understand that alcohol doesn't make you smarter? Why, why, why is it brandy and port that do this? And before that Fishak (a strong mixed drink, by the description.) Fooey!
Uh…on-topic. I like the chaining/equilibrium (take spice to partially negate the downer, end up with diminished effects) idea.
ValiantHalibut
Wed Jul 28, 2004 6:31 pm
#9
FrankLee wrote:
We don't even need anything that complex.
Let us 'chain' drugs, the same way the real addicts do.
You pop a muon, you're high and dry for a while. Then you crash. Your mind bottoms out. While your downer is _still happening_ you take another to get back up to 'happy' and you're good for a little longer.
Timed right, the drugs end up not having as great an effect if chained, just like the real thing.
Also, careful review of present spices could lead to a kind of sequenced drug use, where you use one drug to get up a bit, another to get something else going, but also to eat up the previous downer... combinations could go 5-6 drugs long, and start over again. It'd also serve to emphasize the gradual scale of spices 1-4, where you want to keep getting tougher drugs to keep squashing the downer effects with more potent chemicals.
But hey, what do we know?
That's a good idea, but take it a step further.
Have reactions to various drugs - visual and gameplay things. Maybe something like a mind upper increases your stats and also allows you to "see further" - more effective radar - but because it makes you paranoid everything looks agro to you. Or maybe there are drugs that buff your strength pool but make you nigh-uninteligable to other players - except, of course, those who are also using the drug. It's funny how that works.
Combinations of drugs should produce different effects. Using a legal real-world example (considering that I don't know how happily SOE would react to the more relevant but less legal real-world examples) drinking different types of alcohol during an evening will vastly effect the type of drunk you get. That should hold over to the game - maybe two drugs react badly together and the result is detrimental whereas two others produce a very positive result.
Also, what about an addiction/experience system? The more drugs you use the less they effect you but the more you can use, therby allowing a player to, with enough spice, reach a higher buff but with less risk of OD. However this leads to addiction and a terrible downer when not on spice. For example, an avid spice user can pop, say, 10 spices without any real risk of OD and that would bring them to a buff level equivalent to a new user popping 4 spices with a near definite risk of OD, however in order for the avid user to maintain a standard pool level they have to consume 2 units of a spice on a regular basis. This would be great for smugglers - you know that the uber 1337 players would all be addicts and we'd be able to price gouge to our heart's content - which, though rougish, is definitely in the spirit of the proffession.
Chavabegga
Wed Jul 28, 2004 9:11 pm
#10
Ahh, many great ideas. I admit my idea for taking as many spices as you want, even with the OD chance would be bad. However something has to be done to balance the downsides of using them because as weall know the plus ain't quite worth it.
How about a spice that allows you to move at burst run speeds for 10min, with the ability to burstrun on top of it, but when it wears off you slow to a walk and are dizzy for a few minutes.
Or a spice that gives you 100% accuracy but then when it wears off you can't hit the broad side of a barn.
Or a spice that is just for fun that makes the screen funny colors, no downer.
I liked the idea of the spice that made you incomprehensible to everyone but those using that spice. No practical value but good RP.
And brandy should not increase your mind powers. It should cause you to take less damage. When you are drunk your mind is not more clear but you are more relaxed so don't get as hurt.
FrankLee
Thu Jul 29, 2004 1:22 am
#11
ValiantHalibut wrote:
FrankLee wrote:
We don't even need anything that complex.
Let us 'chain' drugs, the same way the real addicts do.
You pop a muon, you're high and dry for a while. Then you crash. Your mind bottoms out. While your downer is _still happening_ you take another to get back up to 'happy' and you're good for a little longer.
Timed right, the drugs end up not having as great an effect if chained, just like the real thing.
Also, careful review of present spices could lead to a kind of sequenced drug use, where you use one drug to get up a bit, another to get something else going, but also to eat up the previous downer... combinations could go 5-6 drugs long, and start over again. It'd also serve to emphasize the gradual scale of spices 1-4, where you want to keep getting tougher drugs to keep squashing the downer effects with more potent chemicals.
But hey, what do we know?
That's a good idea, but take it a step further.
