Ranger Archive
Thread: The truth cannot be suppressed even if it is deleted.
DND_Cas wrote:
Serraphin wrote:
It was said this this is the last forum of civility, I profer that it is not. I have not flamed a single one of you only challenged the status quo and demanded an answer you may or may not feel I am entitled too. For this the majority of this community has Flamed and consistantly one starred me. So be it. The question stands and it is a fair question.
*sigh*
You came in here and slagged off everything that we as a community had done for the past 8 months. You changed facts to fit your agenda and you completely ignored everything that has beenexplained to youin this, and in every other, thread. Then ignoring everything that you have done you tell us that it is we who havn't lived up to our reputation. If you want our support for a method of getting things done you have a hugely destructive way of showing it.
Your question may not be a bad one. Its how you've asked the question which is the problem here. If someone came up to you and said "your hairs crap, your girlfriend looks like she's been slapped with a wet haddock and your car is something out of a 1980's skodaplants owners worstknightmare" and then asked if you'd mind helping him move his sofa then I'd recon you'd probably not be inclined to help or listen to the chap. Basically thats what you've done here.
**Bigger Sigh**
The question stands, is fair and remains unanswered and why this community FEARS the answer so I can not fathom. I am surprised you don't want to hear it yourselves.
Serraphin wrote:
DND_Cas wrote:
Serraphin wrote:
It was said this this is the last forum of civility, I profer that it is not. I have not flamed a single one of you only challenged the status quo and demanded an answer you may or may not feel I am entitled too. For this the majority of this community has Flamed and consistantly one starred me. So be it. The question stands and it is a fair question.
*sigh*
You came in here and slagged off everything that we as a community had done for the past 8 months. You changed facts to fit your agenda and you completely ignored everything that has beenexplained to youin this, and in every other, thread. Then ignoring everything that you have done you tell us that it is we who havn't lived up to our reputation. If you want our support for a method of getting things done you have a hugely destructive way of showing it.
Your question may not be a bad one. Its how you've asked the question which is the problem here. If someone came up to you and said "your hairs crap, your girlfriend looks like she's been slapped with a wet haddock and your car is something out of a 1980's skodaplants owners worstknightmare" and then asked if you'd mind helping him move his sofa then I'd recon you'd probably not be inclined to help or listen to the chap. Basically thats what you've done here.
**Bigger Sigh**
#1 The question stands, is fair and remains unanswered and why this community FEARS the answer so I can not fathom. I am surprised you don't want to hear it yourselves.
PS. DnD I am not that powerful, I can not control your actions so don't blame me if the community could not prevent themselves from flaming and or attacking. It is to each his/her own responsibility not mine.
Seraphin said: And you honestly think that your time is well spent at the correspondant forums Calc.
If so, what is the point exactly? If he doesnt contribute on the Corr. forum... what should he do? +Confused+ Also, weren't we told months ago that our changes wouldn't come until aafter the smuggler revamp because the developer, Green Marine, who would work on them has to finish that first? And isnt he currently a bit busy on Space Expansion atm? +confused+ So what are we posting about lol?
Also, for Rangers, these constitute flames:
Seraphin said: I can't help if no on ecan dispute my challenge to this forum and its correspondant to show that any progress has been made.
Ummm... didnt we answer this? Areatrack? Camo kits? Maskscent fixes? You may feel these have no merit, but we kinda like 'em.
Seraphin said: I may have already accomplished more in a weekend then this forum has in nearly 1 year.
Ummm... ow. So, helping new players, sharing information, and developing startegies have no merit? No accomplishment? That hurts. What is you version of accomplishment? I am still confused. If you say it is to get changes then please see above.
Seraphin said: And neither Calculus nor anyone from this forum has yet to offer anything that has resulted from this fourm's correspondant interaction with the devs.
Ow again. Why the personal attack against all of us? Is being friendly and enjoying the game as is such a deep offense? We got answers. We introduced the idea of modular camps. We got a droid that increases our harvests and throws traps for us. We get to wear mandalorian armor. Thats a lot compared to what a lot of professions got in the last patch. So how exactly have we not accomplished anything? Simply because tyou think these things have no merit. So far, still confused.
