Medic Archive

Thread: Combat Medic and Medic, The Role

Kraftomatic
Mon Jul 12, 2004 7:01 pm
#1


Ok this was first a reply to a post in the combat medic forum that was locked, the post itself I replied in was locked due to it's "violation" of community policies. (The original poster was sort of "nerf nerf nerf!" so I guess that is why it got locked) However my response I feel is sort of constructive enough that I'd like to discuss it here, since it ties directly into the medic profession and deals with the roles. My reply started off objective and I actually presentedan arguement- then I illustrate and try to make some points. I know it may sound a little nerf cryish in the beginning but this is a style of writing I used in this post to "speak" in a catchy contemporary, excitingsort of way, please don't take it as an insult or flame, I'm just looking for some healthy criticism or if this is something other players can agree with me on:



I always thought itwas reallyridiculous that I had to spendskillpoints (quite alot of them actually)and MASTER a whole profession (Medic) and pick up Elite skills in doctorjust to counter ONE single class (that isn't even an offensive class or true combat class for that reason) out of what...10 combat classes / hybrids? I don't even consider combat medic a true hybrid, combat medic grabs ONE tree from marksman..and they have to master the whole MEDIC profession.. I see the ROLE of combat medic heavily derived from the medic profession itself - that is AID and HEAL those in COMBAT. Not to be a main weapon and means to defeat and fight people. (With Doc it is mighty hard to heal your group in combat, you have to be within 6 meters of them and this is incredibly hard, doctors aren't meant to get close in battle, in PvE they would be aggroed and in PvP they'd be shot fast...so this is where the role of RANGED HEALING comes into play.)


The ranged support tree is ranged SUPPORT. Not ranged ATTACK. If you don't know what support means, it means HELPING OUT in combat, providing aid, combine that with mastermedic and you have a clear hybrid here. If the true intention of CMs were a pure combat class (as it is being used now, more instances exist of CMs applying poisons then throwing stims), CM would haverequired master marksman or weapon trees from marksman, and only ONE tree from medic. But this is not the case! (Infactthink aboutthe ranged support tree..my profession, squad leader is based off of it also. yes you guysusemy tree from marksman, but this tree I believe has a defition not of pure combat and offense, but of a more group focused supporting role and meaning)


If it was up to me, combat medics would have a reinforced and VERY Important role in combat, they would heal IN BATTLE..that means healing 10 of your friends at once with an area stim (which you can do now), or maybe if this was done give CMs the ability to cure combat statesduring battle from a distance or in an area fashion. combat medics should be just that - providing support in the HEAT of battle. Healing massive amounts of health and action from a distance, healing an area of players, and I think they should havemore curing abilitiesother than healing HAM that would make the profession a true medic basedclass (since like what %80 of your skillpoints are in MEDIC...NOT MARKSMAN [and the marksman skillpoints aren't in a weapons specialization but as I said, more of a group based support skill tree).

Why is it someone with the ability to heal from a distance isprevented from healing state effects and COMBATrelated damage and effects? I believe a true FIX to the combat medic profession, is to make it actually perform its role and work as intended: make CMs a valuable, must havepart of combat by healing states like I said above and possibly healing poison/disease or whatever (on a ranged and area basis). Doctors aren't really for big groups in combat I don't believe that is their role, the role belongs to a class or a hybrid which already exists (COMBAT medic) its just that class has no abilities which are on track and on par with its current intent as a primarily medic based healingprofession.


Doctors would still have a role as well, healing the after effects of battle (like diseaes,poisons)and PREPARING players for battle (wound healing) and rezzing. I think docs would be happy with buffs themselves, becuase buffs are REALLY powerful in this game, can't do much without them, this sole ability is worth getting doctor itself.) I think combat medic should EXPAND on the abilities of doctor and the profession should be attractive becuase of the great possibilities to heal these COMBAT injuries. A combat medic should be better than a doctor when it comes to healing becuase they take the doctor's knoweldge about apply it in the field.


Imagine being a doctor..your the only one who can cure state effects or disease/poison and you have a 6m healing range, and you are in a group with 19 other players, if its a PvP group everyone is getting a state effect slapped on them per second...DoT weapons are making most of your group members sick, and they are taking massive damage. Why should a doctor be forced to cure all those types of direct combat related damage? Its VERY hard for them. they would be running all over the place and it would take forever since they have a 6 meter range. area disease poison /disease cures you say? that doesn't sound like a doctor ability, that sounds like a COMBAT MEDIC ability. Infact the abilities assigned to the doc profession to cure those combat related abilities is not really feasible. If I saw 1 or 2 doctors in PvP running around curing players, I'd wanna kill the docs right away. I think many will agree that the abilities of doctor are not exactly combat friendly. People won't stand still in combat and wait for docs to slap heals on, in combat you have to be fast and on the move. Can you really cure someone who is burst running away from a melee person effectively while curing multiple members in the group? not really. Unless your group is all doctors or 1/2 doctors, and with the current situation combat groups really are these days... and this just tells you how broken the professions are!


Why should the Doctor Profession (with a few of its mismatched abilities) have to heal in combat and heal combat DoT, and states when you have a profession created with the intent to do just that?! Why is it Doctors heal more IN COMBAT then COMBAT MEDICS? This is really flawed.


