Musician Archive
Thread: Please Give Master Musicinas the Mandoviol/Ceremonial song!
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BlakeBilbo1
Thu May 12, 2005 10:25 pm
#1
I have Master Artisan/Musician/Entertainer. I would like to have some decent combat skills to protect myself, as I check my harvesters, travel to different areas, etc. butI need to have Master Entertainer to play that blasted Mandovial. I love the instrument, I play it 90% of the time, but unfortunately, master entertainer has eaten up a big chunk of my skill points, soI can't pursue . And besides, doesn't the desription of Master Musician say something like "...has knowlege of*ALL* songs and instruments?"
What the heck does dancing and Image Designing have to do with playing a stringed instrument? It just doesnt make sense.
Would anyone be for/against giving the Mandoviol and Ceremonial song to the MASTER MUSICIANS, where they belong?
Mentalbug
Fri May 13, 2005 3:27 am
#2
This is quite an old debate, but with the CU I admit that I could use those spare skill points my Precious, Mine, Mandoviol, My own..(*COUGH* sorry) is currently eating heh 
I already tried to drop my master musician skill to Musician 0040 to see if it helps but I feel kinda ill without it...
I already tried to drop my master musician skill to Musician 0040 to see if it helps but I feel kinda ill without it...
NJ62
Fri May 13, 2005 4:58 am
#4
This debate has gone on a looong time. It shouldn't feel "necessary" to have master entertainer, but it should have its own unique abilities instead of making another profession complete (i.e. master artisan contains vehicles, which don't "fit in" to another profession.)
Petronela
Fri May 13, 2005 6:41 am
#5
I know it would make it "easier" to put Ceremonial/Mando in a Musician tree, but I for one like it where it's at now.
There HAS to be a reason to master entertainer.
As it stands now IDs have absolutely no reason to, dancershave so-so reason,but in all honesty if it was not for Ceremonial and Mando I wouldn't bother with Ent Masterfor the 2 dances alone.
I would actually like to see the opposite of original proposal and wish Ent Master would have something more added to it, to make it more tempting for IDs and Dancers also.
*shrugs*
but then, that's just me......
Tralmek
Fri May 13, 2005 7:29 am
#6
BlakeBilbo1 wrote:
Would anyone be for/against giving the Mandoviol and Ceremonial song to the Master Musicians?
I've always been against moving Mando and Ceremonial to Master Musician, because they are the only reason many people see to pick up Master Entertainer. No one would pick it up for the +10 bonus to Ent wound healing.
I don't believe Mandoviol should be reshuffled over to Musician, because that would be raising one profession's skills while nerfing another's. A better solution would be to add a new instrument with a stringed voice to Musician. This makes Master Entertainer pretty much equally undesirable to all of its elite professions. It might be wanted a little bitfor a spare song and a couple of dance variations.
When the Entertainer Revamp comes around, I imagine a lot of things will be changing, so at that point, it would probably be OK to move Mandoviol and Ceremonial to Musician. They should probably also move Footloose 2 and Formal 2 to Dancer. (I'm guessing in a pre-launch version of the game, that's where these used to be anyway)As compensation other things could be added to Master Entertainer, things all of the Entertainer Elite profession would desire, but which would not be absolutely essential to having a "full knowledge" of the elite profession.
/begin edit
It is already possible for Musicians to have the Mando's voice and even the Ceremonial song through the magic of Playback modules.
Message Edited by Tralmek on 05-13-2005 08:48 AM
Fragpuppie
Fri May 13, 2005 7:43 am
#7
If one thinks about Master Entertainer as it relates to Musician and Master Artisan as it relates to say....Architect, the relationship is the same...sorta.
A Master Artisan is needed to make some components in Architect Items, however it is not essential to have one for the other. The architect can buy those components.
In a similar vein, a musician can hire a Master Entertainer for Madoviol or for Ceremonial.
The problem is that an Arcitect can make all the finished products of their profession, but Musicains cannot without Master Entertainer also.
I don't mind needing Master Entertainer to have all instruments and songs, however as was stated by another, there needs to be other reasons for people to master Entertainer. There are no "speeders". Maybe if they introduced something like a Jukebox that could play tunes without needing a full band, Master Entertainers could make that.....oh wait there is one, but its available from NPCs (GRRRRRRR).
I will say that I DO mind having to spend 140 skill points to do so in its current state. I am happy that mastering musician is no longer MORE points than a combat profession, but I no longer think that they are WORTH the same amount with the CU changes. I do not want it to cost less, I want it to do more. However, that is more of a profession type/playstyle fix that is needed. Hopefully the rumored Entertainer Revamp will address that issue.
Fragpuppie Uber
Master Musician/Master Entertainer
A Master Artisan is needed to make some components in Architect Items, however it is not essential to have one for the other. The architect can buy those components.
In a similar vein, a musician can hire a Master Entertainer for Madoviol or for Ceremonial.
