Rifleman Archive

Thread: COver: What does it do?

Major_Kem_Monnon
Sat Mar 27, 2004 6:50 pm
#1

So it´s not even so more "cover"-points make concealshot better, lessens the chance the mob detects you?



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Kem Monnon, SFR - Sunfall Rebels

"Sorry, sweetheart. We haven't got time for anything else." --Han to Leia
Lieshi
Wed Apr 07, 2004 10:35 pm
#2

How does this mod function? Additional defense against all ranged defense attacks? Or only against specific rifleman attacks? Adds an offensive bonus for rifleman? Is it a general mod functioning all the time, or only with a rifle or ranged wepaon in hand?


Many thanks in advance your reply.
HeavyMG
Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:31 am
#3

well, we aren't really sure what exactly its supposed to do yet. So far it doesn't really do anything except eat loads of action and fail alot.
lmz
Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:34 am
#4






Lieshi wrote:

How does this mod function? Additional defense against all ranged defense attacks? Or only against specific rifleman attacks? Adds an offensive bonus for rifleman? Is it a general mod functioning all the time, or only with a rifle or ranged wepaon in hand?


Many thanks in advance your reply.






Gets you killed if you actually have any faith that it works.



Ciba Blue / StarSider
Gimperial666
Thu Apr 08, 2004 11:56 am
#5

I think it helps concealshot... ummm not sure though ... i think its broken



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Major_Kem_Monnon
Thu Apr 08, 2004 5:50 pm
#6

So it´s not even so more "cover"-points make concealshot better, lessens the chance the mob detects you?



-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Kem Monnon, SFR - Sunfall Rebels

"Sorry, sweetheart. We haven't got time for anything else." --Han to Leia
Sotaudi
Fri Apr 09, 2004 12:25 am
#7






Lieshi wrote:

How does this mod function? Additional defense against all ranged defense attacks? Or only against specific rifleman attacks? Adds an offensive bonus for rifleman? Is it a general mod functioning all the time, or only with a rifle or ranged wepaon in hand?


Many thanks in advance your reply.






You appear to be asking about the +80 to Cover we eventually get by Master rather than the /TakeCover skill we get in Rifles in Marksman as the other replies have spoken to. From what I can tell, the Cover mod simply increases the chance that you will take cover when using the /TakeCover command. As Allakhazam puts it, it "Increases your chance of effectively taking cover." So, in that sense, the two issues are related.


So, it helps you get into cover (and may even make cover itself more effective). Since /TakeCover is a rifleman skill, you should need to have a rifle equiped to do it. TakeCover simply adds to your ranged defenses. It does not, as many people assume, make you harder to see. It, therefore, would help against any ranged attacks. However, rifleman has specific attacks against cover. /Strafeshot1 and /Strafeshot2 are designed to break the target's cover. Strafeshot also has a delay effect, but it only delays the target IF they were in cover. Finally, since it only helps you use /TakeCover, it is only used when you issue the /TakeCover command.


Now, that all sounds good, but as you can see from the other posts, most Riflemen do not use it. It can take two, three, or more tries to get into cover. Each try uses HAM which, since you are prone, you cannot heal. Also, most mobs in the game use melee attacks. Even NPCs tend to prefer melee. Thus, using /TakeCover (unless you use Concealshot to help prevent detection) only invites extra damage because you are more vulnerable to melee attacks when prone. In PvP, being prone, let alone wasting time to get into cover, is a virtual death sentence. And even if that was not the case, in the end, most people do not really notice any real reduction in damage when they are in cover vs. when they are out. Therefore, most try it, but most also quickly quit using it. The only shot that requires cover is Surpriseshot, and even that does not appear to be the case right now. People report that Surpriseshot works whether in cover or out.







