Pilot Archive
Thread: Space Trader / Smuggler: The hunt for Master Content
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1st_Viduus
Mon Feb 07, 2005 4:29 pm
#1
Well, it's obvious that Rome wasn't built in a day, and neither was SWG:JtL.
What we have here, as a community, is an opportunity to help the Developers shape our Gaming Environment.
The real challenge is to present ideas, and the debates which ensue, in a constructive manner which can be easily interpreted and balanced by those with the power to use them, while keeping them within the realm of "what can be done".
So then, The Idea...:
JtL is, at this time, all about combat. While that's a good thing in some ways, (combat is more exciting!) it certainly isn't the end-all be-all of space!
As a matter of fact, one of the major players in the SW political scene is the Trade Consortium... a powerful entity which is not even present in SWG!
Not only that, of course... what about Private Corporations needing to ship goods and components?
Here is a proposed useage for our MP ships, necessitating the use of them to complete the following:
Factions Missions!
Being necessarily overtto ship 200units of Sienar Prototype Weapons for testing would be an awesome challenge, Shipping doesn't have to be without it's own risk! The FP and monetary reward for something completed of this magnitue should reflect that.
And this cargo should be transferable! So, if the ship carrying it is destroyed, the cargo is as well, with perhaps a % chance of recovering 1 or 2 units... but disable-and-dock with a player ship carrying these goods should also be possible.
Failure of such a mission would need to have penalties though; a hit to FP weighted on the mission itself, to a a point where of course a player cannot lose any more faction points (200). Of course at this point monetary fines would probably be rejected, but IMO they should be considered.
Perhaps 3 consecutive failures would cause a player to be demoted. A common thing in the empire, from what we see...
And of course if the lowest rank and lowest FP is at hand and there are 3 more failures... ejection from the Empire/Alliance (ground).
Why would anyone consider such drastic penalties worth the reward?
Simple. Declared (on the ground and in space) means completely consentual PvP, and as such should have both reward and penalty. If there's nothing to lose, there's simply no real challenge.
Anti-Faction missions would also be a viable counter-mission for these, intercept and retrieve.
Smuggling!
Smuggling, the career made infamous in SW by Han Solo... secret compartments in his YT-1300, the ability to drop cargo and run, ability to hide in conspicuous places...
Where are these?
While I realise not everything can be implemented, the ability to carry Cargo in MP ships is not unreasonable; as a matter of fact, it seems that the Devs are prepping the game for it already.
So then, the ability to dump it should exist as well. Faction-controlled areas should be able to scan-and-threaten Carriers...
So then, the ability to dump it should exist as well. Faction-controlled areas should be able to scan-and-threaten Carriers...
YT-1300 pilots would be unable to accept the Faction Missions, so an alternative Smuggling type mission should be available, with similar risks and rewards. Since Faction Points with Alliance/Empire would not be viable here, I'd strongly suggest creating a couple of new points systems:
- Trade Federation (Faction)
The TF is a major player in the SWU, yet is not included here. They would have special Factional missions specifically for the delivery of goods which are not sanctioned by the Empire, against the cause of the Alliance, or missions which are designed to give them a political advantage by creating friction between those factions. - Underworld Agents
Underworld agents would be characters such as Jabba the hutt and his croneys, and other interesting characters dispersed throughout the galaxy. They need not be tied directly to faction; f.ex. Reelo Baruk works in association with Jabba, but maintains his own contacts and ambitions, hoping someday to create a crime empire of his own... These Contact Points would allow players access to higher, better rewarding missions, whereas the loss of them could be countered by having something "special" to offer them... such as a cargo of Imperial Supplies that was aquired through (see next point) questionable means....
Pirates!
- New Status indicator for space!
Needless to say, 'pirating' is a big part of both the Rebel Alliance (they are, for the most part, an underground organization at this point in the story) and for those not wanting any part of the GCW. I should imagine that there are a great many Imperial Officers at all ranks that are 'just in it for the connections (or the power)', abusing it to this degree doesn't seem far fetched either.
Being Covert to perform these acts would be a necessity, else risk the name of (Faction) and that would simply be counter to the nature of the crime.
