Rifleman Archive

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Onichi wrote:

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Barb-Wire wrote:
this change was on TC about 3 months ago but was yanked from actually going live because it was too restrictive in some aspects and the way they did it made certain attack styles godly. whatever we see for ham chamges will be a pale reflection of this method. if any of that idea actually surfaces again i will be surprised

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I remember seeing that too, it'll be interesting to see what happens.. I only hope it all works well.

Personally I can't see why a "Specials" bar can't be implemented, like the Force Bar for Jedi.. Would that be so hard?

You can't heal it

It can still depend on your Secondary stats as to how much specials cost and its regen rates, or you could have a set amount of time for each special cost to regenerate ( i.e. 25 seconds ) to stop infinite spamming of specials.

It can't be damaged from attacks

It's really only the amount of Points the "Specials" bar would contain that I can see as being a problem, would everyones be the same ( 1000 ) or would it be the average of your Primary Stat bar's etc... Sorry to go a little off topic there

But yes, if the T.C Changes come through to Live i think it will help us a bit rather than hinder us.

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Onichi,

I don't know if you've posted that idea for the dev'sbefore, but it's a unique idea. I hope it's been tossed around as a posiblity. Haven't given it much thought yet, but it sounds like a very "evening" fix.

Regarding the extra "specials" bar :Wouldn't it make wearing ridiculously encumbering/high resist armor the best method? You put this ultra 80% resists all 700 encumb armor on, reduce your HAM to next-to-nothing, throw everything into secondaries, get all buffed up, and then head out to battle?

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Sotaudi wrote:
The only problem with the idea of a specials bar is that specials actually deduct from all three bars right now. Weapons have stats for each HAM bar, and specials have multipliers for each. I think that going from this method to a single "specials" bar would be a major rewrite of the game dynamics.

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I agree...

SWG should have had a special (mana, mp, whatever) bar from the start, but it's not going to happen now. I mean they can't even figure out the Imperial Hat model for christs sake

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Sotaudi wrote:
The only problem with the idea of a specials bar is that specials actually deduct from all three bars right now. Weapons have stats for each HAM bar, and specials have multipliers for each. I think that going from this method to a single "specials" bar would be a major rewrite of the game dynamics.

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Yeah, it would be a major rewrite of the code.. It's more wishful thinking that anything else . I personally think the Devs in going for a unique solution in how specials worked over-complicated things a bit too much to start with, and now when they have to balance it are really struggling a bit.

But as far as the HAM costs go, it would still work like it does now... Headshot3 that takes a whopping -183 Mind to shoot would no longer come out of your Mind pool but out of your Specials bar ( add the other HAM costs in ther as well ) and have it regen back within 25 seconds.. But who am I to argue, I just play the game as best I can hehe!

I'll keep hoping / praying / sacrificing lambs for the Combat Revamp to work and work well.

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Brahn-Cholo wrote:

Uhhh you are looking at thisa bitwrong........... This hurts us a little bit, but in no way helps us. And i will tell you why.....

Tell me why riflemen can rally off shot after shot using the mind pool for specials??? Moun Gold....

Moun Gold gives us the ability to Rally our shots off and spam... and then it regens fast due to our Focus and Willpower being jacked up!! so basically it seems as though our Mind Pool never drops below 1000

With this new system....our mind pool will never regen.... and we will be forced to slow our spams down being that each shot will actually effect our mind..... Moun Gold will not be as much of a factor if this is instated. It will still help...just not as much as it does now.

think about it like this.... (The way it is now): You take a shot...costs you 69-90 Mind....half of that gets regained by the time you shoot next shot....cuz of moun gold and focus and will being so jacked up. so now you are at 1360 mind outta 1400 (for example).

(the way it is proposed to work): You take a shot for 69-90 Mind cost........ you are knocked down to 1320... 40 points less. And you dont gain it back...cuz moun is not a factor anymore.... Next shot...same deal...in 6 shots you have taken off 420 mind pool points and are now at a mind pool of 980........(if our mind isn't damaged by opponents shot.) And you DONT get this back......

So, the way it is now....we shoot 6 shots and are at a mind pool regens a bit and sits at 1200.........220 points higher....with a chance of getting it back.....fast. vs the proposed way.....our Mind is now at 980....and only getting lower as we shoot more.

NOw do i think it balances out the battling?? sure i do. And it could bea good way of helping out PvP fighting. But i dont think it helps nor hurts us. I think it just flat out balances everything out.

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Brahn-Cholo wrote:

Uhhh you are looking at thisa bitwrong........... This hurts us a little bit, but in no way helps us. And i will tell you why.....

Tell me why riflemen can rally off shot after shot using the mind pool for specials??? Moun Gold....

