Rifleman Archive

/* Grandpa sits back in his rocker, a far away gleam in his eye. In a voice wizend with age, hebegins recalling the way things used to be... */

Back in the old days, those bleeds completely ignoredthe resists and armor protection of the target beastie. I remember being able to get up to 3K bleeds with a lucky shot... each tick... and then I would walk to school barefoot in the snow.. uphill both ways...

Now, of course, the resists and the armor protection are factored in, and of course the bleeds don't stack.
No more easy outs....

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WayneInAustin wrote:

/* Grandpa sits back in his rocker, a far away gleam in his eye. In a voice wizend with age, hebegins recalling the way things used to be... */

Back in the old days, those bleeds completely ignoredthe resists and armor protection of the target beastie. I remember being able to get up to 3K bleeds with a lucky shot... each tick... and then I would walk to school barefoot in the snow.. uphill both ways...

Now, of course, the resists and the armor protection are factored in, and of course the bleeds don't stack.
No more easy outs....

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"WayneInRestHome" is right. Bleeds used to bypass armor and resistances, so whatever your combat window damage was ended up being the bleed tick. The first shot would simply register the size of the bleed without doing any real damage. Then, every 20 seconds thereafter, that much damage would be ticked off for the duration of the bleed. This gave bleeds that were not reduced by armor, but also bleeds that could damage targets that were immune to your damage type.

But bleeds now factor in armor and resists as Wayne mentions.But the nerf went beyond just factoring in armor and resists. We know this to be true, because if all that happened was that armor and resists were factored in, we would still be getting bleeds huge bleeds on somethings. For instance:

Let us say I take my T21 and shoot a target that is unarmored and has 5% energy resists. Mindshot 2 has a 2x damage modifier. So if I get a 500 point damage roll, my combat window damage would be: 500 * 1.5 * 2 = 1,500. Before the nerf, this would have been the size of the bleed. But if armor and resists are all that is added in, I would get 1,500 * 1.95 * .95 = 2,779. When is the last time you saw a 2,779 bleed tick? The actualbleed will be far less, so they are doing something besides simply factoring armor and resists in now because bleeds are oftenmore in the 100 - 200 range.

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Barb-Wire wrote:
bleeds are also now worthless best i can get with my krayt T21 is about a 125-150 bleed. so i just use it for single pulling.

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Bleeds are not entirely worthless because they changed it so that the initial hit does real damage. It just depends on how long it is going to take to kill your target. Let us assume that you shoot a target and get a 500 point damage roll. For Headshot2, this would result in a Combat window number of: 500 * 1.5 * 2.5 = 1,875. For Headshot3, it would result in: 500 * 1.5 * 3.0 = 2,250.

Now, Mindshot2 bleeds may be weak, but it now does intial damage. So that same roll would be: 500 * 1.5 * 2 = 1,500 for Mindshot2 on the initial hit.

However, taking the low end of your experience and assuming a 125 point bleed, if the fight lasts the full 9 bleed ticks (3 minutes), Mindshot2 will do an additional 1,125 damage, meaning it will out peform Headshot2 by 750 damage and Headshot3 by 375 damage. In fact, the breakeven point for Headshot2 would be at 3 bleed ticks (1 minute) and, for Headshot3, 6 bleed ticks (2 minutes). After that, Mindshot2 starts to out peform either shot. And the kicker is, it uses the same HAM as Headshot2. So if you are using Headshot2s, and you expect the fight to last more than 1 minute or if you are using Headshot3s and you expect the fight to last more than 2 minutes, there is no reason to not make Mindshot2 your initial shot.

Of course, it depends on whether or not the above hit achieved even that 125 bleed. Since I have not seen any data on how it calculates the actual bleed now, it may be more or less than what I indicate above, but, either way, it is likely close to that. Therefore, bleeds may have been nerfed badly, but they are not entirely useless in a long fight.

Message Edited by Sotaudi on 04-02-2004 03:58 PM

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WayneInAustin wrote:
Excellent response Sotaudi! ...well except for that "WayneInRestHome" thing.....

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