Seraphin said: This means that what has been done is not working and when something isn't working you try another method. Perhaps being a correspondant is more improtant then serving the community you represent. Since nothing thus far has worked then the correspondant should say gives us something, a clear timeline or I quit and there will be no correspondants behind me until you offer our forum something tangible. Can you dispute this?
You should take this passion to a real cause.
Frankly this is the first game that I have seen developers have interaction with players. I think it is amazing the lengths they go to to please their players. Being rude to them and demanding things that we have already been given a timeline for (Read: after smuggler changes). Frankly if Calc acted in this way I would consider him rude and obnoxious and I wouldn't want him for my correspondent. If he was rude to the producers of such a fun experience he would NOT be representing me or most of the community. And I am still confused. Why is it not working? Didnt we get a bunch of stuff this last patch?Seraphin said: What is has the coorespondant position achieved after nearly 1 year for this forum.
Ahhh.. this is the question? Okay well, we've been telling you but we don't mind re-iterating. Areatrack. The ability for EVERYONE in a group to harvest. Maskscent working how WE would like. Camo kits. And on and on... Man, think how much better off we were than the chefs! Now THEY needed help since day one and eventually they got it. And that was a looong eventually lol!
Seraphin said: If Calculus can simply Post the following "Nothing definitive has been done to improve the Ranger profession as a result of the Correspondant position" then I will be gone.
You want him to say a patent falsehood? Isn't he on TC, testing our bugs and issues? Putting his time in to answer questions? Why do think the forum is here? It is here so we can discuss the game and help each other and he has done A LOT of that. He has accomplished a ton of things, both before being a correspondent, and currently.
Seraphin said: I too am part of this community. As sson as Calculus answers the question I shall leave you all in peace.
If you are part of our community, why would you leave us in peace?
Won't you stick around to help the newbs? Share your stories? Come up with new ideas? We don't want you to leave, we want you to enjoy, and help us enjoy as well.Seraphin said: I don't see why everyone is upset with the notion that I have this one basic question.
It's the above isults that make us upset. We feel we have done stuff. We feel we have contributed. You say all we have done means nothing. Has accomplished nothing. This makes us upset.
Searphin said: The question stands, is fair and remains unanswered and why this community FEARS the answer so I can not fathom. I am surprised you don't want to hear it yourselves.
We answered the question. We answered the question several times. We listed the things we have received to enhance our profession. We have... ah.. never mind.
I'm tired of listening to myself, and I am sure you are too if you even bothered to read this whole melodrama. The question has been answered. We are all happy with the answer. Don't worry, I won't post in this thread again.
**Sigh of Resignation**
Inever flamed...I never wavered...And no my view wasn't popular...but I always kept it clean, can all of you say the same. I am not ready to leave the ranger profession but I am leaving this community and this forum. No I am not a bounty hunter, but it was one of many, many professions I tried. I always come back to ranger but it hasn't gotten any better. I am hopeful but I don't think this community can improve it because this community can not come clean about it limitations if it could it would just have answered my question clearly and concisely. Until that day comesthis professionwill not get anywhere. If it does and I am still playing you can find me on Flurry where I am Uziel Elleirhiasi, one of 5 brothers. If things have changed given your current course I will gladly admit I am wrong, but not until then. This community holds one view without regard to facts or proof otherwise and will entertain no other option unless it is in your format, hence your view.
And so it is with a tear that I leave all my fellow Rangers including those who vehemently opposed my question and sought only to deny me an answer.
Farewell and Best Wishes
Serraphin
It doesn't matter if youpay or not.The point is that I have control of my home. SOE has control of their forum. It is not a public forum, it is a privately held, controlled forum. You might be paying for it, but part of the contract you effectively sign by giving them your money is to agree to their Terms of Use, which is the same as you effectively agreeing to censorship in my house when you request to come in and I let you. SOE can NOT stop you from posting your opinions on another forum that they do not own and control, but they CAN stop you from posting on their own forum.
Now, as for your second part... It HAS been said, maybe not here and maybe not directly to you. But others have said, and I quote, "The role of the correspondant is to gather all our concerns in one place so that the developers can ignore us all more efficiently." Not that I personally believe that. In a project as big as SWG, there are far too many things to work on and never enough people to do everything that needs doing. And giving positive attention to all the borken professions is only one thing on a long list.
