Player Associations Archive
Thread: Group Dynamics and Issues
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Rothin
Tue Jan 18, 2005 4:51 pm
#14
Hmm, I think that would probably be a little more difficult to try to implement. But I see what you're saying now.
Bugman671
Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:15 pm
#15
IMHO if you want to have better groups in this game we need to have more instance dungeons! That can take players to different planets or locations in space, like asteroids, lost space stations. What ever
Also end to the "mission terminals" or huge update to them.
For example a mission terminal says “save a little girl” ok go out there kill some Hurtons… where are the little girl ? or “ save a down pilot” ok I go out kill some faction npcs or pickets where is the down pilot? Where is the crashed ship ? its just a flag in the ground or a nest. After blowing up 10,000 nests its gotten dam boring.
also give creature more loot, not necessarily loot for schematics but to sell back to “junk dealers”
this will make players grop more IMHO
Also end to the "mission terminals" or huge update to them.
For example a mission terminal says “save a little girl” ok go out there kill some Hurtons… where are the little girl ? or “ save a down pilot” ok I go out kill some faction npcs or pickets where is the down pilot? Where is the crashed ship ? its just a flag in the ground or a nest. After blowing up 10,000 nests its gotten dam boring.
also give creature more loot, not necessarily loot for schematics but to sell back to “junk dealers”
this will make players grop more IMHO
Rothin
Wed Jan 19, 2005 3:17 pm
#16
Make sure to post these ideas in the quest forums, that's the best place for them. That way they might get seen. 
Dormax
Thu Jan 20, 2005 1:06 am
#17
I'll will have to do that. As a matter of interest, I was preparing a post for that forum, but at the time, it wasnt open for posting. I'll have to work on that after I get home from work
Rothin wrote:
Dormax wrote:
I also think that new quests are in order. The game is mature enough now and much of the mechanics are already in place to create more complex missions that require groups to complete. I'm not talking about HARDER missions, like we have now for groups. That's just another solo-group issue... but rather special missions that are only given to grouped players which require those to each do something to assist in the mission. One example in existance right now is the FS mission that gives a mind buffing crystal as a reward. To get the crystal, you must have help and that help has her own special part in the mission.
This could be a good place to reuse code to create missions like we saw in Cries of Aalderan (such as the last rebel mission to defend a dynamicly created base) or something equally different and interesting. I'd be curious to hear the group's impressions about this (pun intended)
I would love to see group wide missions especially if they were driven by a story line. I think this would fall more into the Quest forum now though more so than us. I'd really suggest going there and making sure to post the idea so its more visable.
Thanks for the feedback
HardwiredXMan
Fri Jan 21, 2005 3:51 am
#18
My main concern about about groups is that there really is no good reason to group and hunt together. Other than just because you want to hunt with your friends. The biggest thing that really discourages me from group hunting is that I feel my time is wasted waiting on the whole group to get organized....and then for us to only do something that I could simply do by myself. when you don't "HAVE" to depend on other members to do something....there is really no reason for you to group.
If there were more missions or group only missions then that would be an incentive for me to group with others....but then another problem arises in a group....if you don't need the xp or the money.....the only reason left to group then is for the loot....but since only one person in the whole group gets the loot and it's based on the damage you do....you can literally hunt in a group for hours and the same person gets all the loot. Without looting messages working anymore, they can tell you they looted anything they want or nothing at all. So what happens is that you just went on a group hunt, and got nothing buta few credits and xp that you didn't even need. It might of been fun hunting with people for a bit...but that's not enough for me to abandon my solo hunts.....I can chat in guildchat or groupchat while I solo and have a few laughs while being effiencient with my time and still acquiring loot or rare items....I don't need a group for that.
I would love to group from time to time...but there just isn't any reason for me to do so....maybe when CU comes, I may need to group...but the game really needs something specific added that pertains to grouping only. the only things I can think of off the top of my head that "require" a group is the DWB and the vette mission in JTL for master pilot...even the geo cave and instanced corvette can be done solo.
