Scout Archive
Thread: Selling Hide/Bone A Follow Up
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TheFUna
Mon Oct 27, 2003 9:50 am
#1
The last time I posted on this subject I suggested that Malleability was the key stat in the actual quality/desirability for hide.
Some people tried to tell me I was wrong...but these silly things like crafting schematics tell me differently.
Others made some good points that Malleability might not be the ONLY statistic to look for. This was an excellent point made by a few people.
Here's the facts as they stand:
1) Overall Quality is not the sole basis for resource desirability in hide and bone. Every crafted item requires resources that have optimum values in certain statisitcs (as seen in the schematics). Overall quality is generally a secondary, less-important value than some other stat such as malleability.
2) Nearly all schematics I've seen involving hide/bone list malleability as more important than OQ -- sometimes they are equal in importance. Some schematics ONLY use OQ, some may even use other statistics. Most however, that I've seen, depend on hide/bone Malleability where higher values make far more of a difference to the outcome of a crafter item than OQ. I've even tested this using bone armor and malleability makes the most difference in experimentation and initial values. Additionally I have it on good authority that Malleability/OQ is pretty much the basis for all crafted items using bone/hide.
3) Some crafters, like architects, don't care about quality resources. They just want anything they can get their hands on for furniture.
What do we do about it?
If you are trying to sell bone and hide you need to find out what the crafters you will be selling to need. Do they need wooley hide? Do they need scaley hide? Do they need Avian bones? Do they just need any old bone/hide? Next find out what statistics are important and in what percentages according to the schematics. This means you will have to leech knowledge from a crafter (I'd be willing to look up what I can for the scouts here) and try to get schematics to look at (can Schematics be transferred between players?). There are web sites that list schematics but I don't have the URLs readily available. Check the Artisan or 'Smith's forums.
Once you learn what is needed, go "sample" it from the surrounding countryside. If you need Scaley hide for a schematic that lists it as Malleability 66%/Overall Quality 34% then you know you want to go find the highest Malleability because it will make the most difference to the crafted item. You'll want to find something with the highest OQ possible, but keep in mind Malleability in a schematic like this is twice as important. In this situation you want to focus on Malleability first, OQ second. Once you find what drops the best resources, hunt that critter into extinction harvesting ONLY the resource you need.
Selling Resources On The Bazaar:
Give up on getting "fair market value" for your hide/bone because you ain't gonna get it on the bazaar. Sell for 3-5 cr/unit and be thankful because there's always some jackass who will undersell you. I've taken to selling all my hide/bone for 3cr/u and only nudging it up to 4cr/u for the best resources. Hide and bone don't sell for more than 4 cr/unit on the bazaar on Bloodfin no matter what the quality. In the last 2 weeks since discovering OQ isn't the basis for crafting I've been attempting to sell hide based on Malleability/OQ and it is working just as well on the bazaar as basing it only on OQ...meaning its not working at all. The reason being, most crafters buying on the bazaar are buying to grind XP, not for quality. Let me repeat that for effect: most crafters buying on the bazaar are buying to grind XP, not for quality. Because of this they aren't going to pay us a fair market price. Armorsmiths and tailors generally have their own sources either thru private agreements, PA's or from resource vendors. The bazaar is not the place to get rich as a scout.
Private Sales:
If you want a "fair market value" for your resources then you really want to set up agreements with crafters. Find an armorsmith or tailor with specific needs and make a deal for sales and quantities. Join a guild that needs a scout to get resources for their crafters. I currently have a nice agreement with a Bio-Engineer for meat that sells for twice the price that I can get on the bazaar. From what I've found crafters will happily pay more for a steady supply of high quality resources. The bazaar and even resource vendors aren't always reliable enough for them and a scout that is willing to harvest animal resources and be reliable will make most crafters very happy to pay for.
So How Much To Charge?
Like I mentioned before, give up on making good money on the bazaar. The more I use it the more disgusted I get with the lowballing that is running rampant on Bloodfin. We have some guy in Keren, Naboo who is selling personal harvesters for 300cr and lowballing everyone else. Any hide/bone/meat I sell there is sold for 3cr/u and I don't worry about price based on quality because as I mentioned earlier, people looking for quality don't use the bazaar as much. The crafters who buy resources on the bazaar are generally looking for grinding XP and not looking for high quality hide/bone to make armor to sell for hundreds of thousands of credits. Couple this with the scumbags lowballing the rest of the population (for what reason I don't know because they can't be making money) and you have a difficult place to sell for "fair market value".
