Scout Archive

Holo,

I'm sending you this message, and coping it via email to both GreenMarine, Q and Xahn (I am aware that they are all away) and posting it (in an effort to broker more transparent communications with the community) on both the , SWG Dicussion, Scout and Ranger forums. I know that this isn't the correct protocol for submitting correspondent reports, but I'm getting concerned with the on-going harvesting situation with the Rangers and Scouts, and possibly the whole crafting system in general.

The recent update included the change to the 60% system. GreenMarine knows I was for this, as we discussed it two months ago during the period where direct Dev/Correspondent contact was okay.

I know that you are looking into the pet grouped bug, but I must stress to you that there's another bug that I hope you have noticed.

Holo, you said in your post that GreenMarine confirmed that there was a "slight" reduction in the across the board harvesting rates. Constant testing by the Scouts and Rangers has confirmed for me that this reduction was NOT slight - it was a nearly 40% to 50% reduction across the board. This couple with the Grouped pet bug that you have all acknowledged, as well as the implementation of the 60% rule has resulted in a significant reduction in the amount of harvested materials available for Scouts to sell and Rangers to crafters, which has cut into our ability to make money severely. It is also beginning to cut into the crafting abilities of those reliant on our services - Medics, Artisans, etc.

Here are some actual statistics that the Scouts and Rangers have assembled that illustrate this problem:

Feral Bantha:
Pre-patch: 40 units (fat)
Post-patch solo: 24 units (fat)
Post-patch group: 16 units (fat)

Giant Sand Beetle:
Pre-patch: 120 units (fat)
Post-patch solo: 64 units (fat)
Post-patch group: 42 units (fat)

Giant Baz Nitches:
Pre-Patch: 104 hides (Average)
Post-patch solo: 57 hides (Average)
Post-patch group: 36 hides (Average)

Now while I fully recognize the reasoning behind the reduction - you don't want to destroy the market for harvestable materials by flooding it, the effect of the reduction (which I believe is bugged), couple with the group bug is resulting in the beginnings of a decline in the perceived amount of harvestable materials on the servers. You are, of course, in a better position to confirm if this is indeed taking place - I respectfully ask that you check on this and let the community, either directly or through me, know the results. If this perception is not the reality, having this information would be important.

In an effort to determine a means of making the changes viable, as I still believe the 60% to be necessary, I would respectfully request the following changes to resolve the situation:

1.) Return the solo harvesting amounts to their pre-patch levels.
2.) Repair the group harvesting bug with pets and NPCs.
3.) Increase the cost of crafting items for all crafting professions.

#3 adds the needed sinks to remove the increased amount of harvestable materials from the game. They are transformed into finished goods and sold, letting the in-game economy set the price. This coupled with your on-going plans to introduce decay to clothing should negate the need for a reduction in the amount of material able to be harvested. It also requires less tweaking in the code from your end, and can be easily implemented.

I admit that I underestimated the community's desire to be able to solo while harvesting. But I still believe that the 60% change is a good one for the low level Scout making his way up through the ranks.

If you permit the bug to remain, I believe we will begin to see a breakdown in the game economy. Scouts and Rangers will soon give up selling bone and hide, as they need all they can harvest to make their own traps and camps (the costs of which were increased with the latest patch). This creates a deficit that will make it nearly impossible for the crafting professions that rely on large quantities of harvested materials - primarily Doctors and Armorsmiths - to remain in business for long. This could have devastating consequences for the in-game economy.

I apologize for the length of this message, but I feel it needed to be this long to explain fully our concerns. I cannot stress enough how critical it is that this issue be resolved. I know that the timing here is not great with everyone on vacation, but I want to be 100% sure that this issue is on your radar screen and that you are actively working to remedy it.

I continue to value the work that you are doing, and hope to continue to work with all of you and the rest of the design team in the future.

Respectfully,

Holo,

I'm sending you this message, and coping it via email to both GreenMarine, Q and Xahn (I am aware that they are all away) and posting it (in an effort to broker more transparent communications with the community) on both the , SWG Dicussion, Scout and Ranger forums. I know that this isn't the correct protocol for submitting correspondent reports, but I'm getting concerned with the on-going harvesting situation with the Rangers and Scouts, and possibly the whole crafting system in general.

