Shipwright Archive
Thread: Idea to balance the new ships & old ships, help Shipwrights and not nerf anything.
The balance issue has always been there. Before ROTW there was no ship that could match the A-wing in PvP, the problem is that you never really got to hear much about it. It is funny that reading this post and seeing how most people complaining about the imbalance always use and A or X wing as the base comparison. Who ever said that rebel ships should be the base for any comparison? I do agree that the is a small balance problems with the new ships not only for pilots but also for shipwrights as they do not get to craft these new awesome ships rendering their business useless, however, I am and always have been against nerfing somthing to match something else.
What could be done however, is improve the old ships to match the new standards. I am talking about all the old ships because the handling and acceleration of the POB ships (talking about the Nova, Decimator and YT-1300 here) is just ridiculus! Those ships are completely useless! even with a full crew and the new components those ships are too big and too clumsy to miss them in any type of combat. Now lets take the A wing... why instead of nerfing the Jedi starfighter, why dont you increase the stats of the A wing and add it a second weapon slot? That would pretty much take care of that balancing issue right there. Now for Privateers (Which I am) the best solution would be to decrease the profile size of the Dunelizzard to match that of the A-wing and match the stats accordingly. That would take care of all the PvP issues because no matter what you are, you have a balanced PvP for your faction.
I dont think the other ships are unbalancing (3 Heavy versions of old ships, ARC, and griveous, red Tie) just because you would already have a propper PvP at your disposal that you could use. The other ships would be used for fun or roleplay. Also, I do not think that anyone cares about PvE balance between factions because all factions have good PvE ships as it is.
The only problem left is the unbalance created for the Shipwrights with the new ships. For this, I think a new quest should be made for Shipwrights in which they get the Jedi Starfighter schematic so then that would even out the demand for PvP ships. The existing quest should work as it is (without the bugs of course ) but instead of giving you the deed for the fighter, Vader should just give you the certificate to use it. The reason for this is, that peopole will hardly use this ship outside of DS to prevent it's decay since they can only get it one time. This then would affect the the shipwrights business. The same logiccould be applied for the Y-8 mining ship. A quest for the schematic and keep the existing quest for the certificate to use it.
The rest of the new ships could stay as they are because that really does not bother many people. True, shipwrights do not get to make them, but those are ships that people would only adquire once as there are (or would be) better PvP and PvE ships around.
If the stats on the old ships are buffed up to the level of the new ones without significant hardware upgrades on the server side, space will be nearly unplayable.
Coran_Sienar wrote:
We're already having a LOT of problems introduced with RotW for the server tracking multiple clients. If you brought up the majority of the ships out there to Episode III starfighter performance levels, you will exacerbate the problem of hit detection by the server. Ever shoot an NPC only to have no damage effect? That happens because things are moving too fast for the server to be able to track.
If the stats on the old ships are buffed up to the level of the new ones without significant hardware upgrades on the server side, space will be nearly unplayable.
As for the new starfighters, they are indeed all overpowered. The new Light Duty Tie Fighter has (in a single stroke) invalidated all of the Ties until you get the Tie Oppressor. Sure, you could boost the stats of the other remaining ships, but then you'd run into problems with the server and nobody would play. Either way, you're looking at Shipwrights not being able to sell any chassis.
The arguments made on the Pilot forums are valid and you are not countering them very effectively. The main reason why very few people support you on buffing the old fighters to the level of the new is the fact that PvP would be ruined and ship roles would still not be addressed.
The A-Wing is NOT the best PvP ship, by the way. Sure it's a small target, but the Tie Interceptor, Tie Advanced and Dunelizard sport more maneuverable chassis stats, albeit by a small margin. The Tie Advanced with its two gun slots can one-shot an A-Wing if it is properly equipped. When I flew the A-Wing, I never achieved one-shot kills on anything, even with a RE'd level 8 gun. That's why I moved on to an X-Wing. Now, I fly the Tie Advanced. That ship is amazing. It has a good, small profile, is more maneuverable than an A-Wing and carries double the number of guns. If you loot enough, you can squeeze two RE'd boltdrivers into the Tie Advanced. That's a lot of firepower.
The Tie Advanced is balanced with the A-Wing. The T/A has a slightly larger hit box, but with double the guns, it more than makes up for it. Even if the A-Wing is packing a RE'd reward shield, it doesn't stand a chance of not being incapped in one hit, while it can't do the same to the T/A.
Now, you have two fighters (Jedi and Grievous) that have almost 50% more mass than either T/A or A-Wing with double the maneuverability and two gun slots. So the choices we have is:
1. EVERYONE who PvPs will gravitate towards the JSF or Grievous. (The server will have trouble dealing with the size and maneuverability of the new ships.)
or
2. Change the stats of the new ships to bring them in line with the old ones.
or
3. Change the stats of the old ships to bring them in line with the new ones without the appropriate server hardware upgrades to deal with it.
Because EVERYBODY here knows that there isn't going to be a server upgrade anytime soon.
I can take any argument you want and accept it except the one about the servers being too slow and not being capable of taking the load. That is SOE's problem and yes, you are paying for a service they are supposed to be delivering. Once again, that is another issue which is not this one. Anyways, if you happy with this being the issue and you still pay for a mediocrer product in which you have to slow down the ships because otherwise hte server cannot handle them then that is very sad. If I really thought that was the issue I would just cancel my account. maybe you are happy about slowing down the movement in space, I would like to speed it up if possible.
I don't think we're going to see the galaxy swarming with the new ships though, since they are sufficiently difficult to get that many players will just go with "cheaper" and easier to obtain chassis.
ajag wrote:I can take any argument you want and accept it except the one about the servers being too slow and not being capable of taking the load. That is SOE's problem and yes, you are paying for a service they are supposed to be delivering. Once again, that is another issue which is not this one. Anyways, if you happy with this being the issue and you still pay for a mediocrer product in which you have to slow down the ships because otherwise hte server cannot handle them then that is very sad. If I really thought that was the issue I would just cancel my account. maybe you are happy about slowing down the movement in space, I would like to speed it up if possible.
It's true of any internet game. Why do you think that there is a term called "Low Ping Bast***s" for any online shooter? What you're suggesting will only exacerbate the problems faced by JtL. Maybe Internet 2 can handle dataloads and latencies that would be required by bumping all of the stats up, but our current system can't. No amount of wishful thinking is going to change that.
And why do you insist on the greater workload that would be required to bring the other chassis up to the new fighter standards? Don't you remember what happened when the Firespray was bumped from 180K mass to 210K mass? The change was not retroactive to previously manufactured schematics or deeds. Sure, we shipwrights would make a killing with producing upgraded chasses for everyone, but it's inherently unfair to every single pilot out there.
Make no mistake about it. These new fighters are the new composite armor in space. Anyone who is a dedicated PvPer WILL expend the effort to get multiple copies. (Since they are given out in deed form, that doesn't profit Shipwrights one bit.) I'm leading an effort in my guild to nab as many of these new fighters as possible. And I'm sure that I'm not the only one out there. Mark my words, the vast majority of good pilots you encounter who PvP will be flying one of these fighters.
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