Medic Archive
Thread: A proposal for revamping Medics and healing
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Scorus
Mon Jun 30, 2003 7:08 am
#1
I would really appreciate some feedback on this, even if you hate it. Especially from those of you who Mastered Medic in beta and from those who have just started out. I'm in between and want to get other opinions.
These are my ideas for revamping Medic so that it is less work. I've tried to keep the needs of other professions in mind here and I think that this would also help out artisans, bio-engineers and anybody that has to sit in a hospital waiting for healing.
1) Medics would use a 'Medical Kit' to heal damage instead of Stimpacks. The medical kit would have 250-500 charges in it, after which it would have to be replaced. It would not need to and could not be recharged with anything. (Alternately, make it like a blaster with no charges and degradation upon use.) It would be used exactly like a stimpack is used. Starting medics would begin with a ‘Beginner’s Medical Kit’ that has 25-50 charges in it. Artisans would be able to craft low level medical kits, giving them an in-demand item to craft from the get-go. Bio-engineers would be able to craft higher level medical kits (for doctors and combat medics), giving that profession something more commonly needed than their current array. What med kit you could use would be entirely dependent upon your Medicine Use skill. Higher level med kits would heal more damage per use, modified by their First Aid-related skills, and frequency of use would be affected by their Diagnostics-related skills.
2) The crafting of woundpacks would stay the way they are but the delay between wound heals would be reduced by 1/3 to 1/2 of its current level. This would reduce people’s hospital downtime.
3) Make camps only automatically heal pool wounds, not stat wounds. Leave us something that we can do that no one else can, as the other starting professions have.
4) Cut the cost to insure resource containers significantly. Medics have to be able to craft in the field, especially at higher levels where you don’t know what kinds of wounds and states you are going to have to fix.
5) Give xp for self-healing, at least at a reduced rate. If you don't, it is completely impossible for medics to solo and advance. And the 'that let's people get xp too easily' explanation really falls flat when we don't see the same concern over artisans and entertainers maxxing disciplines with afk macros and scouts spamming /maskscent so they get spammed with scouting xp. Medical XP is used for three of the four Medic disciplines and one has to max out all of them before they can advance to Doctor or Combat Medic. Make this possible for a soloist, even if it is very slow.
6) Chemical crafting stations in hospitals. I should be able to make at least as good medicines in a sanitized, well-equipped hospital as I can manage in a public square.
Scorus
These are my ideas for revamping Medic so that it is less work. I've tried to keep the needs of other professions in mind here and I think that this would also help out artisans, bio-engineers and anybody that has to sit in a hospital waiting for healing.
1) Medics would use a 'Medical Kit' to heal damage instead of Stimpacks. The medical kit would have 250-500 charges in it, after which it would have to be replaced. It would not need to and could not be recharged with anything. (Alternately, make it like a blaster with no charges and degradation upon use.) It would be used exactly like a stimpack is used. Starting medics would begin with a ‘Beginner’s Medical Kit’ that has 25-50 charges in it. Artisans would be able to craft low level medical kits, giving them an in-demand item to craft from the get-go. Bio-engineers would be able to craft higher level medical kits (for doctors and combat medics), giving that profession something more commonly needed than their current array. What med kit you could use would be entirely dependent upon your Medicine Use skill. Higher level med kits would heal more damage per use, modified by their First Aid-related skills, and frequency of use would be affected by their Diagnostics-related skills.
2) The crafting of woundpacks would stay the way they are but the delay between wound heals would be reduced by 1/3 to 1/2 of its current level. This would reduce people’s hospital downtime.
3) Make camps only automatically heal pool wounds, not stat wounds. Leave us something that we can do that no one else can, as the other starting professions have.
4) Cut the cost to insure resource containers significantly. Medics have to be able to craft in the field, especially at higher levels where you don’t know what kinds of wounds and states you are going to have to fix.
5) Give xp for self-healing, at least at a reduced rate. If you don't, it is completely impossible for medics to solo and advance. And the 'that let's people get xp too easily' explanation really falls flat when we don't see the same concern over artisans and entertainers maxxing disciplines with afk macros and scouts spamming /maskscent so they get spammed with scouting xp. Medical XP is used for three of the four Medic disciplines and one has to max out all of them before they can advance to Doctor or Combat Medic. Make this possible for a soloist, even if it is very slow.
6) Chemical crafting stations in hospitals. I should be able to make at least as good medicines in a sanitized, well-equipped hospital as I can manage in a public square.
Scorus
vortexala
Mon Jun 30, 2003 4:35 pm
#4
MrSloth wrote:
What a crappy idea. =P
what he said 
y'know i'm just kidding with ya Scorus 
Artuk
Mon Jun 30, 2003 4:42 pm
#5
I kinda had trouble reading it.. one big block of text. I tend to skip those.
I gave it another try.
