Pilot Archive
Thread: Test server patch notes
Kryxal wrote:
Completely missing the point that the people who stick with this game are the people who DON'T want something like every other level-based MMORPG out there...
QFE
quadpers0n wrote:
JanuHull wrote:
Ehm, just to resummarize for Tomo. Please, lets not retrace the steps that screwed PvP before. Modify armor and shield defenses based on chassis like we already do with maneuverability and speed. NPCs already underperform in the damage department as it is, increase that modestlyand make lightfightermaneuverability as important in PvE as it is in PvP.
bingo. perfect.
I like this solution too, it's similar to the damage mitigation based upon mass idea I was talking about.
Oh and for the record, I don't particularily like the heavier ships, in fact my pride and joy is my A-Wing, it's just that I do enjoy flying the heavier ships too, and POB ships are my favourite part of space. Fact is I probably wouldn't use a B-Wing or Nova in PvP too often, I'd stick to the A-Wing or X-Wing because that's the style I like, but I'd like the option to use those heavier ships, something that I don't have right now if I want to stand any sort of chance.
More importantly though, the more types of fighters and ships you add to space battles (light fighters, medium fighters, bombers, POB ships, cap ships) the more strategy and tactics there can be, and that to me is what is most fun. Right now if there were a huge PvP battle there'd just be squads of light fighters. Someday though I hope to see a squadron of X-Wings with A-Wings as their wingmen who's target is the other figthers, a squadron of B-Wings who's target is the POB and Cap ships, a squadron of POB ships who's goal is to just get into the fray and endure everyone else, and then the Cap ships whose target is pretty much everything. Much more fun that way 
Message Edited by Feynan on 07-07-2005 02:06 PM
Message Edited by MFirestar on 07-07-2005 11:07 AM
Feynan wrote:
quadpers0n wrote:
JanuHull wrote:
Ehm, just to resummarize for Tomo. Please, lets not retrace the steps that screwed PvP before. Modify armor and shield defenses based on chassis like we already do with maneuverability and speed. NPCs already underperform in the damage department as it is, increase that modestlyand make lightfightermaneuverability as important in PvE as it is in PvP.
bingo. perfect.
I like this solution too, it's similar to the damage mitigation based upon mass idea I was talking about.
Oh and for the record, I don't particularily like the heavier ships, in fact my pride and joy is my A-Wing, it's just that I do enjoy flying the heavier ships too, and POB ships are my favourite part of space. Fact is I probably wouldn't use a B-Wing or Nova in PvP too often, I'd stick to the A-Wing or X-Wing because that's the style I like, but I'd like the option to use those heavier ships, something that I don't have right now if I want to stand any sort of chance.
More importantly though, the more types of fighters and ships you add to space battles (light fighters, medium fighters, bombers, POB ships, cap ships) the more strategy and tactics there can be, and that to me is what is most fun. Right now if there were a huge PvP battle there'd just be squads of light fighters. Someday though I hope to see a squadron of X-Wings with A-Wings as their wingmen who's target is the other figthers, a squadron of B-Wings who's target is the POB and Cap ships, a squadron of POB ships who's goal is to just get into the fray and endure everyone else, and then the Cap ships whose target is pretty much everything. Much more fun that way
Honestly I don't think we need a revamp of the full system. It'd probably help the most, but we're unlikely to get it because it's not a huge problem in the grand scheme of the game (ie. it doesn't effect a giant portion of the community) and it would take a lot of Dev time that they don't have to give out. I think the wholeadding armor and shield modifications based upon the chassis thing will work really well, we just need to figure out the values. That should be our focus, we figure out the values and Tomo gives them to the Devs, and hopefully something comes of it.Shouldn't be too hard to figure out the values, it's just that it would need some calculations and testing and concensus from the Pilot community.Message Edited by Feynan on 07-07-2005 02:06 PM
listen they fix POB ships in an appropriate way and you'll get your wish with or without any other fighter modifications i think. if my group has a decimator and that decimator is a real threat to them or their POB ships, you are going to see people clamoring to bring b-wings to take that sucker out, and vice versa on the other side.
that's one of the reasons why i think we should push push push for POBs to be fixed and fixed fast. i don't fly one, nor do i like riding in one, but imo POBs are the crown jewel of space. no other game has implemented anything like that and that implementation is not only flawless but also acurately captures the feel from the movies. if you would have told me they would turn out like that pre JTL i would have called you a fool.
so the devs have this ace in the hole with POBs and they are just squandering it, thousands of people might not be leaving because of fast paced PVP, but you can bet your bottom dollar alot of people stay out of space because POBs suck. the devs need to not waste time with this mechanic and fix it ASAP and you'll see space literally explode with people and half the problems that people normally dump on the pace of PVP disappear overnight. i mean i just can't fathom why it's not fixed immediately. why would they want to alienate subscribers? it's not like they have them in abundance.
Feynan wrote:
It's a valid idea, but there's a couple problems with it:
Balance - with random stats on components, it'd be incredibly hard to balance it properly
Customization - arguably the best feature of JtL is the ability to customize your ship to your liking; if you want a Y-Wing thatis more of a fighter then a bomber you can do that, that's the great thing. I don't think people want to give that ability and fun up.
Message Edited by MFirestar on 07-07-2005 11:26 AM
Feynan wrote:
I agree partially with that. You're right, people are gonna want more bombers in order to deal with the hopefully amazing POB ships, but you still have the problem that light fighters can take out those B-Wings without batting an eyelash.