Moun Gold gives us the ability to Rally our shots off and spam... and then it regens fast due to our Focus and Willpower being jacked up!! so basically it seems as though our Mind Pool never drops below 1000

With this new system....our mind pool will never regen.... and we will be forced to slow our spams down being that each shot will actually effect our mind..... Moun Gold will not be as much of a factor if this is instated. It will still help...just not as much as it does now.

think about it like this.... (The way it is now): You take a shot...costs you 69-90 Mind....half of that gets regained by the time you shoot next shot....cuz of moun gold and focus and will being so jacked up. so now you are at 1360 mind outta 1400 (for example).

(the way it is proposed to work): You take a shot for 69-90 Mind cost........ you are knocked down to 1320... 40 points less. And you dont gain it back...cuz moun is not a factor anymore.... Next shot...same deal...in 6 shots you have taken off 420 mind pool points and are now at a mind pool of 980........(if our mind isn't damaged by opponents shot.) And you DONT get this back......

So, the way it is now....we shoot 6 shots and are at a mind pool regens a bit and sits at 1200.........220 points higher....with a chance of getting it back.....fast. vs the proposed way.....our Mind is now at 980....and only getting lower as we shoot more.

NOw do i think it balances out the battling?? sure i do. And it could bea good way of helping out PvP fighting. But i dont think it helps nor hurts us. I think it just flat out balances everything out.

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I disagree on a couple of counts. First, the major benefit of muon is not the boost to willpower (regen rate) but to focus (reduces HAM costs). You can spam more shots on muon than off because your specials costs are greatly reduced. They recover faster becuase there is less to recover. Even so, if you are seeing no HAM loss primarily due to focus, it is because you are firing slow enough for willpower to have time to recover it. At Master, you are firing so fast that the most important thing is to get to the point that the special does not cost you much if anything, because it is not going to be likely that you can recover as fast as you are shooting.

Second, our biggest problem is that our primary HAM cost is unhealable. This puts us at a disadvantage because other professions HAM costs primarily hit healable pools. Thus, they can spam specials, and if their costs get too great, they pop a stim, and spam away more. We cannot do that. However, with this proposed change, everyone's HAM will be unhealable, and whether or not it means we cannot spam our specials the way we can when buffed now, the same will now be true of everyone. Nobody will be spamming specials, and that helps us either way.

Besides, they have stated that the change is supposed to make HAM cost recovery faster overall. But even if that was not the case, the key is reducing costs (Focus) not in hoping it recovers faster, because at Master, it won't happen.

About the muon incap from specials. I believe I read some place that after your ham bar gets too low, it auto stops specialling until you regain. So bascially there's a set limit your bar can get to before you'll autofire, even if you have a mind left.

As to the changes.....Auto fire does indeed suck. But so does alot in PVP. I mean come on...we have radar. Simple target red blip, fire/spam, incap, repeat. Until you have the option of hiding behind bushes, hills, buildings, etc. you'll always see this sort of dull repeating fire stuff. No real strategy. But...here's to hoping.

Sotoudi............. YES i agree with you big time. That is what i was saying. Overall as a master i know what you need to do (with focus)......I was just giving an overall example that all could relate to for those that arent master.

And if you read my post especially near then end. I wasn't saying it hurts us nor helps us. I was saying IT balances out the PvP fighting period. Put's everyone at the same level.

Basically trying to help those that are thinking it helps us........to stop thinking that way. Cuz it doesn't...... It really evens things out. We will still target someones mind pool....that wont change obviously. Unless someone is spamming specials that waists thier HA.... then we can use other shots. U just gotta be smart and take what is given to you at the moment. There is no direct way to fight in PvP.... you have to adapt to the situation and react accordingly.

If i see someoen whailing away on specials and see that HA shooting down....... im laying off the Headshots.... But if i see them being conservative.... trying to save the HA..... Im taking the mind away so they cant use a special in the end.

basically that is all im saying. IT's going to be even now....

Here's my take.

From what I've heard the changes are in an attempt to stop us from being able to spam specials. In theory, a good idea. In practice, it stinks especially for us. Reason ? When you auto attack, what pool do you normally hit ? Health right ?? So we target all our specials on Mind and when we cant spam, we hit a completely different pool most of the time. And what do pistoleers focus their attacks on ?? Oh look Health.... so they autoattack the pool they were attacking anyway. Very handy. And TKMs for the most part .... lookie there Health again. So the two of the most popular profs get hooked up again.

I think they should make the different types of weapons auto attack the pool their specials hit with a higher percentage. Thus rifles have a higher chance to hit mind, pistols hit health, and carbs hit action. If you want to leave the random pool specials completely random so be it but the default which they are trying to increase the use of shouldn't make us have to drain a whole other pool from what we were aiming at.

Just my thoughts.