What you describe in 1) is what we had in AO. I am not sure its really all that different then high-charge stims. You will find that stim Bs have LOTS of charges.
For 2) I personally would like to see these involve less clicking over all. Rather then just speeding up the time to click, I would like to see wound packs do a regeneration over time as long as the medic remains focused.. slowly using up charges. Then both the medic and the patient can enjoy chatting while they heal.
3) I agree with that. Good idea.
4) Dont see much value in cutting insurance costs on stacks, and see much that could be exploited. "Give all your stuff to the medic, he can insure it cheap.."
5) Doing this would disenfranchise the full time healer. The idea is to reward medics who heal people.. not just players who solo a lot. I like the current system, although as a biochemist in beta it hurt me as I had trouble gaining the skill to use my own advanced medicines.
6) That makes great sense to me. Maybe a MEDICAL CRAFTIGN STATION would be in order.. to go with a medical crafting tool and a medical resource survey unit..
Regards,
Artuk
I gave it another try.
What you describe in 1) is what we had in AO. I am not sure its really all that different then high-charge stims. You will find that stim Bs have LOTS of charges.
For 2) I personally would like to see these involve less clicking over all. Rather then just speeding up the time to click, I would like to see wound packs do a regeneration over time as long as the medic remains focused.. slowly using up charges. Then both the medic and the patient can enjoy chatting while they heal.
3) I agree with that. Good idea.
4) Dont see much value in cutting insurance costs on stacks, and see much that could be exploited. "Give all your stuff to the medic, he can insure it cheap.."
5) Doing this would disenfranchise the full time healer. The idea is to reward medics who heal people.. not just players who solo a lot. I like the current system, although as a biochemist in beta it hurt me as I had trouble gaining the skill to use my own advanced medicines.
6) That makes great sense to me. Maybe a MEDICAL CRAFTIGN STATION would be in order.. to go with a medical crafting tool and a medical resource survey unit..
Regards,
Artuk
Scorus
Tue Jul 01, 2003 7:31 am
#6
I hadn't thought of the similarities between that system and AO's damage healing system. That said, I thought AO had a really superior damage healing system. Healing cost you but it was accessible enough to minimize downtime. Copying it in other games seems like a good idea.
I didn't mean that only medics would get cheaper costs on resource container insurance, I meant everyone. I just think that putting the costs at 500 impacted the medic in ways they didn't think of.
I think giving at least some xp for self-healing WOULD reward the medic who healed people, namely himself. I am a full-time medic (well, okay, so I'm 80% medic plus the necessary artisan/scout/weapon skill) and I like to solo. I craft really great stuff and use them on damage that has occurred in battle, I just don't get any xp for it. I don't think it would disenfranchise anyone, for one reason because the medic skills that rely on medical xp aren't that great. Pharmacology doesn't matter until you want to use Stimpack-C's; Diagnostics only affects damage healing and not wound healing. First Aid is nice, but I don't see how letting the 'casual medic' finish out that discipline is any different from how the 'casual artisan' can easily finish Surveying or the 'casual scout' can easily finish Explore and/or Hunting. Plus keep in mind that the idea of everyone being able to do a little of everything and there not being character classes is one of the hallmarks of this system.
Scorus
I didn't mean that only medics would get cheaper costs on resource container insurance, I meant everyone. I just think that putting the costs at 500 impacted the medic in ways they didn't think of.
I think giving at least some xp for self-healing WOULD reward the medic who healed people, namely himself. I am a full-time medic (well, okay, so I'm 80% medic plus the necessary artisan/scout/weapon skill) and I like to solo. I craft really great stuff and use them on damage that has occurred in battle, I just don't get any xp for it. I don't think it would disenfranchise anyone, for one reason because the medic skills that rely on medical xp aren't that great. Pharmacology doesn't matter until you want to use Stimpack-C's; Diagnostics only affects damage healing and not wound healing. First Aid is nice, but I don't see how letting the 'casual medic' finish out that discipline is any different from how the 'casual artisan' can easily finish Surveying or the 'casual scout' can easily finish Explore and/or Hunting. Plus keep in mind that the idea of everyone being able to do a little of everything and there not being character classes is one of the hallmarks of this system.
Scorus
Zarlor
Tue Jul 01, 2003 7:55 am
#7
1) I actually like the crafting aspect of the profession. It keeps things from gettign monotonous and keeps me on my toes looking for resources that will work well to make better meds. So I wouldn't, personally, be for this idea.
2) Wound healing speed is really only a problem right now because the servers are so new and we don't have the players getting into the Doctor trees yet. I wouldn't mind seeing a slight increase in speed for wounds with the improvement of Diagnostics, but I wouldn't want it to interfere with the improvements taht Doctor's get.
3) Not a bad idea, I think. The only problem is the confusion it might cause for soem of the newer medics who still don't realize that there are secondary stats they can heal, nor how they go about healing them. But it would be interesting. It forces fighters into hospitals to get those healed, though, if there aren't any medics around. (I'm assuming you would intend to leave secondary auto-healing avialable in med centers.)