The problem is that an Arcitect can make all the finished products of their profession, but Musicains cannot without Master Entertainer also.
I don't mind needing Master Entertainer to have all instruments and songs, however as was stated by another, there needs to be other reasons for people to master Entertainer. There are no "speeders". Maybe if they introduced something like a Jukebox that could play tunes without needing a full band, Master Entertainers could make that.....oh wait there is one, but its available from NPCs (GRRRRRRR).
I will say that I DO mind having to spend 140 skill points to do so in its current state. I am happy that mastering musician is no longer MORE points than a combat profession, but I no longer think that they are WORTH the same amount with the CU changes. I do not want it to cost less, I want it to do more. However, that is more of a profession type/playstyle fix that is needed. Hopefully the rumored Entertainer Revamp will address that issue.
Fragpuppie Uber
Master Musician/Master Entertainer
Echinacea
Sat May 14, 2005 8:50 am
#8
That's not wholly correct. When I knew I was going to have to drop Master Entertainer yet again to keep my Swordsman mastery, I recorded my favorite songs with the mandoviol onto my two playback droids...except for Ceremonial. Because, um, if I drop Master Entertainer, I can't play that song. Anyone who can, can play the mandoviol. So I recorded Ceremonial on the Narlagon, since I've come across more than a few performers who mastered Entertainer but not Musician.
Tralmek wrote:
It is already possible for Musicians to have the Mando's voice and even the Ceremonial song through the magic of Playback modules.
I still think the Ommni Box would be more appropriate in the Master Entertainer box. That would give a percussion instrument before Musician Knowledge II, and put both the floor model instruments in the Master boxes.
Chessack
Tue May 17, 2005 1:35 pm
#9
I think Master Ent should have unique elements to it. I really like that Master Ents are rare (I only know 3 besides myself on my entire server), and thus the Mandi and the Ceremonial song are rare. Almost any band is likely to have someone who can whip out a Nalg and start playing the keys... but a Mandi, those you almost never see (I only see one when I am playing it, for the most part, LOL). I like that about the Mandi... And I'd prefer if they kept it that way.
Rather than move the song and instrument around, what I'd like them to do is give the Chid and Kloo horns DIFFERENT SOUNDS compared to the Fizzz (instead of them all sounding the same). The same goes for Ommni and Fill, and for Slither/Fanfar/Trazz.
The real problem is that there are only a few sounds and so with that limited repertoire the Mandi becomes a hot item. If every instrument had a unique sound the Mandi would still be cool and different, without representing 20% of all the music sounds in the game.
And while they're at it I want them to re-record the Mandi on the Funk track. It sounds like an old record on a phonograph with a bad needle... but that's a topic for another day.
C
Rather than move the song and instrument around, what I'd like them to do is give the Chid and Kloo horns DIFFERENT SOUNDS compared to the Fizzz (instead of them all sounding the same). The same goes for Ommni and Fill, and for Slither/Fanfar/Trazz.
The real problem is that there are only a few sounds and so with that limited repertoire the Mandi becomes a hot item. If every instrument had a unique sound the Mandi would still be cool and different, without representing 20% of all the music sounds in the game.
And while they're at it I want them to re-record the Mandi on the Funk track. It sounds like an old record on a phonograph with a bad needle... but that's a topic for another day.
C
Llane-Andaril-Lightbringe
Wed May 18, 2005 2:19 am
#10
I think we're all having the same opinion on this. Master Entertainer without Ceremonial and Mandoviol? I'd be dropping it right away. Footloose isn't exactly my fav dance and formal2 isn't reason enough to spend all those points. I also always thought the holoemotes should move to Master Entertainer, would give IDs a reason to get it maybe.
Hijo
Sat May 21, 2005 11:01 pm
#11
I think it's a pretty weak argument to say that mandovial and ceremonial should be moved just because you want it, and you don't want to have to give up some of your other skills for it. The whole skill system is designed around making choices and making sacrifices. If it's so important to you to play the mandovial, then MAKE SOME SACRIFICES so you can play it. Speaking from experience, I can say that learning to play any instrument well requires a hell of a lot of sacrifice... so there's your RP reason behind it too.
Hijo
Sat May 21, 2005 11:04 pm
#12
Llane-Andaril-Lightbringer wrote:
I also always thought the holoemotes should move to Master Entertainer, would give IDs a reason to get it maybe.
I like the idea of giving IDs something in ME, but I think holoemotes are a bit extreme... I definitely feel they should have some unique hairstyles or something.
psikobunny
Sun May 22, 2005 12:35 pm
#13
Hijo wrote:
Llane-Andaril-Lightbringer wrote:
I also always thought the holoemotes should move to Master Entertainer, would give IDs a reason to get it maybe.
I like the idea of giving IDs something in ME, but I think holoemotes are a bit extreme... I definitely feel they should have some unique hairstyles or something.
Something unique for each race, or a special holoemote. All the holoemote no. A mammal-centric thing like hair, no.
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