When making private sales/agreements the rule I'm starting to go by is getting an average of the important stats and dividing by 100 to get the cr/unit to sell by (minimum 3cr/u).
Lets say an armorsmith asks me to get him some hide of any type and the schematic calls for Malleability and Overall quality. I go out and find some Leathery hide at 912 malleability and 756 OQ. I would get the price using the following formula:
P = ((912 + 756) / 2) / 100
P = (1664 / 2) / 100
P = 832 / 100
P = 8.32
So my final price would be 8cr/u rounded to the nearest whole number.
So when you're out hunting remember that OQ is not the only stat to look at and is usually secondary to something else like Malleability; so keep that in mind. If you're bazaar-dependent for sales, you aren't going to fair prices because the people who want the quality resources don't use the bazaar as a general rule. The bazaar is a place to unload cheap hide/bone/meat to XP grinders and those who aren't concerned with resource quality like Architects and Bio-Engys. The best place to get good prices is thru private sales or setting up your own resource vendor; both of which can turn into a full time in-game job. Also keep in mind there's no easy answer for "how much do I charge for my hide?". It all depends on who wants it and for what purpose. One person's garbage hide might be worth its weight in gold to another crafter simply based on what their schematics call for. Scouts need to educate themselves on what is needed and in-demand when coming up with prices.
Some people tried to tell me I was wrong...but these silly things like crafting schematics tell me differently.
Others made some good points that Malleability might not be the ONLY statistic to look for. This was an excellent point made by a few people.
Here's the facts as they stand:
1) Overall Quality is not the sole basis for resource desirability in hide and bone. Every crafted item requires resources that have optimum values in certain statisitcs (as seen in the schematics). Overall quality is generally a secondary, less-important value than some other stat such as malleability.
2) Nearly all schematics I've seen involving hide/bone list malleability as more important than OQ -- sometimes they are equal in importance. Some schematics ONLY use OQ, some may even use other statistics. Most however, that I've seen, depend on hide/bone Malleability where higher values make far more of a difference to the outcome of a crafter item than OQ. I've even tested this using bone armor and malleability makes the most difference in experimentation and initial values. Additionally I have it on good authority that Malleability/OQ is pretty much the basis for all crafted items using bone/hide.
3) Some crafters, like architects, don't care about quality resources. They just want anything they can get their hands on for furniture.
What do we do about it?
If you are trying to sell bone and hide you need to find out what the crafters you will be selling to need. Do they need wooley hide? Do they need scaley hide? Do they need Avian bones? Do they just need any old bone/hide? Next find out what statistics are important and in what percentages according to the schematics. This means you will have to leech knowledge from a crafter (I'd be willing to look up what I can for the scouts here) and try to get schematics to look at (can Schematics be transferred between players?). There are web sites that list schematics but I don't have the URLs readily available. Check the Artisan or 'Smith's forums.
Once you learn what is needed, go "sample" it from the surrounding countryside. If you need Scaley hide for a schematic that lists it as Malleability 66%/Overall Quality 34% then you know you want to go find the highest Malleability because it will make the most difference to the crafted item. You'll want to find something with the highest OQ possible, but keep in mind Malleability in a schematic like this is twice as important. In this situation you want to focus on Malleability first, OQ second. Once you find what drops the best resources, hunt that critter into extinction harvesting ONLY the resource you need.
Selling Resources On The Bazaar:
Give up on getting "fair market value" for your hide/bone because you ain't gonna get it on the bazaar. Sell for 3-5 cr/unit and be thankful because there's always some jackass who will undersell you. I've taken to selling all my hide/bone for 3cr/u and only nudging it up to 4cr/u for the best resources. Hide and bone don't sell for more than 4 cr/unit on the bazaar on Bloodfin no matter what the quality. In the last 2 weeks since discovering OQ isn't the basis for crafting I've been attempting to sell hide based on Malleability/OQ and it is working just as well on the bazaar as basing it only on OQ...meaning its not working at all. The reason being, most crafters buying on the bazaar are buying to grind XP, not for quality. Let me repeat that for effect: most crafters buying on the bazaar are buying to grind XP, not for quality. Because of this they aren't going to pay us a fair market price. Armorsmiths and tailors generally have their own sources either thru private agreements, PA's or from resource vendors. The bazaar is not the place to get rich as a scout.