Have reactions to various drugs - visual and gameplay things. Maybe something like a mind upper increases your stats and also allows you to "see further" - more effective radar - but because it makes you paranoid everything looks agro to you. Or maybe there are drugs that buff your strength pool but make you nigh-uninteligable to other players - except, of course, those who are also using the drug. It's funny how that works.
Combinations of drugs should produce different effects. Using a legal real-world example (considering that I don't know how happily SOE would react to the more relevant but less legal real-world examples) drinking different types of alcohol during an evening will vastly effect the type of drunk you get. That should hold over to the game - maybe two drugs react badly together and the result is detrimental whereas two others produce a very positive result.
Also, what about an addiction/experience system? The more drugs you use the less they effect you but the more you can use, therby allowing a player to, with enough spice, reach a higher buff but with less risk of OD. However this leads to addiction and a terrible downer when not on spice. For example, an avid spice user can pop, say, 10 spices without any real risk of OD and that would bring them to a buff level equivalent to a new user popping 4 spices with a near definite risk of OD, however in order for the avid user to maintain a standard pool level they have to consume 2 units of a spice on a regular basis. This would be great for smugglers - you know that the uber 1337 players would all be addicts and we'd be able to price gouge to our heart's content - which, though rougish, is definitely in the spirit of the proffession.
Very solid, I love the idea of tolerance. Could put a racial slant in for tolerances too. The mixing idea might be a bit beyond them code wise, but I agree with that too.
Tasolth
Thu Jul 29, 2004 11:38 am
#12
FrankLee wrote:
ValiantHalibut wrote:
FrankLee wrote:
We don't even need anything that complex.
Let us 'chain' drugs, the same way the real addicts do.
You pop a muon, you're high and dry for a while. Then you crash. Your mind bottoms out. While your downer is _still happening_ you take another to get back up to 'happy' and you're good for a little longer.
Timed right, the drugs end up not having as great an effect if chained, just like the real thing.
Also, careful review of present spices could lead to a kind of sequenced drug use, where you use one drug to get up a bit, another to get something else going, but also to eat up the previous downer... combinations could go 5-6 drugs long, and start over again. It'd also serve to emphasize the gradual scale of spices 1-4, where you want to keep getting tougher drugs to keep squashing the downer effects with more potent chemicals.
But hey, what do we know?
That's a good idea, but take it a step further.
Have reactions to various drugs - visual and gameplay things. Maybe something like a mind upper increases your stats and also allows you to "see further" - more effective radar - but because it makes you paranoid everything looks agro to you. Or maybe there are drugs that buff your strength pool but make you nigh-uninteligable to other players - except, of course, those who are also using the drug. It's funny how that works.
Combinations of drugs should produce different effects. Using a legal real-world example (considering that I don't know how happily SOE would react to the more relevant but less legal real-world examples) drinking different types of alcohol during an evening will vastly effect the type of drunk you get. That should hold over to the game - maybe two drugs react badly together and the result is detrimental whereas two others produce a very positive result.
Also, what about an addiction/experience system? The more drugs you use the less they effect you but the more you can use, therby allowing a player to, with enough spice, reach a higher buff but with less risk of OD. However this leads to addiction and a terrible downer when not on spice. For example, an avid spice user can pop, say, 10 spices without any real risk of OD and that would bring them to a buff level equivalent to a new user popping 4 spices with a near definite risk of OD, however in order for the avid user to maintain a standard pool level they have to consume 2 units of a spice on a regular basis. This would be great for smugglers - you know that the uber 1337 players would all be addicts and we'd be able to price gouge to our heart's content - which, though rougish, is definitely in the spirit of the proffession.
Lol I love it. Wondered why the spices were not chainable in the first place. still agree on some sideeffects.
as in. you chain for some 5 muons but forget to take another aftera temp grace period (would allow you some 30 seconds to take another of suffer the side effects),then you crash.. HARD. as in KD and you cant get up for 5 mins. as a serious side effect. or with neutrons you incap forX mins... yes a long time, but neeeded to stimulate a serious reaction to it. Drugs need to be the big bad kid on the block, not little sick timmy, that gets some energy from his medicine, then crashed 10 minutes later.
ReelAblo
Thu Jul 29, 2004 11:47 pm
#13
i juat use both, some **edit** wants to duel?
dancer buff
musician
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