Why create a medic based profession with only ONE healing ability (heal health action mind)? If anything doctors should be able to heal mind. And buff..and rezz...and cure poison/disease andstates on themself or to ONE other person in the 6m radius (as they do now). Combat medics should be able to apply expert curing abilities to AREAS of Effect and through DISTANCES consistant with combat tactics and warfare, effectively being a DOCTOR in the field..


It is thecombatmedic's duty, through training in group tactics and marksman support tactics, and most important medic centrally, to keep a group healed during fights. We are not seeing this profession created as intended here.


Ok maybe I am sort of unsure about the EXACT abilities. I am only roughly going over it in my head but for the most part I think thats how it should be. And please don't quote specific abilities I mentioned as how it exactly should be, I didn't really mean that -these are only ideas I have which would generally define roles and put the MEDIC back into Combat Medic.


Save all the damage, andDoT for the fighting professions.

Make a combat medic a true medic in combat.


(PS, Going to post this in the CM Forums so I can get some feedback there also. TY)

Message Edited by Kraftomatic on 07-12-2004 10:19 PM

Mikah
Mon Jul 12, 2004 7:41 pm
#2

Exactly what i was trying to say, well said.



Mikah, Valcyn

DEV's please do not push the CU live. Just balance the CURRENT SYSTEM.
OmniBrio
Tue Jul 13, 2004 8:13 pm
#3

nothing left constructive to say


so just a /bump






Adak'u Vaedm-Element of Fear
QuickDrawQwuichay
Fri Jul 16, 2004 2:10 pm
#4

I agree completely. I have been a Combat Medic since the beginning of the game - and through several periods of playing and dropping the game, I have never dropped the profession. But I wanted to play the CM profession to be a combat MEDIC, not a COMBAT medic. So, to date, I've never thrown a poison or disease in my professional career, only stims. I can't say that I'm very effective, but I enjoy myself doing the duty that I chose for myself. Most anti-nerf CMs seem, to me, to be people who jumped on the CM bandwagon AFTER they realized that biological warfare was well-nigh unbeatable. What puzzles me is why aren't some armors environmental and just negate any chance of biowarfare? Either that or some poison/disease nerfage is in order....


Although, they have at least fixed SOME issues yesterday, at least. I can't believe some people complain that their "broken" range stats don't go as far as before - jeez, it's freaking obvious that that was WRONG.



"The Emperor keep and sustain me, hold me safe from harm and grant me the strength to battle the forces of disorder, praise be to Him, He who holds the Throne of Coruscant." - Battle Prayer of the Imperial Cult

Ardun Offenhauser, Combat Medic & Chaplain Commissar of the Imperial Cult, Valcyn
Pahdbacca
Tue Jul 20, 2004 6:00 am
#5


Copying ThunderHearts post for the 20th time it seems........................




Quoted from the 19 questions answered by TH on 6/3/04.......



Combat Medic



Since the start of the game, Combat Medics have debated amongst themselves as to their role in the game. Are we to be the best battlefield healers? Are we to be the offensive crowd/control juggernauts? What part did the devs have in mind for our profession in the overall design?



Without an answer to guide us, we've each chosen our own approach,takenour own paths, and madeour own role. Some have tried to use the profession for pure healing, yet our healing abilities are far below that of our Doctor counterparts. Some have taken the role of chemical warfare agents and use their abilities to infect others with poisons and diseases, even though our offensive capability isextremelylackingin certain areas while somewhat overpowered in others.With the Combat Rebalance on the horizon, and all the major changes that entails, the Combat Medic community would like to know what role our profession is meant to play in the grand scheme of things after all is said and done.



What is the developer’s vision of the Combat Medic Profession, post Combat Rebalance? Are we to be Combatants with a bit of healing ability or Healers with a bit of combat?"



The developer’s vision of Combat Medics is to be exactly that - - medics that have abilities to heal players in combat.Optimally, the player should have the choice to make that decision to be “be combatants with a bit of healing ability or healers with a bit of combat” and this is another great example of something the correspondents and I will want community input on during the testing while the CB sandbox is up.






The CM community has been asking since lauch what their role in SWG is to be ( at least long before I became correspondent in November...This question had been ignored, hemmed, hawed, answered with the blowoff question 'What do you think the CM role should be?' etc). This is the most complete answer we have recieved. You may be of the opinion that CMs are to be a support profession, and some CMs may agree with you. But other CMs, and the official stance of the Devs, is that CM can be either, depending on how you play it.


The fact is, CMs are primarily an offensive profession right now because there is no need for healing in combat due to Doctor buffs and high resist armor. I too have been a CM since launch. In the days before doctor buffs and armor, I threw more healing stims on a group of 5 hunting ancient maulers than I do now as the only CM in a group of 20 fighting inside the DWB.




-----------------------------------------
Pip Tazo = Master Doc / Swordsman - Always the CM at heart
Zhose U'nare = Master Smuggler / Pistoleer - resource hound

Former CM correspondent - Member of Team Black Bar
" If you're dependant on venom to be effective than you're doing something wrong." - Obata
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