4) I don't really see insurance costs going down. Artisans are better equipped to make money and afford insuring, so the big thing they are forced to insure is resources. I'm sure more metrics would have to be done to really see the how effective the current pricing is in the system. We'll just have to realy on the macroecomics of the situation in this one. Even if it is shown that medics do have a harder time being able to afford to insure I don't think we would see this implemented to help out jsut one profession.
5) I think you have a good point here. Keep it small and it would still be usable. But I think this is really just a nicety. The fact taht you can keep yourself standing in a fight provides other rewards. It seesm to me that if this was implemented it would probably be rather low on the list of things to do for the Devs, though. BUt I do agree that the othyer professions all have ways of gaining XP by doing things for themselves. Only when doing things for others do they get a bonus to that XP gain (the Usage XP, same as we can get by crafting meds and having someone else use them.)
6) This was brought up in Beta and I'm pretty sure that Holo agreed it would be a pretty easy thing to do but the priority at the time was to get the game as stable as possible for live. So I would expect to see this one actually show up in the near future. I definitely want to see this happen as well.
Traigus
Tue Jul 01, 2003 7:58 am
#8
Scorus wrote:
I would really appreciate some feedback on this, even if you hate it. Especially from those of you who Mastered Medic in beta and from those who have just started out. I'm in between and want to get other opinions.
These are my ideas for revamping Medic so that it is less work. I've tried to keep the needs of other professions in mind here and I think that this would also help out artisans, bio-engineers and anybody that has to sit in a hospital waiting for healing.
1) Medics would use a 'Medical Kit' to heal damage instead of Stimpacks. The medical kit would have 250-500 charges in it, after which it would have to be replaced. It would not need to and could not be recharged with anything. (Alternately, make it like a blaster with no charges and degradation upon use.) It would be used exactly like a stimpack is used. Starting medics would begin with a ‘Beginner’s Medical Kit’ that has 25-50 charges in it. Artisans would be able to craft low level medical kits, giving them an in-demand item to craft from the get-go. Bio-engineers would be able to craft higher level medical kits (for doctors and combat medics), giving that profession something more commonly needed than their current array. What med kit you could use would be entirely dependent upon your Medicine Use skill. Higher level med kits would heal more damage per use, modified by their First Aid-related skills, and frequency of use would be affected by their Diagnostics-related skills.
Don't like it. Don't see the need for a change to this.
2) The crafting of woundpacks would stay the way they are but the delay between wound heals would be reduced by 1/3 to 1/2 of its current level. This would reduce people’s hospital downtime.
No.. bad. you want less downtime, you need a Doctor.. Wound B packs are fast. .C's are insane.. D's are useless unless you have huge buffs on. I wish people would stop trying to scale the whole game using A packs as the basis of all healing.
3) Make camps only automatically heal pool wounds, not stat wounds. Leave us something that we can do that no one else can, as the other starting professions have.
I don't like this either... It was brought up in the final days of beta. I'd rather have the first 40 second pulse of healing in camps removed. Forcing optionless downtime on others is not really a good way to advance out cause. There is actually a ton of XP out there in damage.. Since wounds happen randomly, your proposal could be a very bad thing... One of my characters got 80 quickness wounds last night before he got any other type. I don't have a problem with camps.
4) Cut the cost to insure resource containers significantly. Medics have to be able to craft in the field, especially at higher levels where you don’t know what kinds of wounds and states you are going to have to fix.
No.. I don't agree.. that is the risk we take for carrying them around.. EVERYONE takes that risk as well.. Every scout, artisan, medic takes the same risks with their containers. And At the end of beta 3 I routinely carried 3 experimented C health/action 2 of each secondary stat wound B meds, a lot of Stim C's, and several intimidate/stun/dizzy stims. having experimented meds with me was far more useful than crafting just in time to heal. though I did usually end up crating Stim B's later on... With 1 volume meds. there isn't a lot of excuse for not bringing experimented meds with you.
5) Give xp for self-healing, at least at a reduced rate. If you don't, it is completely impossible for medics to solo and advance. And the 'that let's people get xp too easily' explanation really falls flat when we don't see the same concern over artisans and entertainers maxxing disciplines with afk macros and scouts spamming /maskscent so they get spammed with scouting xp. Medical XP is used for three of the four Medic disciplines and one has to max out all of them before they can advance to Doctor or Combat Medic. Make this possible for a soloist, even if it is very slow.
I agree this is a problem (though I'm not a soloist).. .So many things cause damage though, there would have to be an XP reduction. Stimming is worth tons of XP...
6) Chemical crafting stations in hospitals. I should be able to make at least as good medicines in a sanitized, well-equipped hospital as I can manage in a public square.
-T
(lets see how bad I messed up my code.)
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