So things aren't better with correspondents. I very seriously doubt anything would be better without them. It appears to me that they are players who've volunteered.They aren't SOE employees, are they?What's the use of getting angry at someone who wants to try to help?
-V
I want our correspondant to simply state what has been done or that nothing has been done. Is that too much to ask.
If you were my child, I would have you in the corner doing a tome out till your attitude was better, then I would have you sit down and write out what you think would be a constructive answer to your questions.
To have Calc post that nothing has happened to improve our profession through the correspondant system after only having taken the responsiblity only a month ago is wrong. Rather then come in here telling us how wrong all of this and that is, why not offer up some useful suggestions instead.
Ebe
EbeLightcloud wrote:
If you were my child, I would have you in the corner doing a tome out till your attitude was better, then I would have you sit down and write out what you think would be a constructive answer to your questions.
To have Calc post that nothing has happened to improve our profession through the correspondant system after only having taken the responsiblity only a month ago is wrong. Rather then come in here telling us how wrong all of this and that is, why not offer up some useful suggestions instead.
Ebe
It is not wrong. It would be refreshing and a new place from which to start from.
True we haven't seen much luv but be very careful in your negativity. If you stay this way for too long then when the changes DO come you will have lost the ability to enjoy them. You will only be able to find fault with them. Enjoy the game. Enjoy the other aspects. Be positive and enhance others play experience, because face it. If they are not going to listen to you then they are not going to listen to you and being negative and angry will only make you more miserable.
If you need to leave the game for a while, or the profession then DO so! This is about having FUN! Not just about getting new stuff. Though Yoda knows we would all love some new stuff.
Being positive and constructive is good in another way. It earns us respect. Street cred lol. Both in our own community and in the development community. Patience young jedi.
Calc
Fred Skinner
JBMat... um
Volsted
Delta
NRaas
(the list goes on, but my lunch hour does not)
These are good examples. People we have respect for. People the developers will actually listen to when the time comes for our content additions. We need to foster and encourage these types of posters so the developers feel comfortable contacting them for ideas.
Okay, the boss just walked by lol. BE POSITVE! HAVE FUN! IT IS A GAME! (and a great one)
Serraphin wrote:
EbeLightcloud wrote:
If you were my child, I would have you in the corner doing a tome out till your attitude was better, then I would have you sit down and write out what you think would be a constructive answer to your questions.
To have Calc post that nothing has happened to improve our profession through the correspondant system after only having taken the responsiblity only a month ago is wrong. Rather then come in here telling us how wrong all of this and that is, why not offer up some useful suggestions instead.
Ebe
It is not wrong. It would be refreshing and a new place from which to start from.
Read her post again. She is not saying that what you are saying is wrong. I think most of us actually agree with some of what you have to say. We haven't gotten anything from the current system. A system you say we need to change. Fine, if we need to change it then what should we replace it with. That is what people are upset with you over. You want a change but don't suggest what that change should be. I for one would prefer to stick with the current system. It has worked for other professions. The dev's know of our Outdoorsman plan and have publicly acknowledged it. I'm all for another plan that would work and would still fit in with the tradition of this Ranger board but you have yet to present one. This isn't a flame but a plea for you to give us an alternative. We don't want you to stop discussing issues we just want you to give us some new ideas instead of griping about old ones.
Serraphin wrote:
Those communities were extremely verbal as were there correspondants. I want our correspondant to simply state what has been done or that nothing has been done. Is that too much to ask. I too am part of this community.As sson as Calculus answers thequestion I shall leave you all in peace.As alwaysSerraphin
Out of curiosity, how do you know how verbal the correspondents were or were not? Do you have access to whatever method through which the correspondents talk with the developers? Maybe you can read their email boxes?
The short answer is that we DON'T know what, exactly, the correspondents do and do not communicate to the developers and I would be quite surprised indeed if they COULD tell us what has been said between them and the devs without prior approval of information from the devs. Remember... NDAs are a corporation's best friend and I'd be entirely shocked if the correspondents didn't have to sign an NDA. If you have PROOF that a correspondent has not worked to better the profession he or she represents, that's a different matter, but right now you're just coming off as trying to beat up on someone when you can't even know what they have or haven't been able to bring to the table.
-V