Pikeman Archive
Thread: Bleeds?
we get powerboost
we get force-of-will
we get the other benefits of the meditation line (bleed/poison/disease/wounds)
we can attack any HAM pool on demand
no one else has these abilities.
fencers, swordsmen, and pikers get bleeds. they target ONE pool each. they get no self-buffs, nor do they have our range of debuffs.
would I like bleeds? sure. do I think we need them?no. do we 'deserve' them?definitely not.
really, if you want bleeds, it's simple enough to take the appropriate brawler, marksman, or elite combat profession in addition to TKA.
ok well.......im a trans
if my giant claws on my hands and feet (not to mention my teeth) cannot make you bleed then what can?
the pikeman bleed is cool though (area bleed)
the question isn't whether you could make something bleed from hitting it.
a 'bleed' in SWG has nothing to do with whether or not something is leaking fluids... it is simply a name for a DOT type... poison and 'on fire' are also DOT states, the difference between them being in how the state is treated. bleeds can be treated by a medic. poison needs a doc. 'on fire' needs water.
a 'mind bleed' doesn't mean that you've cracked someone's skull, and their intracerebral juice is spilling out. the rifle mindbleeds are listed as 'distracting shot' and 'mind bender', which implies that these shots are not causing physical damage, but rather draining the mind pool. a low mind pool will lead to an incap... but more importantly, it means that a doc can't 'concentrate' enough to use a stim, or a rifleman can't 'focus' enough to aim and fire a special shot.
again, it'd be great to have a bleed. and to have a lot of other things we don't have now. but I don't see how it is necessary, nor why we 'deserve' a DOT with the skillpoints we currently spend. if you want TWO health bleeds, you can take marksman (for 15) to pistol 4 (14 pts) to novice pistoleer (6 more).
we get a lot of offense, and a lot of defence. we don't get crafting skills. we don't get ranged combat. we don't get to run up hills, or take meat from critters. we can't play an instrument, or dance. we don't DIRECTLY get med skills (though a selfbuff (doc skill). a bleed (medic) poison (doc) disease (doc) wound (medic/doc) heal, and a way to come back from an incap, are all pretty nice).
ifyou really want to craft, or shoot, or heal, or anything TKA can't do within the profession... you have skill points left over. novice TKA only takes 35 skill points.
Pem wrote:
Mister_Heavy,
I believe we are truly blessed to have you as our correspondent, and I thank you whole-heartedly for the work you have done for our profession.
The ability to cure bleeds hardly makes up for the ability to cause them. First, we need to be in meditation mode, which requires we cannot be influenced by a variety of conditions. If the fight lasts long enough or heaven forbid we are being kited, this does very little for us. We bleed until we incap. I invested in the First Aid medic tree for other reasons, but for bleeds it comes in more handily than meditation most of the time. Mainly it is most useful when my pets are bleeding. I don't do PVP, but there are some creatures that cause bleeding. The Frenzied Graul comes to mind.
I don't mean to be argumentative and am certainly not trolling, but your last statement confuses me. Are youn implying that bleeds are the only keeping TKA's from doing everything else another profession can do? They don't have their own unique abilities? Granted, I don't have any ranged abilities because I enjoy melee so much, but can't they do KD as well? I thought that was supposed to be our big weapon, atleast others poured their tears into a glass and sent it to the devs.Now KD is on a 30 second inbetween timer. And, from my understandingranged KD lasts as long as ours. Sure we get warcry, but as a brawler, not specifically TK related. Do ranged opponents not get the damage modifier we do when hitting a KD'd opponent? I just cannot agree that providing TKA's with the option to bleed with specially modified VK's is giving Teras Kasithe whole Carrrion Spat. Unless I am mistaken, upon examination, VK's are edged weapons. As I turn them around with the camera, I don't seem to notice that all sides are blunt.
I do agree that we would be very overpowered if TKA's could do everything else on top of our own special abilities, but even if you included bleed, that would be far from all inclusive. I personally feel that no playershould have bleed skills. It is simply the gift that keeps on giving.
Good Luck and Good Hunting to All,
Pem Aoldon - Master Teras Kasi Artist/Master Creature Handler - Shadowfire
Pem,
We'll neve make this profession better if we can't discuss things, disagree, and have that be Ok. So I always welcome anyone who disagrees with anything I say to call me on it. And as long as they make a reasoned argument, as you do, I actually enjoy a good debate. 
No it's notjustbleeds that keepTKAs from doing it all, but it's close. I don't really want to get into the ranged vs melee debate here, because that's a much larger issue, but as TKAs we have access to the broadest ability set of any non-hybridprofession. We can target any pool, we have all the debuffs, we have AoE attacks (spin), we have the unique advantages of the med line, we have KD anddizzy, heck we have a knockdown-dizzy.It's a pretty impressive list.
We're currently limited to kinetic damage, but that's likely to change. Smugglers got the feign death skill,and pikemen have an AOE knockdown that's pretty nice, but beyond that, all we're missing is bleeds. The question becomes where to draw the line from a game mechanics point of view. It's true that most of our skills can be found in other professions, but every profession also has its drawbacks.
ATM, I'm working up the Fencer tree (stinkin' holocron). And while I could have happily lived the rest of my life without grinding through another melee profession, it has given me some interesting perspecitives on TKA's strengths. Fencers, for example, never get a knockdown skill. They also never get any way to target the mind pool, or the action pool for that matter. They can't stun, they can't self buff, they can't pull themselves out of an incap (we will get FoW fixed), cure bleeds, diseases, poisons, wounds, etc. Fencers have their own strenghts, but they're different from ours, which is kinda the point.
Disclaimer - I've said it before, but just in case... Hopefully you guys all know by now that I try to keep my personal opinions out of what we recommend to the devs in our State of the Profession (SoP) thread. Just because (for example) I don't think we need bleed attacks, doesn't mean that I won't take that request right to the developers if the boardreaches a concensusthat we should.
We do block, when you use CoB, you block much more often, but it is listed as counterattack in your combat log. As for the bleeds, those were changed in the last publish. Also removed was the ability to stack DoTs on the same pool (per player).
antares
master pikeman
It seems that in many respects the pikeman is having to take 2nd place to the swordsman, why is this?...They seem to be able to do all that we can and then some, is this likely to change in the upcoming combat changes? I'm currently about half way through pikeman and enjoying it no end but i can't help but notice that so far 'Pikeman' seems to meen slow moving swordsman :-/
The combat revamp will fulfill all players desires and greatly enahance everyones playing time. No one will complain about their profession ever ever ever again when the combat revamp is done because the combat revamp will handle all.
Or so we are told.
atimes wrote:The combat revamp will fulfill all players desires and greatly enahance everyones playing time. No one will complain about their profession ever ever ever again when the combat revamp is done because the combat revamp will handle all.
Or so we are told.
I'm concerned that TH's big push with the combat passes is the new HAM system. I don't see how a new way of handling HAM will make my defenses equal those who have 2x as much, or how that will increase my accuracy or speed.
antares
master pikeman