Pistoleer Archive

Message Edited by Nifty on 05-15-2005 10:19 PM

That's interesting, so basically:

1. MObs above your combat level receive a defence bonus which is factored in before any damage calculations are done.


2. You can remove this defence bonus from the mob with a combination of defence and attack debuffs and bring it down to your combat level but no further.


3. MObs below your combat level cannot have their defence reduced any further.

One thing you may want to test is if you fight a mob, say, 10 levels higher than you and you stick every attack and defence debuff you have on it and let it hit you, how much damage mitigation would you get?

If you are cl75 and fight a cl80 mob, can you debuff it down to your combat level or is there a finite percenatge that you can reduce damage by.

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Nifty wrote:

What still eludes me is weapon specific defense and the general defense. Are they considered separate or together in the calculation? Maybe specific defense vs specific offense determines hit or miss, while general deterimines the damage. I dunno.

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The weapon specific defences stack on top of your general defences, you can see this on your character sheet under status if you tick the "Show Details" checkbox.

You can see here that your total melee and renged defence includes your weapon specific defences.

Message Edited by BadgerSmaker on 05-13-2005 09:50 AM

Yet another interesting and very useful experimental analysis by Nifty! Thanks, I can definitely make use of those findings.

Basically, it seems to me that there is no point in wasting any attack rounds trying to apply states to mobs that are at or below your combat level--unless perhaps it helps others in your group by lowering its defenses relative to them. Now the question is: for mobs that are above your combat level (assuming for the moment that you're fighting solo), is there any use in wastinga couple of more damagingattack rounds just to lower the mob's defense by a few points per round? In your example above with Warning Shot, for example, followed by any other state-attack special, fired on a CL 82 mob, that sequence allowed you to hit your next couple of Ranged Shots for 812 damage each(if I am understanding what you were explaining), for as long as Warning Shot + theother state attack'seffectslasted (or does WS only last for the immediately following shot?). That's a 113-point bonus damage per shot for the next few shots (and that's assuming the state specials even stick, which is by no means a given). But if a single Critical Shot hits for, say,1000 (I don't know what it would actually hit for on a mob of this level--just picking a number for the sake of argument), and you fired two CS's in the place of the two state attacks, then it would take almost 18 attack rounds following the Warning Shot to make up for the additional damage you would have gotten from firingtwo Critical Shots (or a CS plus some other high-damage shot, to decrease the wait between shots) as your opener. That's not counting the base damage that the state attack specials deal though, and I have no idea what they are. So it's not quite as many as 18 rounds, but you get the idea.

Assuming I am correct in all my assumptions (and it's very possible that I am not), it seems to me that there is not much point in using state attacks as a solo player, even on mobs a couple of combat levels higher than you. But grouped, I could see that the cumulative effects of many players hitting the same mob with lowered defenses might make a big difference. Feel free to disputethose ideas, anyone--I haven't completely made up my mind that I am correct, and I am missing some numbers that I'd need to test these ideas.

Message Edited by Uthyr on 05-13-2005 09:22 AM

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Nifty wrote:

I hate the new forum software. If I take too long to write a reply, it totally craps out when I try to post. Hit the back button, and reply is gone. I'll re-write it later.

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So many variables, so many potential experiments, so little time...

The way I still see it at the moment, because I do most of my fighting solo (and PvE), I see no point in trying to weaken my target with states before I start doing heavy damage to it. There may be situations where I will feel differently, but considering how often the states don't even stick, it seems like I would just be wasting attack rounds. I'd also rather use my opening attack rounds to lob my CM poison and fire--I think that would probably do more damage over the course of the battle (assuming they stick) than trying to weaken the mob with states. If I was strictly a Pistoleer, I would probably be pretty disappointed at this point that so few of my specials are useful in combat, but along with my other professions, I have a much nicer collection of specials than I had pre-CU, so I have few complaints (except our too-short range!).

Hehe, the more I think about this, the less I think post-CU Pistoleer is the profession best suited to my play style. I should probably be a Carbineer or Rifleman. I'm too much of a pistoleer at heart though to change, not to mention all the credits I've spent aquiring nice pistols. Stopping Shot alone though is worth it for me. I also like the look of my toon running with his arms swinging back and forth holding a pistol, ratherthan that dainty-looking running animation when both hands are holding a larger weapon. The latter reminds me of those shots in Lord of the Rings where they photographed Hobbits (using the obvious child actor stand-ins) running away from the camera...

heh, now if only Pug was a single woman living near me...

also, I've added in some quick tests with a MR/MBH for some higher accuracy tests.

As you can see, with my accuracy, one warning shot isn't enough to get back to my reference damage, but the 275 accuracy gets back to max damage with Warning Shot (and dizzy shot too.)

Something to think about.

I've been playing around with this little revelation and it all seems correct... there seems to be no benefit for putting states on mobs lower level then you... but the benefit of putting states on mobs higher than you is still debateble as the action costs and reduction in the targets armour doesn't seem to cover the amount of damage you could have output in that time.

It seems states would only really be helpful in a group situation, but then I say that as I stick Electrolyte Drain from CM on all melee mobs and kite them, stick fire and poison on and spam quickdraw and bodyshot for damage and when Electrolyte Drains 60 secondplus timer is running out, put a stopping shot on the target and run to 10m and put Electrolyte drain back on and repeat until dead.

Doing this I have solo'd the cl87 Katarn in the Rryatt Trail and countless Krayts. States just seem a waste of time when you can just pummel the thing to death from 30m without worrying about using state moves that probably wont stick.

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BadgerSmaker wrote:

States just seem a waste of time when you can just pummel the thing to death from 30m without worrying about using state moves that probably wont stick.

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