Shipwright Archive

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Thunderheart wrote:

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Palath wrote:

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Thunderheart wrote:

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Palath wrote:

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Thunderheart wrote:

Just an FYI for Shipwrights. Crafted Engines and Capacitors should be getting stat increases across the board in the next live update. This should make it so that crafted versions of these ship components can be crafted at a higher quality than looted components.

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This almost makes me want to subscribe again with my WS/Shipwright. I was very close to dropping SW a few months ago for this very reason. Crafted items should ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS be superior to looted items, except for a RARE occurrence on a loot (extremely rare). In other games, it's different mainly because crafting does not use up your COMBAT skill points. In this game, you have to sacrifice all the content of the game in order to craft. So we should definitely be rewarded.

I heard something about a very nice Carbine dropping in the new ROTW quests. I haven't checked into this myself to see what the stats are compared to crafted carbines, but I certainly hope it is not a superior item. Otherwise we'll be in the same boat we're in here.

Anyway... good news, TH. Thanks for the info!

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There is a pretty good Carbine you can get on the RoW quests (along with some other nice items as well). As far as the new ships earnedon the RoWquests? They will remain that way. Looking to the future, players will get more items to craft and there will also be more quest/loot items - - it isn't going to be all one or all the other.

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Thanks for the response, TH. I just want to clarify to make sure my point wasn't missed... I'm not saying that looted items shouldn't drop. I'm just saying that in a game where the crafting system is an option that you take in LIEU of a combat template, the reward should be that crafted items are ALWAYS superior to looted items.

Let's say you put one single carbine in the game as a loot drop. And let's say that particular cabine has better stats than the best standard crafted weapon. Who in their right mind wouldn't simply work at getting that quest complete, and get the looted carbine? Forget about the Weaponsmiths who have dedicated 50% of their template to CRAFTING? You talk about balance, right? This whole CU was supposed to be about balance? But points like this are not only overlooked... it seems that they are being stomped on until they hurt.

Again, I have NO problem with loot. I think loot is good. But for heaven's sake, don't make the best weapons (and/or other items) in the game a droppable item! If nothing else, just make it a schematic like you did in the old days. At least this still gives the crafters something worthwhile to do and accomplish.

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The crafting system is certainly, "not an option". Crafters craft the vast majority of player used equipment in the game. Crafted items will always have a high value and so will some loot. Some crafted items will be better and some loot items will be better. Its never going to be an "either/or" situation. Sometimes great items will be craftable, sometimes they will be schematics and sometime they will be quest rewards.

I think the important thing to underscore is that the great RoW items are quest-loot, not loot drops. It important to have quest rewards that are satisfying and RoW is a very quest oriented expansion.

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Good points, TH. I'll take these into consideration for sure. I think I have a better idea where you guys want to see the game head to with regards to loot versus crafted items.

One thing I would love to see as a "reward" for quests are not only loot items, but new skills. I know this is very off topic for this particular thread, but the subject was breached, so I thought I'd express my thoughts there. Imagine being a given Elite Master (should be many quests for all the elite professions). Let's take TKM for this example. You're a Master at your trade, but that doesn't mean you know EVERYTHING you're ever gonna learn about Teras Kasi arts. Maybe you encounter a mysterious monk deep in the forests of Endor, and he starts you on your way to learning the lost art of "Focus of the Master". After completing a rigourous quest that spans the entire galaxy (including JTL stuff! Why not?!), you arrive back at the quest giver, and he grants you a new special ability that enhances your Meditate to an Improved version.

I think stuff like that would be great, too, and certainly wouldn't take away from the crafter's game.

I hope you don't get me wrong... I love this game. A lot! But one thing it has lacked since the early days is further advancement. To the contrary, your recent Combat Upgrade has actually pushed us back a tad as far as advancement is concerned (costs more skill points now for most Elite professions, leaving us with less total skill boxes in the end). I've posted before regarding adding in higher tiered Elite professions that go above and beyond the current Elites. I think we're approaching a very ripe time in the game for implementing this type of thing. But it could very easily start on a small gradient with my example above where you simply add a new ability as the reward to a quest.

Just some thoughts. Thanks for the personal feedback, TH!

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Thunderheart wrote:

I think the important thing to underscore is that the great RoW items are quest-loot, not loot drops. It important to have quest rewards that are satisfying and RoW is a very quest oriented expansion.

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But the thing is, and I know other people have mentioned this already, that the quest rewards in RotW aren't satisfying at all. Sure, it's fun to get practical and usefull stuff for completing the quests instead of "here, have another broken sandstat". But these items are nothing more than wall ornaments, decorations since you'd have to be insane to use them unless you have an ADK. Loose them, and you can't ever get another one (unless you're wealthy enough to buy them from other players, but in those cases you're most likely able to afford an ADK too).

Seems like pretty much most of the weapons we saw in CU testing is RotW rewards, and as thus they are useless as weapons. I wager that the missing weapons, armor and such we saw during CU testing will arrive as quest rewards in the future too, and that's no good. It's much better for the end consumer if the equipment is craftable. The quest rewards are more like instant gratification in that regard.

Oh, and I know this all was a bit off topic, but... Crafters need to get to craft the new items (and in mass quantities), or else we won't see people use them. That goes for shipwright too, and they are most likely hurt the most by the quest rewards in RotW, since the new ships are not quite as affected by decay as ground weapons and armor is...