The recent update included the change to the 60% system. GreenMarine knows I was for this, as we discussed it two months ago during the period where direct Dev/Correspondent contact was okay.

I know that you are looking into the pet grouped bug, but I must stress to you that there's another bug that I hope you have noticed.

Holo, you said in your post that GreenMarine confirmed that there was a "slight" reduction in the across the board harvesting rates. Constant testing by the Scouts and Rangers has confirmed for me that this reduction was NOT slight - it was a nearly 40% to 50% reduction across the board. This couple with the Grouped pet bug that you have all acknowledged, as well as the implementation of the 60% rule has resulted in a significant reduction in the amount of harvested materials available for Scouts to sell and Rangers to crafters, which has cut into our ability to make money severely. It is also beginning to cut into the crafting abilities of those reliant on our services - Medics, Artisans, etc.

Here are some actual statistics that the Scouts and Rangers have assembled that illustrate this problem:

Feral Bantha:
Pre-patch: 40 units (fat)
Post-patch solo: 24 units (fat)
Post-patch group: 16 units (fat)

Giant Sand Beetle:
Pre-patch: 120 units (fat)
Post-patch solo: 64 units (fat)
Post-patch group: 42 units (fat)

Giant Baz Nitches:
Pre-Patch: 104 hides (Average)
Post-patch solo: 57 hides (Average)
Post-patch group: 36 hides (Average)

Now while I fully recognize the reasoning behind the reduction - you don't want to destroy the market for harvestable materials by flooding it, the effect of the reduction (which I believe is bugged), couple with the group bug is resulting in the beginnings of a decline in the perceived amount of harvestable materials on the servers. You are, of course, in a better position to confirm if this is indeed taking place - I respectfully ask that you check on this and let the community, either directly or through me, know the results. If this perception is not the reality, having this information would be important.

In an effort to determine a means of making the changes viable, as I still believe the 60% to be necessary, I would respectfully request the following changes to resolve the situation:

1.) Return the solo harvesting amounts to their pre-patch levels.
2.) Repair the group harvesting bug with pets and NPCs.
3.) Increase the cost of crafting items for all crafting professions.

#3 adds the needed sinks to remove the increased amount of harvestable materials from the game. They are transformed into finished goods and sold, letting the in-game economy set the price. This coupled with your on-going plans to introduce decay to clothing should negate the need for a reduction in the amount of material able to be harvested. It also requires less tweaking in the code from your end, and can be easily implemented.

I admit that I underestimated the community's desire to be able to solo while harvesting. But I still believe that the 60% change is a good one for the low level Scout making his way up through the ranks.

If you permit the bug to remain, I believe we will begin to see a breakdown in the game economy. Scouts and Rangers will soon give up selling bone and hide, as they need all they can harvest to make their own traps and camps (the costs of which were increased with the latest patch). This creates a deficit that will make it nearly impossible for the crafting professions that rely on large quantities of harvested materials - primarily Doctors and Armorsmiths - to remain in business for long. This could have devastating consequences for the in-game economy.

I apologize for the length of this message, but I feel it needed to be this long to explain fully our concerns. I cannot stress enough how critical it is that this issue be resolved. I know that the timing here is not great with everyone on vacation, but I want to be 100% sure that this issue is on your radar screen and that you are actively working to remedy it.

I continue to value the work that you are doing, and hope to continue to work with all of you and the rest of the design team in the future.

Respectfully,

Another clear example of why grouping in Star Wars Galaxies is not a good idea at this particular time in the games development. Thanks, Delta. Cheers

As usual, smart, concise, and logical. You have addressed what I feel is genuinely the #1 current concern with rangers (#2 seems conceal/maskscent and #3 seems to be tracking tweaks).

Pretty impressive for an imp.

Good letter. I completely agree with all of this. Good job, Delta.

good job. hopefully the current rash of new scouts will get the message that the reductions in solo harvesting is due to a bug and not a nerf. it also appears that the group harvest is affected by this bug too because those harvests appear to be about 60% of the new solo harvests. we have had to weather worse and things will get fixed. overall the scout and ranger professions have been improved which is what we all wanted to see. thanks for your efforts. hopefully the whining in the boards will stop soon and maybe i will come back and post more often, but until then you will only see me around here occasionally. take care and good hunting.

