Rifleman Archive
Thread: Riflemen Nerf?
Oh Christ, did anyone see the Jedi boards?
They want to get us nerfed now too!
Who's gonna sign my next petition"When the way to open the FS slot is changed all current FS slots should be deleted and they should have to open them again with the new system."
The title "Sniper" only applies to one tree in rifleman. Long-range concealed sniping is not the entirety of the rifleman profession. If it were then there would be no PvP at all for riflemen. You think a TKA is gonna wait while you get yourself in position, prone at 64m before he starts attacking you? Yeah right. Or you can apply the same reasoning to PvE: You go prone at 64m and start shooting. If the critters aren't social you get 4/5 shots on average before they rush you. Without speed and accuracy you are toast. Unless you use conceal shot the whole time, in which case why bother having mastered rifleman at all? Just get conceal shot and save the skill points.
We have the titles "Gunner" and "Soldier" too. Obviously for high-speed, short to mid-ranged combat. We are not as good at it as pistols or carbines in that it costs us a lot more to do it, but we still have the option. We might seem too good at it right now because the other two are broken. Doesn't mean we should be nerfed to make up for it. Unless you want to tell the pistoleers and carbiners that their professions are NOT broken and are currently in the state they are meant to be?
If anyone still thinks we are purely snipers then take away the speed and the short-range accuracy and let us shoot from 1000m, like any decent sniper should. I personally would relish taking out large groups of critters/players before any of them even knew where I was (snipershot would be LOTS of fun then). That's what a sniper is, not "Look there's a sniper, lets go and kill him before he can get his second shot off"
Sorry for ranting but this nerf-talk is just rediculous.
jgr wrote:
I think the main problem most people have with riflemen is that they have the ability to dish out 500 mind dps in pvp at point blank range whilst moving, the speed cap and an adjustment to short range accuracy will stop all the complaints and bring the profession in line with pistols and carbs. With my bh account I only use carbs and although the speed cap will hit me too, I still welcome it as it's all part of making pvp in this game more balanced and (hopefully) fun.
WOW you took 500 mind dmg? I bet it was SS2 as that is a random pool shot and the only one that can hit that hard, without krayt weapons(not even going to go into this.).Also if you took 500 mind dmg you must not have been wearing armor and had no mind buffs what so ever. SImply put it is your own fault.
MY question is if I die to mosdt proffessions and I was unbuffed then guess what 2/3's of the people who just kicked my ass say you should of had buffs/armor? SO why cant we say it???
hoenix
MarcoRenaldi wrote:
jgr wrote:
I think the main problem most people have with riflemen is that they have the ability to dish out 500 mind dps in pvp at point blank range whilst moving, the speed cap and an adjustment to short range accuracy will stop all the complaints and bring the profession in line with pistols and carbs. With my bh account I only use carbs and although the speed cap will hit me too, I still welcome it as it's all part of making pvp in this game more balanced and (hopefully) fun.
WOW you took 500 mind dmg? I bet it was SS2 as that is a random pool shot and the only one that can hit that hard, without krayt weapons(not even going to go into this.).Also if you took 500 mind dmg you must not have been wearing armor and had no mind buffs what so ever. SImply put it is your own fault.
MY question is if I die to mosdt proffessions and I was unbuffed then guess what 2/3's of the people who just kicked my ass say you should of had buffs/armor? SO why cant we say it???
The 500 mind damage I'm referring to is from the 2 months I spent as a sharpshooter, not using krayt weapons - just a powered up t21 with a nicedamage slice I regularly hit for 500+ per shot with /headshot3 in pvp on unarmoured opponents, and for 300+ with my jawa on comp wearers. Don't take it as a flame to your profession or anything as it definitely isn't, I'm just trying to point out to you why I feel the changes that are coming to your class are unavoidable.
JGR pistoleers seem to be focused on defence(High Dodge, KD, and State Change defence)
Riflemen are seemed to be ment as Direct Damage Dealers.
PyscoJuggalo wrote:
JGR pistoleers seem to be focused on defence(High Dodge, KD, and State Change defence)
Riflemen are seemed to be ment as Direct Damage Dealers.
If you were talking about reducing our accuracy or defense I could go along, but our speed is what makes us competitive, don't you remember being a non-master Rifleman?
Pistoleer has more state changes, ButRifleman get the same melee defense as Pistoleers and additionally get 40 more ranged defense, which I find inconsistant. a Pistoleer's state defenses does not protect him against a rifleman, but a Rifleman's Ranged defense perfectly protects against a Pistoleer. Also, Rifleman are more accurate than pistoleers which makes the 10 ranged defense pistoleers mean nothing while the pistoleer loses about half his accuracy against a Rifleman right off the bat.
