CUEmu - Thread Posts

ClaudCrimsil

Fri May 21, 2004 2:32 pm

Rangers and harvesting: one thing thbat we should do better than other professions.

But as it is now the only "bonus" we have on harvesting is the number of resources we get for any critter slain... a master commando with just novice scout can kill more than us and thus harvest more...

weare not a "needed" class cause every scout can harvest as we do..

that is why i think what should make a master ranger different from every other guy out there who tries to tear some meat away from a dead blurg is the "way" we do it:

to make it simple master rangers should be the only one to not get characteristics penalties to the resources harvested:

this means that even if a master commando kills 2000 bolle bol that should ahve 900+ quality with his lack of skill in harvesting he would damage it heavily thus making it of low value.

trough the scout tree (and expecially trough the ranger skill) skills would give a player the ability to increase their skill in harvesting (wich is done by decreasing the malus they get when they harvest)

only master rangers would be able to harvest has its done now, thus only master ranger would have the better resources making us someone needed as a medic, as a droid engineer and as any profession where there is no one else that does your job as you do..

i think it s realistic as well cause i am no butcher nor an hunter in the real world and i am not even able to clean a fish properly...

it really "requires skill" to skin an animal, i think that i would just ruin the fur if i would try to do it...

I think this is a very very easy integration to the game that would make us ranger "good at something".

what do ya think?

sorry if this was already discusse before

'Claud Crimsil (StarSider)
Master Ranger/Master Rifleman

ClaudCrimsil

Fri May 21, 2004 2:36 pm

#2

dang... sorry for multiple posting this is the right post anyway..

'Claud Crimsil (StarSider)
Master Ranger/Master Rifleman

Flenst

Fri May 21, 2004 4:07 pm

#3

I'll chime in on this one:

I agree completely with the spirit of your post, but I'm not sure this is something that will get any serious attention. With all of the talk of the other classes/templates that can easily outharvest us in terms of higher kill rates, it does seem that for most "resource gatherers" it's much more a question of quantity than quality. Personally, and while I acknowledge that if I were a Ranger solely for the harvesting bonuses and to gather meat for docs that I would be better served with novice scout plus superhero hunter type, I actually like hunting and using traps and the many tactics that are discussed in this forum. There should be some credit given for how something is done, as well, which is the idea of your post and it's a very noble one. And, currently, that satisfaction in "doing the job right" is one of the few things we do have going for us.

Not to mention there is a good bit of logic in what you say: An inexperienced crafter produces goods of a lesser quality, an inexperienced fighter kills with less efficiency, why shouldn't an inexperienced hunter field dress his kill with less quality? The problem, however, is that we don't actually have a product, we only gather it. Thus, our parallel is not with the fighter or the crafter, but rather the surveyor. Because of this, I think our needs would be better addressed with the proposed increase in harvesting a la the million monkeys. There has been some talk in previous posts, however, that propose that we should be able to prepare/tan/cure hides and meat to actually improve their statistics or to make these "prepared" organics into optional or necessary components for crafters' schematics. This sort of goes in the same direction as your idea, is perhaps more realistic, it increases interdependency among the professions, and overall gives us Rangers something unique.

Ottosek Flenst
Master Ranger and Master Rifleman - Shadowrealm, Naboo
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"Zwei Dinge sind unendlich: das Universum und die
menschliche Dummheit. Aber beim Universum bin ich mir
nicht ganz sicher." - Albert Einstein
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Narak

Fri May 21, 2004 4:11 pm

#4

Nice idea, the only problem I see with implementing it is that the quality numbers seem to be tied to the resource name right now. So lets say the current nabooian avian meat is called Quagldagl, it would result in different types of Quagldagl that couldnt be stacked onto one another. And its really one of the very basic game systems, doubtful they would change it...

Lello Pom - Master Droid Engineer (Chimaera, Naboo, Spiritwood)
Norik - Ranger (Kettemoor, Shadowclan Rodians)

Diaron_HCaor

Fri May 21, 2004 4:54 pm

#5

If this system were implemented as described for "improving" meats/hides/bones for use by artisan profs i think this would be of great benefit to the game mechanics as a whole. Would it be difficult to distinguish between 500 individual "improved" pieces of Nabooian Quagldagl Avian Meat in a container? of course it would be.

Instead consider that most folks would be interested in quantities of an "improved" harvest to use in mass production of some end product. if the implementation were to force the issue then i think most would learn to live with it.i mean making the conversion to "improved" is a permanent effect done by some tool that outputs just like any other tool. basically adding this as a "craftable" item type/schematic for rangers in the harvest tree. Of course we wouldnt get experimentation just like in the case of our camps/traps. Ultimately we would have to buy either simple tools or factories from artisans to make these in huge quantities. The output then would not be individual "improved" pieces called Quagldagl Avian meat anymore but Nabooian jerky(chef component), Nabooian feathers(tailor component), Nabooian bonechips(architect component) made in quantities that would not interfere with the original harvest resource identification system.

Hope this makes some sense. i've been trolling the boards since i started with this game during Beta 2.