Sotaudi Crestlighter
Master Rifleman / Master Combat Medic
"The Physician's Pain Reference"

Former Professions
Master Doctor | Master Swordsman | Master Brawler
Master Scout | Ranger



beamstalk
Fri Apr 09, 2004 12:37 am
#8

Sotaudi nailed it on the head as usual. I have had to explain so many times that /takecover and concealshot are not related. Trying to help new riflemen in my guild and all fo them continue to insist they need /takecover to concealshoot. Sometimes it makes me want to run my head into a brick wall. What I tell them is /takecover does nothing do not use it, concealshot works on it's own without /takecover. The reply I usually get, so I use /takecover then concealshot and the mobs won't see me. This is atleast once a week I have this conversation.


so to summarize:




/takecover = USELESS



Kel-jun
Master Rifleman
Dark Blade - PA
Flurry
Thrawn caught his eye; and to Pellaeon's astonishment, the Grand Admiral smiled. "But," he whispered, "it was so artistically done."
Lightningflier
Fri Apr 09, 2004 6:00 am
#9

I am a new rifleman, and I have a question regarding concealshot. Is there a mod that specifically lowers my chance of detection while using it on a mob? The mod in the first tree says it lowers chance of detection by mobs that are around the attacked mob, but says nothing about the mob being attacked.
Barb-Wire
Fri Apr 09, 2004 6:58 am
#10






Major_Kem_Monnon wrote:
So it´s not even so more "cover"-points make concealshot better, lessens the chance the mob detects you?







nope cover has nothing to do with concealshot. the ONLY thing that affects concealshot is /aim and your rifle accuracy mod. cover only affects your defenses against ranged attacks.


cover is useful only if you KNOW the NPC your shooting is not going to close the distance and pummel you and even then running in small circles is a better defense than using the cover skill. so if you like taking cloner rides then use cover. it speeds up your trips to the cloners.




Created Account July 2003 - Canceled account Nov 2005. The NGE made me do it.
Barb Wire
Former Dark Force Wielder
Ex-Imperial Navy
Sotaudi
Fri Apr 09, 2004 6:12 pm
#11






Major_Kem_Monnon wrote:
So it´s not even so more "cover"-points make concealshot better, lessens the chance the mob detects you?







Nope. The + to cover only makes cover more effective. Since cover has nothing to do with concealment, it has nothing to do with the mob detecting you. Think in terms of getting behind a log or a rock to make it harder for someone to shoot you, not like putting on cammo to make you harder to see.


There is a Rifle Concealment Chance mod that was added a few months back. This probably helps concealshot in that you should be harder to see with a higher Concealment chance mod, but the purpose of this mod is to make it easier for a rifleman to single pull creatures. So it likely has more to do with interfering with the mobs friends from seeing you once it aggros than anything else.


But, no, cover has nothing to do with being hidden.


The things that help you remain undetected are: Posture (the lower the better) and distance (the further the better) and accurate aim. You are harder to detect kneeling that standing and harder still when prone. You are harder to detect the further out you are. You need to be at least 40m out. Closer is almost certain detection even prone. Better still, be in the 50 - 60m range. But you also want to be near your weapon's ideal range. If you miss twice, you will get detected.


So if you are prone at 50 - 60m and do not miss, Concealshot should work reasonably well. Missing and random bleeds (which can occur with any shot) are your main worrys at that point.




Sotaudi Crestlighter
Master Rifleman / Master Combat Medic
"The Physician's Pain Reference"

Former Professions
Master Doctor | Master Swordsman | Master Brawler
Master Scout | Ranger



Ackehece
Sat Apr 10, 2004 3:14 pm
#12

take cover does appear to help when doing Factional missions - as most targets (say 98%) use ranged attacks. It seems to make them miss about 50% more often when you are in a covered state. But - one cavet - when you are in cover... the highest ranking factional enemy will usually at that point pull out a t-21 and strafe 2 you... thus delaying you and doing insane damage to you (i have been hit for over 9000damage by advanced strafe and delayed 20 secs....) of course the delay did not matter as I was incapped and very shortly there after terminated.



"And these blast points, too accurate for Sandpeople. Only
Imperial Stormtroopers are so precise"
Rifleman Correspondent | Galactic Senator from Naboo
Ackehece - Eclipse | Tife - TestCenter




[--Riflewoman are all about sex drugs and rock and roll --]
Encoded as per Garva




Thecker
Tue Apr 13, 2004 12:34 pm
#13

I use take cover in place of prone in the extremely rare cases when I feel like going prone.


Actually I got the most use out of prone grinding pistols(did not takecover of course). I found that at a certain point in your advancement you could(often) take out mobs without being detected. which grinding pistols solo, made it alot easier to deal with them.


Basically I agree wether it works or not, it's virtually useless, I'd normally much rather depend on running around.


Sometimes like on faction msns it kinda fun to take cover and sneak up to them but thats more like roleplaying then doing something that makes sense hehe.






Colonel Thecker Goodheart
GTB
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