Musician Archive

Thread: Money making idea for musicians

picklesSW
Tue Jul 13, 2004 1:27 pm
#1

I think your typical powergamer combat type would buy your 'holorecordings' in crates of 50 and just heal wounds in the field as he got them, and never step foot into a cantina again.

Maybe that's a good thing as you suggest. I'm not sure.




jamessolecki
Tue Jul 13, 2004 2:09 pm
#2

So if he buys crates of 50, who would be making money? The musician that crafted it... If you want more people in the cantina have a concert, throw a party. Or something that will draw a crowd.
picklesSW
Tue Jul 13, 2004 2:59 pm
#3

What about the entertainers that did not choose this profession to be crafters? They want to perform for live people and socialize. Certainly they'd be more wealthy, but is that all that's important to an entertainer?




jamessolecki
Tue Jul 13, 2004 3:09 pm
#4

Ok for the people that want to perform for live people and socialize I think it could help them.... First it would remove people that don't really want to be in a cantina from the cantina. Second because of less people in the cantina entertainers couldn't just afk all day and get the xp they need. There would be a need to actually entertain... Would you rather go to a crowded cantina filled with afk macro people and heal and dash hunters, or a cantina that has a live band playing with dancers dancing and people in there conversing and interacting?
Xyrdre
Tue Jul 13, 2004 4:21 pm
#5




Including healing mechanics in such a craftable device creates a whole world of problems.


It's a well-meaning idea, with the intent of finding another way for musicians to make some money. But... there are some very nasty problems associated with it, and ones that are not easily solved. It becomes a question of how such a thing would change our environment once implemented.



Healing Mechanic Considerations



Any discussion of crafted items that perform entertainer healing services must also bring up the question of the healing XP associated with it. We'd have to assume that either there would be no entertainer healing XPgeneratedwhen a device was used for BF/mind wound healing, or that the XP would go to the crafter who made it the device.


If there is no ent healing XP gained by device use, everyone loses out. No one gets any of that hard to come by experience.


If the crafter that made the device gets the XP, then up to 19 other people lose out. When someone in need of ent healing comes into the cantina, there is generally a lot of bonus XP being generated there. Remember that the XP is not divided amongst the entertainer group involved with the healing... all members of that group gain. If a patron watches an ungrouped entertainer, one batch of XP is generated. If that same patron watches a group of 20, then 20 times the amount of experience is being generated for the entertainer community, as all group members get it. Looking at it this way, it is likely that such a situation would, rather than discourage AFK in cantinas, instead prolong the amount of time that those who are AFKing need to be there to get all that healing XP they'd bemissing out on.


The alternative, of course, would be to then do away with entertainer healing XP altogether. But, to do away with that, we must acknowledge that entertainer healing is not a part of our skillsets. If it isn't a part of our skillsets, then there is no basis for entertainers having those game mechanics in the first place, and the concepts of BF and mind wound healing by entertainers must also be abandoned. Abandon those, and there is no need for the crafted items...



EconomicConsiderations


Some of those datadisk craftingentertainers might become more wealthy. That is, if they had the cash up front to buy the resources, harvesters and factoriesrequired for mass-production crafting, and didn't mind changing from their preferred social playstyle to the solitary withdrawn life of the crafter for the time it would take to prep these devices, maintain harvester and factory runs, etc.



Economically speaking, things get even worse. I don't thinkanyone will argue that in crafting, it takes money to make money.Only those who could afford to start up this production business could hope to compete... and with a tip of the hat to the healing XP considerations above, how would Novice Entertainers ever be able to become Novice Musicians or Dancers without the capital to go into business as healing XP crafters? If we were to make these devices only craftable by Novice Musician, or even Master Musicians, does that not in turn (as shown above) stymie the ability for future generations of musicians to gain the healing lines required for those skills?And one would have to ask... if they were particularly interested in being crafters, would they not have started out as Novice Artisan?


This could inturnbecome a means of cornering the entertainer healing XP market through credits. Combat players would buy the most effective/least expensive crates of EntHealing Datadisks available. Any crafting musician that could afford to put out the better crafted product for the lowest price could essentially form a monopoly on entertainer healing XP... even if they were capped on it. In the pursuit of profits, they would be robbing the rest of the entertainer community of thathealing XP, which ishard enough to come by as it is.


Andhow would quality of such devices be determined? Perhapsthe Instrument Assembly skill could come into play, becoming like experimentation points? Then only those who could afford to buy +25 Instrument Assembly SEA's wouldsee any regular purchases, as they would have the superior product - just like we see withthe other crafting professions - thus reducing the number of beneficiariesof such a system even further.Even amongst those few that rose to the top of the Crafting Musician profession, all of that would come down to who had the most money to put in.




