Ranger Archive
Thread: Rifleman/Ranger Stack???
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bdant
Mon Jan 26, 2004 10:40 am
#1
I was noticing how many Ranger/Rifleman there are in the game and on the posts. Does anyone know if there are any attributes that stack between the two professions? It would be cool to have "cover" and "conceal" compliment each other.
StealthNuck
Mon Jan 26, 2004 10:44 am
#2
I don't think there's any stacking 
Maskcent is usefull, but that's a scout skill...
Conceal can be very usefull for the sniping types deep in enemy territory.
Also, the extra crawling speed is slightly usefull.
Maskcent is usefull, but that's a scout skill...
Conceal can be very usefull for the sniping types deep in enemy territory.
Also, the extra crawling speed is slightly usefull.
Terinati
Mon Jan 26, 2004 10:45 am
#3
No, unfortunately none of the Ranger and Rifleman abilities stack with each other. It'll never happen either, because Ranger is not a combat profession. I think the reason there are so many Ranger/Riflemen is that it makes sense for the template - when most people think of hunting, they think of rangers, and people who are in the class for the military scout/pathfinder/paramilitary bent, the whole concept fits with sniping/sniper rifles etc... so the draw is due to people's character template, not to any actual game advantage.
Fred_Skinner
Mon Jan 26, 2004 11:28 am
#4
There is but only one, meger advantage to only animal types (currently). Lay prone and concealed will get you up to 6 free misses when using Concealed Shot.
I do think that there is an actualy liability/bug. The concealment abilities of Ranger and RIfleman conflict in such a way that Camo/Maskscent breaks 60%-70% of the time.Those that complain about the "uselessness" ofcamo, to a man, seems to be riflemen.
ga2
Mon Jan 26, 2004 11:50 am
#5
i'm a master ranger and also working on rifleman. I can tell u from personal experience that maskscent does not help at all when sniping. I'm 100% invisible. I think your likle 87% at master, but with my +13 camos i'm at 100 and they still agro on me after 3 shots, even using conceal shot. Unless u use flurryshot then you can get off a couple of more because they are dizzy, sometimes. I guess being concealed can help u get into position without the animals agro'ing on you but that's about it and also crawling really fast can be helpful too. I love the ranger prof and don't plan on giving it up anytime soon, but imo it's not meant to be a combat prof in this game.
DWolfe
Mon Jan 26, 2004 12:14 pm
#6
Counter-opinion to ga2: I am also a Ranger-Rifleman. I've noticed a notably better chance at not drawing aggro when I concealshot when maskscent'ed, against critters, of course.
The major inconsistency I see with Ranger-Rifleman is that any Rifleman worth his salt rarely or never gets in close enough to use traps. Also, traps draw aggro about as easily as Bleeds, so if you're trying to ConcealShot, you definitely don't want to hit it with a trap first, even if you wanted to be close enough to do so.
Other than traps, I think Ranger and Rifleman, while not having any stacking advantages, are very complementary. Additionally, they're both so specialized as to have certain major flaws which makes them a good combination for those who like to be the underdog who triumphs over adversity. Like the Ranger, the Rifleman who destroys red-con creatures is doing so because he thinks, rather than simply spamming the same tired macros as everyone else.
This is not meant as a slight to non-riflemen, btw. I've had far too many close-calls averted by intelligent use of abilities by my shorter-range comrades to disrespect what they do. I'm simply pointing out that Riflemen are, like Rangers, a somewhat rare breed.
ga2
Mon Jan 26, 2004 12:47 pm
#7
i'm gonna try concealshot with maskscent off. dwolf might be right and i haven't noticed. I actually haven't tried to conceal shot without using maskscent, but the reason i didn't is because all the other rifleman i had talked to said the same thing. "u get 3 free shots", in my experience that's been the case. Also traps have been very useful once they agro on you. It slows them down enough so that you can move away and get into long range position again.
Telephius
Mon Jan 26, 2004 2:33 pm
#8
I find conceal shot pretty useful, I hunt with it if I don't feel like running around and just want to drop the critter or NPC for what it has on it.
Yesterday, I dropped a stormtrooper without him aggroing me and I am pretty sure I had camo on but can't remember. The only time I was ever aggroed by something using conceal shot was when the target was already engage in combat. I was out hunting greater sludge panthers to get my wayfarying 4 box and I saw a GSP fighting a vynock, well I figured it was distracted and I could use conceal to help take it down. Well the minute he finished the vynock he turned around and came after me and nearly killed me but her gave up chasing me around hehe(I forgot to prepare some traps oops). Other than that concealshot has never aggroed for me.
I am likeing Rifleman/Ranger and from what I hear from the Rifleman board is if you master the profession you killing capacity shoots up really high so there is a big difference between 4/4/4/4 rifle and Master. I guess that means if you are a ranger out to harvest things you can track them, kill em easy then use your Rnager harvesting to get the most out of them.
I do kinda like the fast crawl speed, I move a meter a second so I can go prone before I get into range and not worry about my prey walking away from me making me have to stand up.
JBMat
Tue Jan 27, 2004 11:14 am
#9
Hi guys. Pistoleer here.
Maskscent gets me 2 free stacking bleeds now. Yeah, this is gonna change, oh well.
I am standing when I do it too. I hate to crawl, get too dirty and all the nasty stuff in your hair.
Sure, I get one aggro critter on me when the bleeds start, but thatbeats 5 mad sharnaff bulls charging you. (Insane missions are my specialty)
Guessing maskscent does work, maybe it's conceal shot that's borked.