Coming across any Cargo Mission (factioned or otherwise!) and having initiated "pirate status" would allow you to disable and dock another player ship for the purpose of stealing the cargo.
Pirate Status Indicator would mean:
- You are able to attack any PC or NPC ship, but only to disable it (temporarily)
- You may steal their cargo!
- You are able to be attacked by ANY MASTER PC or NPC ship! And destroyed! REGARDLESS of faction!
The temporary disable would need to be handled differently than a destroyed object. Players who are choosing NOT to be PvP enabled should not suffer from the actions of those who want PvP. They should only be disabled for a matter of a minute or two, Hyperspace should still be possible (if initiated before disable), and Players In Missions should be untouchable.
This status addresses a seemingly long-standing issue: Lack of PvP content.
Here a player can choose to be PvP enabled with all the risks it entails, yet not pose a serious threat to those who do not --- yet still become a part of the game's environment, as much as if not more so than the NPC catalogue.
All in all, these additions/changes would:
- Give us master content!
- Give us master content!
- Give us an alternative to combat in space!
- Give us a unique use for our MP ships!
- Enrich the playing world/environment with a whole new layer of depth
- Encourage teamwork in space! Fighter escorts for example...
- Increase the Star Wars Universe immersion experience!
- Offer alternative methods to aquire specific loot/equipment (why can't Imperials get genuine Sienar equipment?)
- Enrich the economy without damaging existing balance
/dons Flame Resist Suit
Well folks/pilots..? What do you think?
(please keep the feedback {whether agreeing or disagreeing} constructive; debate is welcome, flaming is not).
Message Edited by 1st_Viduus on 02-07-2005 07:36 PM
Golrok
Mon Feb 07, 2005 5:28 pm
#2
Pirate Status Indicator would mean:
- You are able to attack any PC or NPC ship, but only to disable it (temporarily)
- You may select 1 non-critical
- You are able to be attacked by ANY MASTER PC or NPC ship! And destroyed! REGARDLESS of faction!
Sorry to say, but it will NEVER fly with all the carebears as it will "disrupt their style of play", however mundane that might be.. I love the idea myself but it doesn't happen that way in this "all styles accomodated" kind of game.
- You are able to attack any PC or NPC ship, but only to disable it (temporarily)
- You may select 1 non-critical
- You are able to be attacked by ANY MASTER PC or NPC ship! And destroyed! REGARDLESS of faction!
Sorry to say, but it will NEVER fly with all the carebears as it will "disrupt their style of play", however mundane that might be.. I love the idea myself but it doesn't happen that way in this "all styles accomodated" kind of game.
1st_Viduus
Mon Feb 07, 2005 5:38 pm
#3
Oops, sorry, was going to post one thing, reconsidered, and forgot to change it 
I edited the part out where I was going to suggest theft of an installed component be possible where the target is an overt player....
TomoRainer
Mon Feb 07, 2005 5:41 pm
#4
Do you think anyone should be able to smuggle, or only those who actually have the smuggler profession?
1st_Viduus
Mon Feb 07, 2005 5:57 pm
#5
Honestly, for space I don't see what would prevent any freelancer from smuggling. Most notably Hutt pilots...
Not "anyone" - but any "freelance" Master Pilot with a YT-1300. (no cargo space in SP ships).
IF this were implemented, later integration could include bonuses / combination missions for smugglers in particular (I'm a master smuggler myself, but not a freelance pilot -- I might change if that became viable).
Since, however, ground skills and space skills are atm completely separate entities, the short answer is "any Freelance Master Pilot".
TomoRainer
Mon Feb 07, 2005 6:55 pm
#6
I don't see what would prevent any Imperial or Rebel pilot from smuggling if they wanted, either. There's plenty of cargo space in my Decimator.
This is a very tricky issue in that it's always good to provide content for as many people as possible, but it would be extremely weird to put open smuggling in a game that already has a Smuggler profession and then limit it in such a way that factioned Smugglers couldn't even participate.
I also find it strange that people often picture smuggling as something that just anyone can do. It may be the only profession that regularly sees proposals to add content Smugglers don't even have yet and make it available to everyone. I don't see many suggestions to let everyone use the BH terminals, another job anyone could theoretically do.