I would like to see missions or dungeons that you cannot even enter if you don't have at least a 5 man group....and you must all be within a specific range before one of you can enter (to prevent CH's grouping with pets and alts to get in solo). In these dungeons you would face mobs that cannot be solo'd no matter what template you are......one thing that could be done to prevent soloing would be to scale the level of the mobs based on the group....the smaller the group the tougher the mob is....the biggest group you can get (20) would still spawn mobs that are very very hard and not scale the difficulty to low.
for example...you go at a group based mob missionalone and it spawns with 200k HAM, 80% resist and a 400 pt base attack per second.....take the same mob with a 10 man group and it spawans with 150k HAM, 75% resist and a 500 pt base attack every 2 seconds....take a 20 man group and it spawns with 100k HAM, 60% resist and a 700 base attack every 2 seconds......the big one would be that if you have a jedi in your group then a jedi or sith would spawn with the mission along with the normal npc's or creatures....if the mission is creatures then a boss creature would spawn with them instead of a jedi. This way, you could prevent soloing high level mobs, thus giving people a reason to group more.
This would be the high level content though....the main trigger of how hard the mob is would be the size of the group....the way the devs have it now is they think that spawning more creatures is harder.....this would be true if you could not control the number of creatures that spawn from a lair...but we can so that way is not harder, just allows you to milk a lair for maximum xp gain with very little risk.
Rothin
Fri Jan 21, 2005 7:39 am
#19
A lot of changes are coming for groups are coming soon to the game as far as looting goes. I'd suggest reading the Stratics Dev Chat from the other night as it had a lot of interesting information about what's coming in groups soon. They're going to fix the notifications and will be looking into more options for groups as well, so don't fret.
As far not needing a group, too much of the game is soloable because combat is way out of balance. One person should NOT be able to do everything in the game and that will change in the Combat Upgrade. You're going to need groups to do the high level content and maybe some of the mid level content as well depending on how things go. I think groups will be a lot more common place after the upgrade when things are finally balanced and its not just "get a buff, get a mind buff, eat foods, drink brandy and own the game." It'll be like a whole new game and a ton better than it is now!
As for more group missions, dungeons, etc.. I'm all for that. I'm sure we'll end up seeing some of this stuff with the new Content team once they've settled in and are able to begin building new areas for us.
As far not needing a group, too much of the game is soloable because combat is way out of balance. One person should NOT be able to do everything in the game and that will change in the Combat Upgrade. You're going to need groups to do the high level content and maybe some of the mid level content as well depending on how things go. I think groups will be a lot more common place after the upgrade when things are finally balanced and its not just "get a buff, get a mind buff, eat foods, drink brandy and own the game." It'll be like a whole new game and a ton better than it is now!
As for more group missions, dungeons, etc.. I'm all for that. I'm sure we'll end up seeing some of this stuff with the new Content team once they've settled in and are able to begin building new areas for us.
CM_Ronin
Sat Jan 22, 2005 6:29 pm
#20
Simple as this: I loved playing this other MMO called Horizons for one reason. It encouraged grouping. You get group xp and then you get xp on how much damage you did to the mob. Of course there was only one kind of xp in SWG. You have different types of XP for each profession. But seriously I had a lot of fun playing that game and everyone worked together and if you had a really smart group you could hunt very efficiently. You actually had to depend on your healers instead of just turn on god-mode with buffs and armor. There was buffs but they were a skill that the caster could use every minute or so and they only lasted 30 seconds or so.
Grouping in SWG Sucks...make it unsuck
Simple as that.
HardwiredXMan
Sun Jan 23, 2005 2:36 am
#21
Yeah, I read the HOC, it was interesting to say the least, although I expectedjust a little bit more....oh well, no rush. I hope that group becomes a big part of the game but at the same time I hope it is setup to where you don't have to spend 30 min to an hour just getting prepared. Getting a group together is probably what takes the longest, however I know not even the devs can do anything about that....that falls stricktly on the shoulders of the players.
Also, I love the new armor (and weapons settings), sounds like the way it will be done, you'll need a group to be most effective. With each type of armor having difference rolls and being as how the same type of mobs will always spawn different levels of that mob....it will definitely make the type of armor you wear and the type of group you put together a tactical and strategic decision more so than just how powerful your krayt enhanced weapons and armor are.