Message Edited by Vicotnik on 05-11-2005 12:36 AM

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Thunderheart wrote:

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Palath wrote:

---

Thunderheart wrote:

---

Palath wrote:

---

Thunderheart wrote:

Just an FYI for Shipwrights. Crafted Engines and Capacitors should be getting stat increases across the board in the next live update. This should make it so that crafted versions of these ship components can be crafted at a higher quality than looted components.

---

This almost makes me want to subscribe again with my WS/Shipwright. I was very close to dropping SW a few months ago for this very reason. Crafted items should ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS be superior to looted items, except for a RARE occurrence on a loot (extremely rare). In other games, it's different mainly because crafting does not use up your COMBAT skill points. In this game, you have to sacrifice all the content of the game in order to craft. So we should definitely be rewarded.

I heard something about a very nice Carbine dropping in the new ROTW quests. I haven't checked into this myself to see what the stats are compared to crafted carbines, but I certainly hope it is not a superior item. Otherwise we'll be in the same boat we're in here.

Anyway... good news, TH. Thanks for the info!

---

There is a pretty good Carbine you can get on the RoW quests (along with some other nice items as well). As far as the new ships earnedon the RoWquests? They will remain that way. Looking to the future, players will get more items to craft and there will also be more quest/loot items - - it isn't going to be all one or all the other.

---

Thanks for the response, TH. I just want to clarify to make sure my point wasn't missed... I'm not saying that looted items shouldn't drop. I'm just saying that in a game where the crafting system is an option that you take in LIEU of a combat template, the reward should be that crafted items are ALWAYS superior to looted items.

Let's say you put one single carbine in the game as a loot drop. And let's say that particular cabine has better stats than the best standard crafted weapon. Who in their right mind wouldn't simply work at getting that quest complete, and get the looted carbine? Forget about the Weaponsmiths who have dedicated 50% of their template to CRAFTING? You talk about balance, right? This whole CU was supposed to be about balance? But points like this are not only overlooked... it seems that they are being stomped on until they hurt.

Again, I have NO problem with loot. I think loot is good. But for heaven's sake, don't make the best weapons (and/or other items) in the game a droppable item! If nothing else, just make it a schematic like you did in the old days. At least this still gives the crafters something worthwhile to do and accomplish.

---

The crafting system is certainly, "not an option". Crafters craft the vast majority of player used equipment in the game. Crafted items will always have a high value and so will some loot. Some crafted items will be better and some loot items will be better. Its never going to be an "either/or" situation. Sometimes great items will be craftable, sometimes they will be schematics and sometime they will be quest rewards.

I think the important thing to underscore is that the great RoW items are quest-loot, not loot drops. It important to have quest rewards that are satisfying and RoW is a very quest oriented expansion.

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Thunderheart wrote:

---

Palath wrote:

---

Thunderheart wrote:

---

Palath wrote:

---

Thunderheart wrote:

Just an FYI for Shipwrights. Crafted Engines and Capacitors should be getting stat increases across the board in the next live update. This should make it so that crafted versions of these ship components can be crafted at a higher quality than looted components.

---

This almost makes me want to subscribe again with my WS/Shipwright. I was very close to dropping SW a few months ago for this very reason. Crafted items should ALWAYS ALWAYS ALWAYS be superior to looted items, except for a RARE occurrence on a loot (extremely rare). In other games, it's different mainly because crafting does not use up your COMBAT skill points. In this game, you have to sacrifice all the content of the game in order to craft. So we should definitely be rewarded.

I heard something about a very nice Carbine dropping in the new ROTW quests. I haven't checked into this myself to see what the stats are compared to crafted carbines, but I certainly hope it is not a superior item. Otherwise we'll be in the same boat we're in here.

Anyway... good news, TH. Thanks for the info!

---

There is a pretty good Carbine you can get on the RoW quests (along with some other nice items as well). As far as the new ships earnedon the RoWquests? They will remain that way. Looking to the future, players will get more items to craft and there will also be more quest/loot items - - it isn't going to be all one or all the other.

---

Thanks for the response, TH. I just want to clarify to make sure my point wasn't missed... I'm not saying that looted items shouldn't drop. I'm just saying that in a game where the crafting system is an option that you take in LIEU of a combat template, the reward should be that crafted items are ALWAYS superior to looted items.

Let's say you put one single carbine in the game as a loot drop. And let's say that particular cabine has better stats than the best standard crafted weapon. Who in their right mind wouldn't simply work at getting that quest complete, and get the looted carbine? Forget about the Weaponsmiths who have dedicated 50% of their template to CRAFTING? You talk about balance, right? This whole CU was supposed to be about balance? But points like this are not only overlooked... it seems that they are being stomped on until they hurt.

Again, I have NO problem with loot. I think loot is good. But for heaven's sake, don't make the best weapons (and/or other items) in the game a droppable item! If nothing else, just make it a schematic like you did in the old days. At least this still gives the crafters something worthwhile to do and accomplish.

---

The crafting system is certainly, "not an option". Crafters craft the vast majority of player used equipment in the game. Crafted items will always have a high value and so will some loot. Some crafted items will be better and some loot items will be better. Its never going to be an "either/or" situation. Sometimes great items will be craftable, sometimes they will be schematics and sometime they will be quest rewards.

I think the important thing to underscore is that the great RoW items are quest-loot, not loot drops. It important to have quest rewards that are satisfying and RoW is a very quest oriented expansion.

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Buka_Starwalker wrote:

If you want to skip the whole DWB mess and see a Jetpack in the window of your local vendor then thats your choice. Time = money. Your too busy or lazy to farm it and some crafter get his hands on a rare schem the price you are paying should be in correlation to skipping all the content to get to the goods directly.

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