Just letting y'all know.
JB
ga2
Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:46 pm
#10
dwolf is right about concealshot. u can use it all day long. As long as u don't miss twice. I was using conceal shot with surprise shot, then flurry shot, of coursemy targetswould agro on me. As far as the advatages go of camo or maskscent helping hide you from your target. I know i see scouting points everytimg I get into position. I'm not sure if that might be the time I could get spotted. If that's the case then it is helpful because it helps u get into position without being spotted. I guess ranger/riflemando complement eachother.
Beausoleil
Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:36 pm
#11
The thing to remember is this....
/conceal (and maskscent) conceals YOU. Every creature has a range for attempting to break these. Krayt's and Kimo's are like 64m or more I think, most regular CL50 and lower mobs are more like 40-50m. Its DEFINITELY related to posture and the speed you are moving. If you move slow enough, you can get very close to big critters. If it breaks, just sit still and reapply, it won't break again.
/concealshot conceals your SHOT. You can use this with or without maskscent/camo. Lets say you are shooting a some agro (red) MOB that probably wouldn't detect you unless you are closer than 40m anyway. If you use /concealshot at like 50m, they won't aggro you unless you miss (was two misses when I was using it). However, if they wander to within say 40m, they may detect YOU, not your SHOT, and aggro you anyway. This has happend to me when I was shooting something from within 40m, and another creature spawns or moves near me and breaks my maskscent, then the creature I was concealshotting detects ME, NOT my shot and aggros me. For non-aggro stuff, you can stand right next to them and use /concealshot, with no other camo/maskscent, as long as you don't miss.
If I have MaskScent or Camo on, I can shoot bleed shots without getting aggro'd until the bleed hits. If I do not have maskscent or camo on, I get aggo'd at the time of the shot, not the bleed... PROVIDED I AM STANDING. Going prone ALSO provides a limited amount of shot concealment, and I can usually fire bleeds without aggro and without maskscent/camo. It all depends on the MOB target.
So, I would have to say that the only advantage I can see where a Ranger/Rifleman stacks is when you are fighting a MOB that will detect your presence out to the limits of your rifle range. Then you will get aggro'd from presence detection even if your shot is never detected while using /concealshot. In this case camo/maskscent can help. OR.. I suppose if you prefer to fire your bleed shots from a standing position before declaring PEACE and moving off to wait for the charge.
But ACTUALLY, you can probably do these with maskscent only and not conceal, and that is a Scout skill, so...
Change that...
The only way Ranger/Rifleman stacks is if you need /conceal to hide you from an NPC (yes I know its not supposed to but it does) that would detect you out to your rifle range limit.
Oh nevermind.
/conceal (and maskscent) conceals YOU. Every creature has a range for attempting to break these. Krayt's and Kimo's are like 64m or more I think, most regular CL50 and lower mobs are more like 40-50m. Its DEFINITELY related to posture and the speed you are moving. If you move slow enough, you can get very close to big critters. If it breaks, just sit still and reapply, it won't break again.
/concealshot conceals your SHOT. You can use this with or without maskscent/camo. Lets say you are shooting a some agro (red) MOB that probably wouldn't detect you unless you are closer than 40m anyway. If you use /concealshot at like 50m, they won't aggro you unless you miss (was two misses when I was using it). However, if they wander to within say 40m, they may detect YOU, not your SHOT, and aggro you anyway. This has happend to me when I was shooting something from within 40m, and another creature spawns or moves near me and breaks my maskscent, then the creature I was concealshotting detects ME, NOT my shot and aggros me. For non-aggro stuff, you can stand right next to them and use /concealshot, with no other camo/maskscent, as long as you don't miss.
If I have MaskScent or Camo on, I can shoot bleed shots without getting aggro'd until the bleed hits. If I do not have maskscent or camo on, I get aggo'd at the time of the shot, not the bleed... PROVIDED I AM STANDING. Going prone ALSO provides a limited amount of shot concealment, and I can usually fire bleeds without aggro and without maskscent/camo. It all depends on the MOB target.
So, I would have to say that the only advantage I can see where a Ranger/Rifleman stacks is when you are fighting a MOB that will detect your presence out to the limits of your rifle range. Then you will get aggro'd from presence detection even if your shot is never detected while using /concealshot. In this case camo/maskscent can help. OR.. I suppose if you prefer to fire your bleed shots from a standing position before declaring PEACE and moving off to wait for the charge.
But ACTUALLY, you can probably do these with maskscent only and not conceal, and that is a Scout skill, so...
Change that...
The only way Ranger/Rifleman stacks is if you need /conceal to hide you from an NPC (yes I know its not supposed to but it does) that would detect you out to your rifle range limit.
Oh nevermind.
BaGonkBaNoige
Wed Jan 28, 2004 1:00 am
#12
I am also working on master rifleman and master ranger. I would just like to give my experiences. I am currently MR at 1-1-3-1 and MRM at 2-0-0-2. I am not as far along assome others, but I just love being able to fire off my Mind bleeds and then get in a Warning Shot if possible and watch those Sharnaffs run while I'm working over another one. Of course there are times when I must run away. (think Monty Python) I can't wait to master both. I'm not even gonna follow my holos, for this is what I wanted to be since before I started playing. Have fun with what ever you do, that's the whole goal of the game.
dhcpSilicon
Wed Jan 28, 2004 1:35 am
#13
It makes sense to me to be hunting with a rifle, not a pistol, so I took Rifleman. Additionally, having the crawl speed boost is nice for sneaking while concealed.
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