When we follow the probable direction that such suggestions would lead, these things just aren't as attractive as they seemed up front. What starts out as an idea to help out musicians, with all the best intentions, can turn sour in the aftermath, and these are some of my predictions surrounding the notion of crafted-device generated entertainer healing of any kind. It's just a road that I don't think we want to travel, once we think about it. It would likely degenerate the social playstyle into a subset of the crafting playstyle, would favor the wealthy, and disrupt our interdependency into the greater game environment.






Deila Karlossi , Blue Glowie of Dancers, and become more powerful than you could possibly imagine...
Padtai
Tue Jul 13, 2004 4:58 pm
#6


Musician may have a sort of "crafting" line in making instruments, but musician is not a "crafting" profession any more than dancer is.


Now admittedly, there are people who choose musician for different reaons, but I think it boils down to 5main ones:

1) artistic(Likes to do performances)

2) social (wants to use the game mainly as a roleplay/chat)

3) healing (wans to have a skill to share with guild/group members)

4) badge (expect to vanish after publish 10 but you never know)

5) service vendor (highly dependant on ability to AFK and macro, uses profession for cash cow or as slave to main character)


Entertainers need an audience, and if you give people even more ways to avoid having to be that audience, the entertainers willl RARELYhave a chance to perform, heal orchat with other players. My guess is only a small percentage of players HATE the idea of social down time in a cantina, and that there are also only a small percentage that ENJOY it.. Everyone else probably falls somewhere in between--they dont mind "hanging out" in the cantina or starport for a little bit during each play session, especially when they're trying to figure out what adventure to go do that day, who's on, or what other "gossip" is on in the galaxy. That said... if you give every playeran excuse not to go to the cantina-- they'll go there less and less.The same way if you allowed NPC's to sell composite armor, weapons and food--very few players would then "choose" to deal with a player character vendor over the NPC (assuming the goods were of equal quality). Yes some would still buy from players...but out of convenience, those who really only play the game to hunt (whether PVP or PVE) would end up going with the NPC goods. So most reasonable players will admit that while the shopping downtimeand cantina down time might at times be an annoyance, those experiences can sometimes be fun, and whether or not they are fun , the down time is needed for game balance tomake the crafter game and entertaining games work, creating a broader player base, allowing the game to have some variety.

The unreasonable players will say they don't care about the crafting or entertaining games, so they should be able to avoid it as much as possible using whatever means necessary, regardless of how unbalanced that makes the game.


Anyway, giving musicians things to sell is not necessarily a bad idea, but giving them something to sell because you think this will help filter out those who hate socializing from cantinas is bad since it will filter out MOST people not just those who hate cantinas. It would filter me out anyway.


But as musician isn't my class, maybe I'm thinking about what those of you who do play the class want the wrong way.... maybe more of you just picked musician to be a different type of healer since there were so many doctors around, or thought it would be a good way to make money, not because you really want to socialize or perform. In that case, then the idea isn't really a bad one...but it does make musicians more of a hybrid crafter (the way smugglers and doctors are) than well, an entertainer.


Eaca
Tue Jul 13, 2004 6:39 pm
#7

What she said plus it would screw dancers unless you gave them something to craft, which would again screw the newbies even worse, turn the ent field into an anti-social crafting profession with the exception of established buff bots. Anything you give us to make the rest of the comunity less dependant on us makes them entirely independant of us. If established ents don't quickly act to fill this gap power gamers would grind out musicians or dancers as fast as they could and then flood the market with holo discs making us completely un-needed.


Here's a suggestion for making money, greet every person who walks into the cantina with a /setperf whether they ask for it or not, if somebody asks make them next. Flourish as fast as you can and do the buffs in 3 minutes instead of 10. You can make 100-200k a day ATK just buffing once you establish yourself. We got the means to make money, just use it
Kinect
Tue Jul 13, 2004 9:37 pm
#8

instead of the musicians crafting them..a artistan should make the tapes or playables and the musicians would have to record songs on them or something along those lines then resell them

jamessolecki
Wed Jul 14, 2004 12:34 am
#9


Not sure if anyone has thought of this before but it sounded like a good idea to me, I could be wrong though.


Give musicians the ability to craft mp3s or something similar that could be sold. These then can be taken out into battles and played to help heal bf and mind wounds.... Just and idea.
picklesSW
Wed Jul 14, 2004 12:44 am
#10

What effect do you think that'd have on cantinas, if people could just buy what are essentially stimpacks to heal mind wounds and battle fatigue?




jamessolecki
Wed Jul 14, 2004 12:51 am
#11

If you had the choice to pay x amount of money to heal you or had a cantina right there and can do if for free which would you choose. It is more of an idea to make money for musicians. It wouldn't work as well as actually sitting there and watching or listening to someone... And it might take several of these little thingys to help out....


As for what it would do to the cantina, well nothing worse then the almighty AFKers.... Would you rather have someone that just wants to heal up and run or save the room for people that are there to RP or enjoy the entertainment....
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