Nerfs come I believe to arrest symptoms in this game. these symptons are:
- a sudden migration of the playerbase to a specific profession/template
- an increase of whining about a certain profession
- a change to a separate system (such as the additon of better food buffs) that creates an overpowering of one class.
These are the symptoms to a problem that is more far reaching than any one profession. They occur because the overall system is unbalanced, and the result (in this case complaining about or migrating to Rifleman) is a nerf that doesn't fix anything and continues the cycle. I hope you guys can find it within yourselves to break the cycle; it would be a shame to see you get nerfed because you couldn't.
Here's the problem with all the Nerf rifleman cries.
1) We are not overpowered, in the least. The fact of the matter is the other combat proffesion do not have weapons to get through all the adv composite around. Well until recently with the stun pistols. So with the new stun pistols out, and with better stats than the pistols that were just nerfed, how soon will all you pistoleers be crying about Nerf Pistoleer? Yeah that's what I thought.
2) Accuracy. So where's the balance come into play. Pistoleers, carbines, are accurate from 64m. Why shouldn't we be from 10m? I do agree that in terms of balance we should not be accurate inside 20m. But Pistols and carbines shouldn't be accurate at 64m.
3) Speed. Plain and simple if you nerf or cap this, Rifleman will be permanently flushed down the toilet.
If you think HeadShot3, is a problem in PvP, just wait till these Adv.Krayted Stun pistols get into the hands of the MBM's. 80% compo, Stun enhanced 80% compo, won't matter.....
Let me just state the obvious here.
1) PvP= requirement for 80% or better compo.
2) PvP= requirement to be buffed.
3) PvP= requirement for at least adv weaponry.
4) PvP= requirements for food, drink, spice.
5) PvP= requires the ability to comprehend the fact that YOU WILL DIE.
6) PvP= requiresthe knowlege of the fact that at one time or another YOU WILL GET OWNED.
7) PVP= acceptance of the fact that even if you have the perfect template, weaponry, armor, buffs, etc to expoilt the weaknesses of your opponents profession, there isSTILL the possibility YOU WILL DIE.
8)PvP= Just because you are defeated by someone, even owned by someone does not mean they need to be balanced or nerfed by default.
9) PvP= knowing that there will always be Punks talking smack.
Out of time, but I'm sure there are many, many other requirements for PvP. I got beat by a rifleman...rifleman need to be nerfed, is not an excuse for being a lousy player.
I see alot, I mean alot of people who's HAM's resemble the following:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>
HabeasCorpus wrote:
PyscoJuggalo wrote:
JGR pistoleers seem to be focused on defence(High Dodge, KD, and State Change defence)
Riflemen are seemed to be ment as Direct Damage Dealers.
If you were talking about reducing our accuracy or defense I could go along, but our speed is what makes us competitive, don't you remember being a non-master Rifleman?
Pistoleer has more state changes, ButRifleman get the same melee defense as Pistoleers and additionally get 40 more ranged defense, which I find inconsistant. a Pistoleer's state defenses does not protect him against a rifleman, but a Rifleman's Ranged defense perfectly protects against a Pistoleer. Also, Rifleman are more accurate than pistoleers which makes the 10 ranged defense pistoleers mean nothing while the pistoleer loses about half his accuracy against a Rifleman right off the bat.
Nerfs come I believe to arrest symptoms in this game. these symptons are:
- a sudden migration of the playerbase to a specific profession/template
- an increase of whining about a certain profession
- a change to a separate system (such as the additon of better food buffs) that creates an overpowering of one class.
These are the symptoms to a problem that is more far reaching than any one profession. They occur because the overall system is unbalanced, and the result (in this case complaining about or migrating to Rifleman) is a nerf that doesn't fix anything and continues the cycle. I hope you guys can find it within yourselves to break the cycle; it would be a shame to see you get nerfed because you couldn't.
Our melee defence is negated with publish 7, as far as ranged defence personally I'd like to see rifleman with 20 or some other low number at master.
Still pistoleers get that high dodge and block, if it worked would only half damage.
But you are right nerfing does not fix anything thats why I have offered definitions over balance.
Definitions like:
Pistoleer = the defence heavy ranged profession
Carbineer = The KD, State attack profession
Rifleman = The Direct Damage profession.
The whole reason there is imbalance is because there is no real defintion to any of the professions. It seems that our definition is a color code Red, Green, or Blue, well to me thats half assed and stupid.
The developers better have each professiopn defined by the end of the combat rework or this game is dead.
Message Edited by PyscoJuggalo on 03-10-2004 10:05 AM