With those changes and adding some group specific missions/ themeparks / dungeons.....I may never solo again aside from leveling....but then again, the only thing I have to level is jedi....so as long as visibility remains the same.....theres no way I'll be grouping......I don't have any normal combat professions anymore.....so I guess If I want to experience the new group advantages, I'll have to play an alt on another server.
Anyway, I'm excited about the new changes! Seems there will be reason for me to group now.
Rothin
Sun Jan 23, 2005 7:34 am
#22
If you're a Jedi, you should have an alt on your own server already you could do combat with. Then you would be able to look at them when / if they're made. I think that grouping will be a big part of the game again because honestly it is more fun most of the time to make a group. It's going to take a lot of work to change peoples mind sets from 'solo' to 'group.' Right now 99% of the game solos because they can do everything and there is no need to work together. That just makes the game easy and is pointless. Hopefully all this will change with the Combat Upgrade becuase once armor and weapons are balanced out again, everything should start to take form.
Message Edited by Rothin on 01-23-2005 09:35 AM
HardwiredXMan
Mon Jan 24, 2005 6:34 am
#23
well, I made my alt a triple master crafter. I've done combat so long and I enjoy crafting too, that i made up my mind a year ago that I would make a crafter out of my alt. So that's whyI would have to play with an alt character on another server. However, I may be persuaded into making my crafter alt a combat character....just maybe...hehe.
Taish
Tue Feb 08, 2005 8:09 am
#24
My request: *begs* Please allow us to choose level 99 missions while alone. I dont' want the money. I just want to have a decent grind. My issues revolve around Jedi and off-peak playing time.
Here's the issue for Jedi:
- Jedi are forced to hunt alone, or they get hunted themselves. The safest way to level up for low level Jedi is to use missions rather than roaming Endor or another non-player planet - you are near a safehouse and other valuable support services.
- Yet, you can't get difficult enough missions (level 80-99) alone, or with one or two other people. The level 40 or so missions are too easy and a waste of valuable game time, when in the same amount of time you can get 2x the experience with a higher level mission.
- Problems for Jedi with solo groups: People who track or want to harrass you can find you easily if they join your group. this is one way Bounty Hunters can find Jedi.
An Issue involving off-peak hours playing:
-I play at off-peak time (around server down/up time for my server) and many many times in any given week, I can't find a solo group to get the higher level missions.
- yes my server has solo group bots, but they don't come on after the server comes up after a maintenance. So I'm stuck not having a solo group to be with. (Yet solo groups are dangerous to be in for a Jedi).
Is there any way that the system could detect when you are buffed, and give you higher level missions accordingly?
Or, PLEASE allow a wider range of difficulty when solo. Devs know we can solo more difficult missions while buffed - please allow us to choose those by ourselves. Nerf the payout, I don't care about the money. I just want to get in a good, but safe(r) grinding session. Let us choose up to level 99 missions when alone.
Here's the issue for Jedi:
- Jedi are forced to hunt alone, or they get hunted themselves. The safest way to level up for low level Jedi is to use missions rather than roaming Endor or another non-player planet - you are near a safehouse and other valuable support services.
- Yet, you can't get difficult enough missions (level 80-99) alone, or with one or two other people. The level 40 or so missions are too easy and a waste of valuable game time, when in the same amount of time you can get 2x the experience with a higher level mission.
- Problems for Jedi with solo groups: People who track or want to harrass you can find you easily if they join your group. this is one way Bounty Hunters can find Jedi.
An Issue involving off-peak hours playing:
-I play at off-peak time (around server down/up time for my server) and many many times in any given week, I can't find a solo group to get the higher level missions.
- yes my server has solo group bots, but they don't come on after the server comes up after a maintenance. So I'm stuck not having a solo group to be with. (Yet solo groups are dangerous to be in for a Jedi).
Is there any way that the system could detect when you are buffed, and give you higher level missions accordingly?
Or, PLEASE allow a wider range of difficulty when solo. Devs know we can solo more difficult missions while buffed - please allow us to choose those by ourselves. Nerf the payout, I don't care about the money. I just want to get in a good, but safe(r) grinding session. Let us choose up to level 99 missions when alone.
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