Lannaliak, Tarquinas-Dantooine-Holocron City

Master Ranger/Scout, Architect 0/4/0/0, Novice Rifleman, Brawler 0/4/0/0

ClaudCrimsil

Fri May 21, 2004 10:36 pm

#6

thank you all for replying some precisations:

1) i don t think the main issue about ranger is harvesting, but i think it s one important feature both in gameplay both in our role so I am not saying that this is the only thing i want in the revamp but i would like this as well.. harvesting is still the only thing we can get a living with ..

2) for the mecahanic of my proposal i don t suggest to alter anything ofthe current system.

i mean scripters don t have to rewrite the WHOLE resource table, what i would like to see it s a "simple malus" applied to those that aren t master ranger , this malus would become smaller and smaller raising trough the master ranger tree.

it s basically a "negative skill" you don t have +xx harvest bonus

any novice scout starts out with -xx in harvesting: (the devs can put it even with plus in the skill tab but it truly work as a malus not as a bonus)

any time the scout harvest a resource (wich has the same statts it currently has) the malus he/she has applies to the resource.

This means that even if a mater commando can kill 20000 more animals than us, if WE harvest it we don t get any malus on resource quality, if THEY harvest they get very high malus..

3) has i ve heard from one of you (if i haven t misunderstood) you say that crafters are not interested n quality has much as quantity...

i don t know how this is true (cause i always see people aking for resources over 900 statts)

but if it s true (and perhaps it would become truer with this modify that makes better resources omething rare) the other thing the dev should do to improve our value would be to increase the matter of the reource quality to the final product.. mor e than it s now..

i don t think it s difficult to script cause it s just a matter to change some numbers..

i would like to hear our corrispondent about this one.

'Claud Crimsil (StarSider)
Master Ranger/Master Rifleman

Oculus

Sat May 22, 2004 7:47 am

#7

I do agree that we need some added value to our harvest, however I'm not keen on having Rangers fill the entire need for harvested resources... if everyone else is going to harvest, in essence, lower quality resources that's what's going to happen.

We are NOT just human harvesters, well, right now we are, but we shouldn't be. Anything that puts added pressure on Rangers in that respect is a no-go in my book.

I for one am looking forward to the camp and trap changes, if/when they come, hopefully with the GCW changes. As far as harvesting goes there a some very simple changes needed to justify the skill points.

Let Rangers harvest meat/hide/bone from the same creature as they advance.

Increse the +harvest modifiers to compensate for the firepower we give up.

Remove the 'group harvest' penalty for Rangers.

That, together with the +creature to hit and +creature info would justify the 14 skill points.

Harvetsing is only 1/4 of our profession

Oku Kee'lus

Master Ranger | Master Carbineer

ClaudCrimsil

Sat May 22, 2004 10:07 am

#8

who is saying that?

i am not proposing to make all our skills harvest related...

i just think that the current "harvest amount bonus" is ridicolous...

and even giving us a bigger bonus wouldn t make us "unique" for other players...

they won t search for us as you search a medic for buffs and a ch for a pet...

i agere it s just part of our profession but it s the part that relates us to other people with camping..

'Claud Crimsil (StarSider)
Master Ranger/Master Rifleman

Fobik

Sat May 22, 2004 10:33 am

#9

I am up for this if

1. you have to harvest then it is a craft function to get the improved resource..ie..you have 100k of avain meat. You do your "craft like thing to shift through the meat to find the better" portion of the meat. You come up wih 1-3k of avian that has like 50-100 more in PE OQ or whatever...but..but..BUT the rest is distroyed. so you spent 100k of meat to get 1-3k that is superior. This would not only boost the need for harvesting but would bring other people to us for cycling the meat or reasource...just my idea. Tell me what doc would not love to get 990 990 990 meat out of 890 890 890 meat even if they lose a huge ammount. Just my 2 cents keeping balance in mind.

Love

Glenda

Direpath

Sat May 22, 2004 10:51 am

#10

Oculus wrote:

Remove the 'group harvest' penalty for Rangers.

To add to this nice idea, how about remove the group harvest penalty for an entire group that the ranger is part of. As a ranger, you would be an expert in animals and their resources, so you could properly guide the group in their harvest. Another option is group harvesting bonuses. I know that when I was ranger, and when I return to it, I will not be harvesting large lots in a group...ranger can be such a lonely profession.

Ezrat Sraona..............Vaegam Oodari

Calculus_Entropy

Mon May 24, 2004 7:18 am

#11

Here are my 2 cents...This idea has been through the Ranger forum before. It has taken different forms, but the premise is the same. The major drawback of such a system is that resource stats are saved under their resource name (i.e. Quadodryyyylllman). If we change the stats, a new database entry needs to be made under a new name. If the skill varies throughout the Ranger and Scout professions (higher mod gives better quality) then there is a new database entry for all of those iterations. If we can focus on one stat (not metioned by you, but has been in the past) there is yet another set of database entries. Now there are many entries for just one resource. Multiply that by the number of resources on a server at a given time and the servers all crash. This is a fine idea that (almost) all Rangers love, but there really isn't a technically feasible way to handle somehting like this yet.

Calculus Entropy
Ranger Blue Glowie Emeritus
Garindan used /areatrack to find Han.

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Thread: harvesting: a matter of quality (something i would like into the ranger revamp)