Which is why POB gunners will be sitting in their nice and stable flying fortresses sniping those little buggers. Chassis modifications to defenses weren't just about the POBs. Oppressors, Krayts and B-Wings should be granted the advantages of enhanced defense stats as well. Y-Wings, TIE Bombers, and Rhix's could also use some defensive adjustments. Use the ultralights like the JSF or the A-Wing as a baseline, what you see on the shield is what you get, and increase based on how much maneuverability and speed they give up. The masses as they are now for ships have a very stable logic to them, except the Y-8, which based on size, should be in the 10-20 million range. Its HUGE. A Y-8 fitted for combat should scare the bejesus out of a light fighter and make the Nova, Decimator and YT-1300 a little envious.
If you think about it, this would also bring back some prominence to the Firespray, if they would make its defenses par for the course with the B-Wing/Oppressor/Krayt, and keep its decent maneuvering and speed. Truly, the AV-21 of spacecraft.
The idea is to maintain a performance balance between light, fast, and maneuverable shipsversus heavy, slow and stable ships.
Feynan wrote:
I agree partially with that. You're right, people are gonna want more bombers in order to deal with the hopefully amazing POB ships, but you still have the problem that light fighters can take out those B-Wings without batting an eyelash.
true, but you can't make them the uberships either by putting them on a level playing field with the ships designed to take them out. it's a really careful balancing act. but it's gotta start by fixing bugs and making those POBs viable first. after that, examine some kind of mechanic to give them some more defense imo.
JanuHull wrote:
Feynan wrote:
I agree partially with that. You're right, people are gonna want more bombers in order to deal with the hopefully amazing POB ships, but you still have the problem that light fighters can take out those B-Wings without batting an eyelash.
Which is why POB gunners will be sitting in their nice and stable flying fortresses sniping those little buggers. Chassis modifications to defenses weren't just about the POBs. Oppressors, Krayts and B-Wings should be granted the advantages of enhanced defense stats as well. Y-Wings, TIE Bombers, and Rhix's could also use some defensive adjustments. Use the ultralights like the JSF or the A-Wing as a baseline, what you see on the shield is what you get, and increase based on how much maneuverability and speed they give up. The masses as they are now for ships have a very stable logic to them, except the Y-8, which based on size, should be in the 10-20 million range. Its HUGE. A Y-8 fitted for combat should scare the bejesus out of a light fighter and make the Nova, Decimator and YT-1300 a little envious.
If you think about it, this would also bring back some prominence to the Firespray, if they would make its defenses par for the course with the B-Wing/Oppressor/Krayt, and keep its decent maneuvering and speed. Truly, the AV-21 of spacecraft.
The idea is to maintain a performance balance between light, fast, and maneuverable shipsversus heavy, slow and stable ships.
i would be really really interested in discovering the efficiency of turret based guns vs light fighters. this is a point tomo was making earlier, you crank up the defense on a POB and is it really viable in taking out the lighter ships? imo it has to be so if those turrets arent viable something needs to be done to change that.
i know i've been shot once or twice by a POB in DS while i was charging it, does anyone else have any experience vs a light ship?
quadpers0n wrote:
true, but you can't make them the uberships either by putting them on a level playing field with the ships designed to take them out. it's a really careful balancing act. but it's gotta start by fixing bugs and making those POBs viable first. after that, examine some kind of mechanic to give them some more defense imo.
Agreed, they definately shouldn't be uber, they should be able to survive though, they should be able to endure the attacks of a light fighter for a significant amount of time, though they're gonna have lots of difficulty actually taking a light fighter out simply because it's hard to get them in the reticle (but if they do, the light fighter would probably be blown up fast).
Also agree though in that bug fixes need to change. WO3 to start with, and balance the ROTW ships, until that's done no matter what system we come up with it'll be flawed.
quadpers0n wrote:
JanuHull wrote:
Feynan wrote:
I agree partially with that. You're right, people are gonna want more bombers in order to deal with the hopefully amazing POB ships, but you still have the problem that light fighters can take out those B-Wings without batting an eyelash.
Which is why POB gunners will be sitting in their nice and stable flying fortresses sniping those little buggers. Chassis modifications to defenses weren't just about the POBs. Oppressors, Krayts and B-Wings should be granted the advantages of enhanced defense stats as well. Y-Wings, TIE Bombers, and Rhix's could also use some defensive adjustments. Use the ultralights like the JSF or the A-Wing as a baseline, what you see on the shield is what you get, and increase based on how much maneuverability and speed they give up. The masses as they are now for ships have a very stable logic to them, except the Y-8, which based on size, should be in the 10-20 million range. Its HUGE. A Y-8 fitted for combat should scare the bejesus out of a light fighter and make the Nova, Decimator and YT-1300 a little envious.
If you think about it, this would also bring back some prominence to the Firespray, if they would make its defenses par for the course with the B-Wing/Oppressor/Krayt, and keep its decent maneuvering and speed. Truly, the AV-21 of spacecraft.
The idea is to maintain a performance balance between light, fast, and maneuverable shipsversus heavy, slow and stable ships.
i would be really really interested in discovering the efficiency of turret based guns vs light fighters. this is a point tomo was making earlier, you crank up the defense on a POB and is it really viable in taking out the lighter ships? imo it has to be so if those turrets arent viable something needs to be done to change that.
i know i've been shot once or twice by a POB in DS while i was charging it, does anyone else have any experience vs a light ship?
One of my own experiences in a POB versus a light fighter was a very quick death. Two shots off the starboard aft, and I was gone. This was with Type V armor and shields.
My only other knowldge of PvP performance in a POB was a Decimator present at a PvP event in Kashyyyk space. 4 shots and dead. He had a full array of POB components.