It might be possible to let anyone try to smuggle, but make it difficult for anyone without Smuggler skills to be successful in their attempts. That could make for a good balance. But to put smuggling in the game, and limit it in such a way that the Smuggler profession in no way affects it, and often can't even participate.. I'd think any such system would need a serious rethinking.
This is a very tricky issue in that it's always good to provide content for as many people as possible, but it would be extremely weird to put open smuggling in a game that already has a Smuggler profession and then limit it in such a way that factioned Smugglers couldn't even participate.
I also find it strange that people often picture smuggling as something that just anyone can do. It may be the only profession that regularly sees proposals to add content Smugglers don't even have yet and make it available to everyone. I don't see many suggestions to let everyone use the BH terminals, another job anyone could theoretically do.
It might be possible to let anyone try to smuggle, but make it difficult for anyone without Smuggler skills to be successful in their attempts. That could make for a good balance. But to put smuggling in the game, and limit it in such a way that the Smuggler profession in no way affects it, and often can't even participate.. I'd think any such system would need a serious rethinking.
Zilod
Mon Feb 07, 2005 7:12 pm
#7
I agree with TomoRainer, also consider that neutrals are not just smuggler alliance but RSF and CorSec and i don't think we can say that they see smuggling as a good thing....
i think too that smuggling missions should be associated to the profession, a rebel smuggler have to avoid imperial patrols as a neutral one, but maybe he will smuggle weapons, bacta or other things instead of spice (not that neutrals carry only spice)
for imp smuggler will be a bit more difficult, but maybe they could be required to transport a cargo in a pirate or rebel space whitout attract much attention.
if there will be transport missions they could be made even for neutrals, RSF and CorSec can transport some legal but precious cargo, defending it from pirates, while smuggler alliance guys can do the same for important organizations, maybe even some mayor criminal ones.
1st_Viduus
Mon Feb 07, 2005 7:35 pm
#8
No I do understand the difference, and that it's something that "technically" anybody could do, but... as you said, adding content is tricky at best when trying to keep it even across the board.
So, I proposed smuggling as something only Freelance could do, while Rebel and Imperial get their faction missions, BUT anyone could get into Pirating, which is close to the same thing -- part of choosing a faction is giving up the perks of 2 for the perks of one....
I'm totally for smuggling "other things" -- as a master smuggler I'm rather insulted that they pegged us as little more than drug dealers, (especially in a game where kids of all ages play, you know?) and would love to have some association with ground to space smuggling.
In which case I'd need to go unfactioned in space as well. OR they would need to allow us to master a Private Sector pilot tree, so that we could have 2 sets of ships. But I don't see that happening.
As I laid it out, it seems simple enough to integrate, and tweaking here and there would probably bring about some balance.
DocDiablo
Tue Feb 08, 2005 2:08 pm
#9
Another thing I was thinking of, involving space, is mining. Space miners on floating debris, or inhabitable planets. Also, not sure if it was mentioned earlier, but there deffinatly needs to be more perks to flying...there simply is not enough traffic in space to make it interesting. I truly believe that space is actually the best part of the game, and I think many others would find it that way if you could get people up in space.
Suggestions:
-First off, merge the games in stores. For the love of God, merge the games already, that way new players will automatically have it, and not have an excuse to not go up there. As an integral part of the game, there is no reason to keep them seperate, it only keeps space segregated.
-Make some planets and systems only attainable by space. Hoth, and Dagabah come to mind. Force people to ride with a master pilot in order to get there....which will also put a bigger emphasis on getting master, and in turn put a bigger emphasis on shipwrighted master ships.
-Make multi-player ships more powerful for crying out loud. It's retarded that you couldn't possibly hope to beat anyone with a modicum of PVP knowledge with the master ships.
-These are just a few.....feel free to post more, sorry if I repeated, i didn't read the whole post.
Vegitaa
Tue Feb 08, 2005 4:36 pm
#10
Vegitaa comes flying in with the 5 star shotgun to scare away the 1 star bandits....
Nice ideas, keep em comin mate
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