Private Sales:
If you want a "fair market value" for your resources then you really want to set up agreements with crafters. Find an armorsmith or tailor with specific needs and make a deal for sales and quantities. Join a guild that needs a scout to get resources for their crafters. I currently have a nice agreement with a Bio-Engineer for meat that sells for twice the price that I can get on the bazaar. From what I've found crafters will happily pay more for a steady supply of high quality resources. The bazaar and even resource vendors aren't always reliable enough for them and a scout that is willing to harvest animal resources and be reliable will make most crafters very happy to pay for.
So How Much To Charge?
Like I mentioned before, give up on making good money on the bazaar. The more I use it the more disgusted I get with the lowballing that is running rampant on Bloodfin. We have some guy in Keren, Naboo who is selling personal harvesters for 300cr and lowballing everyone else. Any hide/bone/meat I sell there is sold for 3cr/u and I don't worry about price based on quality because as I mentioned earlier, people looking for quality don't use the bazaar as much. The crafters who buy resources on the bazaar are generally looking for grinding XP and not looking for high quality hide/bone to make armor to sell for hundreds of thousands of credits. Couple this with the scumbags lowballing the rest of the population (for what reason I don't know because they can't be making money) and you have a difficult place to sell for "fair market value".
When making private sales/agreements the rule I'm starting to go by is getting an average of the important stats and dividing by 100 to get the cr/unit to sell by (minimum 3cr/u).
Lets say an armorsmith asks me to get him some hide of any type and the schematic calls for Malleability and Overall quality. I go out and find some Leathery hide at 912 malleability and 756 OQ. I would get the price using the following formula:
P = ((912 + 756) / 2) / 100
P = (1664 / 2) / 100
P = 832 / 100
P = 8.32
So my final price would be 8cr/u rounded to the nearest whole number.
So when you're out hunting remember that OQ is not the only stat to look at and is usually secondary to something else like Malleability; so keep that in mind. If you're bazaar-dependent for sales, you aren't going to fair prices because the people who want the quality resources don't use the bazaar as a general rule. The bazaar is a place to unload cheap hide/bone/meat to XP grinders and those who aren't concerned with resource quality like Architects and Bio-Engys. The best place to get good prices is thru private sales or setting up your own resource vendor; both of which can turn into a full time in-game job. Also keep in mind there's no easy answer for "how much do I charge for my hide?". It all depends on who wants it and for what purpose. One person's garbage hide might be worth its weight in gold to another crafter simply based on what their schematics call for. Scouts need to educate themselves on what is needed and in-demand when coming up with prices.
JBMat
Mon Oct 27, 2003 6:59 pm
#2
Math sucks, so I use a simpler method. I got a boatload of hide, I sell most to Tailors who cut me discounts or give me free mod'd clothes, maybe 2.5 cpu. Some I put on the bazaar, to help the middle people, at 3 or 4 cpu. The rest I give away to the noobs struggling for material and XP.
Lookit, no math involved.
I quit selling meat as everyone was whining they did not want what I had....instead I was spozed to go risk my happy azz and kill giant bohemian snot monsters on some stupid planet to harvest the high this and that meat they drop. Screw that. You want what I got or ya don't. Someone will take it, at a fair price.
Oh yeah, I have about 500k in the bank, a house, 3 harvestors, 2 wind gennies and a very expensive weapons habit I must feed.
My method works, I don't get a headache doing any math problems, and the last time I even looked at hide stats was over a month ago.
JB
next, I sell the stockpile of minerals I have at the house, architects love me
Bermag
Tue Oct 28, 2003 4:53 am
#3
Best is to check with armoursmith, Tailors and Architects which stats they want. Armoursmiths is the most important group to target, but will usually only be interested in hides with high stats (at least for masters; others might buy for grinding)
In general Wooly hide is in high demand from armoursmiths, but also from architects and tailors. As will buy the good wolly the other the crappy :-)
I had some great Wooly which I got paid 15 cpu for.
On my server Wooly sells faster than any other hide. I usually price them 4-7 (and 10 or higher for real good Wooly).
If your hide doesn't sell in 2-3 days price is usually to high or there is some better hide out so people buy those instead.
In general Wooly hide is in high demand from armoursmiths, but also from architects and tailors. As will buy the good wolly the other the crappy :-)
I had some great Wooly which I got paid 15 cpu for.
On my server Wooly sells faster than any other hide. I usually price them 4-7 (and 10 or higher for real good Wooly).
If your hide doesn't sell in 2-3 days price is usually to high or there is some better hide out so people buy those instead.
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