Rifleman Archive
Thread: interesting results from the chefs
RegenEdnolb wrote:
I've done some more quick testing of Vegaparsine and Thundercloud.
Vegaparsine (+100 Melee defense)
Elshandruu Pica Thundercloud (+100 Ranged defense)
-Offense: Someone with 236 accuracy when shooting with ranged shot (using a rifle)
-Defense: Someone with base defense of: 169 melee and 244 ranged defense.
The following tests are to find out when Vegaparsine/Elshandruu pica thundercloud actually work...
Defense: 169 melee 244 ranged
Defender has NO weapon equiped
Damage: 744
Defense: 240 melee 315 ranged
Defender has weapon equiped
Damage: 709
Defense: 269 melee 244 ranged (used +100MD vegaparsine)
Defender has NO weapon equiped
Damage: 718
Defense: 340 melee 315 ranged (used +100MD vegaparsine)
Defender has weapon equiped
Damage: 709
Defense: 269 melee 344 ranged (used +100MD vegaparsine AND +100RD Thundercloud)
Defender has NO weapon equiped
Damage: 718
Defense: 340 melee 415 ranged (used +100MD vegaparsine AND +100RD Thundercloud)
Defender has weapon equiped
Damage: 683
The above numbers show that my assumption about how melee and ranged defense work seem to be true. I've highlited the Damages and the corresponding defenses. I've also tested this briefly against a Jedi yesterday (he's melee), and after I took my ranged defense drink, he hit me for less dmg (after re-equiping my rifle ofcourse. Note I havent tested this for an extended period of time against a melee character, but I have no reason te believe its working any different).
So it seems to be that:
- Melee defense means your defense value against Ranged OR Melee attacks when you have a melee weapon equiped (your hands are also melee)
- Ranged defense mean your defense value against Ranged OR Melee attacks only when you have a ranged weapon equiped (You must re-equip your weapon after you used ranged defense food!!)
...then the Carbineers and ESPECIALLY the Pistoleers are going to be PIS*ED off. LOL. THe whole idea behind the balancing of the professions was to give pistoleers the most defenses, followed by carbineers, and then us (rifleman). That was the whole idea. We got great ranged defense, but we were not supposed to be able to stand up to meleers as well as a carbineer or pistoleer could. We were supposed to be the long rage damage dealers.
But if THIS is true, then that means Pistoleers and Carbineers got a little screwed over, because we have more ranged defense than either of them. So now we have the longest range, the most powerful weapons, AND the best defenses....
I sense a witch hunt forming. LOL. This will NOT go over well, and I cant really blame them. I dont think that they will blame us for this, but I cant imagine that they will be happy about it. That could lead to one of two things: Us getting out ranged defense mod nerfed, or pistoleers/carbineers getting a ranged defense boost. if they simply boost ranged def for the Carbs and Pistol guys, the Jedi will scream that their BH's are even HARDER to kill now.
This is big. This is MUCH bigger than just changing foods. This could have a huge impact on all professions if they say this is working as intended. I hope to god its a bug.
Dr4g0nf1y wrote:
If all this is true, and ranged defense is all that matters to ranged professions....
...then the Carbineers and ESPECIALLY the Pistoleers are going to be PIS*ED off. LOL. THe whole idea behind the balancing of the professions was to give pistoleers the most defenses, followed by carbineers, and then us (rifleman). That was the whole idea. We got great ranged defense, but we were not supposed to be able to stand up to meleers as well as a carbineer or pistoleer could. We were supposed to be the long rage damage dealers.
But if THIS is true, then that means Pistoleers and Carbineers got a little screwed over, because we have more ranged defense than either of them. So now we have the longest range, the most powerful weapons, AND the best defenses....
I sense a witch hunt forming. LOL. This will NOT go over well, and I cant really blame them. I dont think that they will blame us for this, but I cant imagine that they will be happy about it. That could lead to one of two things: Us getting out ranged defense mod nerfed, or pistoleers/carbineers getting a ranged defense boost. if they simply boost ranged def for the Carbs and Pistol guys, the Jedi will scream that their BH's are even HARDER to kill now.
This is big. This is MUCH bigger than just changing foods. This could have a huge impact on all professions if they say this is working as intended. I hope to god its a bug.
/agree
Dr4g0nf1y wrote:
If all this is true, and ranged defense is all that matters to ranged professions....
...then the Carbineers and ESPECIALLY the Pistoleers are going to be PIS*ED off. LOL. THe whole idea behind the balancing of the professions was to give pistoleers the most defenses, followed by carbineers, and then us (rifleman). That was the whole idea. We got great ranged defense, but we were not supposed to be able to stand up to meleers as well as a carbineer or pistoleer could. We were supposed to be the long rage damage dealers.
But if THIS is true, then that means Pistoleers and Carbineers got a little screwed over, because we have more ranged defense than either of them. So now we have the longest range, the most powerful weapons, AND the best defenses....
I sense a witch hunt forming. LOL. This will NOT go over well, and I cant really blame them. I dont think that they will blame us for this, but I cant imagine that they will be happy about it. That could lead to one of two things: Us getting out ranged defense mod nerfed, or pistoleers/carbineers getting a ranged defense boost. if they simply boost ranged def for the Carbs and Pistol guys, the Jedi will scream that their BH's are even HARDER to kill now.
This is big. This is MUCH bigger than just changing foods. This could have a huge impact on all professions if they say this is working as intended. I hope to god its a bug.
As a pistoleer I scream..right on point, pistoleer especially does most of its fighting up close and personal compared to 80m out on a snared target. dont give that well you have root BS either because our root sucks. Defenses has always been an issue between the ranged classes, and now if this is true the battle is going to get even more heated. Hope Badger is reading this =/ BTW, if this is working as intended, why in the hell have melee defense mods in ranged prof's trees? Just in case i want to switch from my pistol to asurvival knifemidfight?
Message Edited by SoulHunters on 09-21-2005 01:45 PM
That is obviously a bug, why would we get melee defence if that is working correctly.....................
Edit- thought Ackhece did the test, giving the VG award to proper tester
Message Edited by PyscoJuggalo on 09-21-2005 05:47 PM
I guess for ppl with mixed ranged/melee templates it makes sense but surely if its working as intended it would just be better to give one or the other at a double value maybe.
- I did not do the tests.. (read the full post including the person who I quoted)
- Melee defense is useful if you use a cross profession from rifleman such as swordsmen as well
- no idea if it is a bug - but it appears that it is not a recent change
- actually works better for us then if it did not work this way - rifleman have a higher ranged defense then melee so it is better for us if we get attacked by melee anyway
Chaosium_451 wrote:
If this is working as intended, then it also makes the ranged defense and melee defense trees in the Force Sensitive skills redundant.
I guess I better start thinking about moving those points over to Ranged Speed or Ranged Accuracy instead, and doing the grind all over again.