Musician Archive
Thread: another idea to help stop buff bots
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Hairycarpet
Thu Jan 20, 2005 8:31 am
#1
firstly let me say, generally I have no problem with folks running or using buff bots - flame all you like I dont care, Ive yet to hear and good arguments for or against tbh.
I do have a problem with them where they are not wanted by other entertainers, as I do with spammers and spam droids and afk ents who sing or beg (and this is what we are talking about I think). So to me the fix is so damn simple, prevent buffs working in NPC cantinas for everyone.
Now we have those who want buff bots using their own house/cantina - as is their right to do
NPC cantinas free from buffbots BUT far more importantly life in player cantinas
I know this may appear draconian (its only an idea) but I dont think changing the macro system will make much difference and will have more harmful effects on this and other professions.
I do have a problem with them where they are not wanted by other entertainers, as I do with spammers and spam droids and afk ents who sing or beg (and this is what we are talking about I think). So to me the fix is so damn simple, prevent buffs working in NPC cantinas for everyone.
Now we have those who want buff bots using their own house/cantina - as is their right to do
NPC cantinas free from buffbots BUT far more importantly life in player cantinas
I know this may appear draconian (its only an idea) but I dont think changing the macro system will make much difference and will have more harmful effects on this and other professions.
Mariki
Thu Jan 20, 2005 9:36 am
#2
I think a lot of problems could have been prevented if people had policed themselves.
There are people who want to do buffs in cantinas but their abilities are hampered when a buffbot is doing them. If that buffbot had been in a private house or cantina, I don't think there would have been a problem. Removing all buffing from city cantinas is not the solution. Unfortunately since people did not police themselves and kept the buffbots from the city cantinas, people look for someone else to do this police work and thats the CSR's. The CSR's don't want this police work so they look to the dev's for an answer.
The plain simple fact is that buffbots are a form of greifing to live performers, They take away a source of income while not even being there. They are NPC's doing the job that was created for life entertainers to do. That is the problem, not the fact that it occurs in a city cantina. Too often everyone is forced to suffer when a "fix" is applied to combat a small minority of abusers. Personally I am really sick and tired of these "fixes" and certainly one that stops ATK entertainers from doing their jobs is NOT the fix.
JuntSmoka
Thu Jan 20, 2005 10:11 am
#3
The problem is buffbots are much, much better at giving buffs than live performers. A lot of master musicians/dancers I've talked to don't even know how to buff.
Another problem is the masters who refuse to buff, then complain about the buffbots. To the average combantant, an entertainer's job is to heal their mind and battle fatigue, then maybe give a buff if they have the skill. I'm sure that's not the way the entertainer community wants things, but that's the cold, hard truth. Most combantants don't care to, or even want to talk to the entertainer, because quite frankly, a lot of entertainers are perpetually grumpy, beggng for money, or are just so strange you don't want any interaction with them.
bcre8iv
Thu Jan 20, 2005 10:19 am
#4
Hairycarpet wrote:
Now we have those who want buff bots using their own house/cantina - as is their right to do
No, actually the devs have stated that AFK nonplay (as I refuse to call it actual play) was not meant to be in the game at all -- in any shape form or fashion. That means that people do not have a right to run buffbots anywhere, no matter what you or I think.
Personally, I'd like to hear your argument for why they should be allowed to be in game, because I've heard several people argue for why they should not be in game, and if I recall correctly someone posted directly above this post doing just that. I've seen entire essays on the harm and destruction buffbots cause the game and entertainers alike. I've seen arguments where people have completely removed any emotion attached to the subject and actually tried to discuss the pure hard facts with the opposing side. But all the opposing side is interested in is saying "Nuh-uh! I can have my buffbot if I want because I pay my $15 a month just like you!" or some other trivial statement, and most of the time they can't even take the time to use proper grammar/spelling (hint: this board has a spellcheck, it works).
So now I'm ready to hear a good, intelligent, well-stated argument for why buffbots should be in the game.
Shorrim2
Thu Jan 20, 2005 5:14 pm
#5
It doesn't need any work on the part of the devs. We just need SOE to tell the CSRs that no action will be taken against players who grief buffbots. Then we can group them to keep them away from their customers, train rancors and dark jedi masters on them, group with them and change songs, or stop the band, the whole slew of tricks.
It would be nicer if at some point the ability to macro our profession was fixed, but the immediate problem can be cured by one email.
It would be nicer if at some point the ability to macro our profession was fixed, but the immediate problem can be cured by one email.
Warryyr
Thu Jan 20, 2005 5:36 pm
#6
The Devs have stated that they do not approve of AFK playing, and changing the macro system to not allow extended AFK play is their intention.
Since they've stated their intention to change the macro system to not allow AFK play, buffbots or AFK combatbots or AFK docbots will eventually be dealt with.
Although I am personally against any extended AFK play, I admit that the current system allows it, and any form of griefing a player that is doing what is currently considered acceptable in the game is still griefing and has serious repercussions.
I appreciate your suggestion of not allowing buffs working in NPC cantinas for everyone, but from my perspective this will hurt those who are actively playing the game as the Devs intended it to be played.
Once the macro system is adjusted to prevent extended AFK play, botting in any form will be extremely difficult to do, and will most likely involve a 3rd party program which has always been in violation of the Terms of Service. The macro change will allow CSR's to take appropriate action against AFK players.
Your concern of the macro system having harmful effects on both Entertainers and other professions has been heard loud and clear by the Devs, and they understand this will NOT be an easy change to make.
The Devs, however, seem to have been very receptive to how removal of recursive (looping) macros will affect many professions, and they have asked that such concerns be brought to their attention.
I'd recommend voicing your concerns over certain actions in-game that might be made difficult/impossible due to the macro change, and once they announce they're working on changing the macro system, please please voice your concerns. It will help the game overall and let them tend to AFK play, but still allowing people to macro common and repetitive tasks in a convenient way to make such actions easier.
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