Great letter Delta.You accurately described the situtation, gave them the communities consensus, and offered ideasonrealistic (as far as we know)solutions. You also managed to do this in a firm but professional matter. Thanks for your good work on all of our behalves.

Delta,

I applaud your valiant attempt at trying to fix the issue of ninja-harvesting with the 60% rule, but I feel that it was not the optimum solution.

I would like to refer you back to your own post at http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=ranger&message.id=12063and DavidJP1234's suggestion at the bottom of page 1 (not perfect, but almost there)

The optimum solution in my mind is to put a set amount of totalresources on each critter (pre-patch amount seems appropriate, but may need some slight adjustment)and have each scout in the group able to pull their share if there is that much left. So 10novice scouts can get 100% of the creature.Novicescout gets one attempt and gets 10% of the amount on the creature, Master Scouts maybe get 2 attempts (2nd attempt is the skill granted at Master level or a wookie at Hunt3 or 4)and can get 50% of each of 2 resources, on up to Master Ranger getting to /harvestall and gettting everything available (all the hide, meat, and bone available if they wish to do that) or 3 attempts possible but can choose not to take the bone if it's low quality and they dont want to carry it or have no market to sell it. If I'm grouped as Master Ranger, I'm going to wait until any scouts in my group are done harvesting and thencarve out the last of the resources once they are done. I'm sure the numbers need adjusting, but I'm sure you get the drift.

Delta,

Have you read my post about fixing the amount of resources per creature and having there be a set amount of attempts that can be made per creature with a delay in between the same person being able to harvest a second time. This way the total resources gathered per creature would be the same regardless of whether one person or five people harvest it. Here is the post:

http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=ranger&message.id=12261

Please consider this as a suggestion to the devs. I think all of the comments on it so far have been positive. I think if more people consider it they will support it. It is a logical solution that i believe addresses all of the issues I have heard mentioned on the topic. Plust it adds some realism and atmosphere into the game. I would not mind putting in the time to harvest a creature completely even if it took me a few minutes to do it if the payoff was that I would get a good quantity off it.

Thank you

"1.) Return the solo harvesting amounts to their pre-patch levels."

Thank you!!! As a scout who generally solos, I really appreciate this. I don't get to play long enough to get in a group, and this makes a big difference. I'm all for splitting the resources for a group, but this should not have ever affected the solo scout. Keep up the good work!

I've read through a few forums and you still seem to be the best corespondent out there Delta. Keep up the great work.

This is good Delta. Thank you very much for doing your best to convey a rather impacting change for the game. I agree with your suggestions completely. The group reduction is fine, the solo harvesting needs to be looked at.

Just to through a little more data at it. I have been grouping a lot lately, since a few days before the update. I am hunting animals and harvesting like a mad man. Since I'm grouping that means I'm experiencing the 40% reduction, just as if I was solo. Also, because I'm grouped, we are killing more animals per minute as if I were solo.

With the amount of hides and bones and meat I'm harvesting, I have yet to sell any resources on the bazaar for the last couple of weeks. I am going through my resources pretty quick just keeping my traps stocked up. I used a lot to make me a stash of camo kits. I am getting a surplus, but very very slowly. When most scouts and rangers won't put a stack smaller then 100-200 on the bazaar, it's hard and slow to get that amount of surplus.

Hopefully that makes sence.

LastEE,

Thank you for mentioning my post I am glad you appreciate the idea of fixed resources per creature. It is definately a logical conclusion to come to. However it would seem that if there is actually a fixed amount, then one person should be able to get at that entire amount all by themselves whether they are in a group or not. That is why i proposed the delay in between attempts but allow the same person to harvest over and over until the thing is cleaned. Without that addition, if there is only one novice scout in the group he can only get 10% of the resources. What happened to the rest? Doesnt it make sense that if no one else wants any that he should be able to go back and get more? If you saying that 9 other novice scouts could each find 10% of the meat if they were to try why cant the first scout get that meat if no one else wants it? If it is truly fixed then the amount gathered should not depend on the number of people harvesting only the skill of the people and the time. Because lower skilled people will get less per attempt but still use up one of the set amount ofattempts. This is to represent that they waste some.

One master ranger grouped or solo should be able to get 100% of the resources off a creature by harvesting multiple times.

Thank you