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Thread: New Duty Mission: PvP Training
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Tumbler2002
Mon Apr 04, 2005 7:10 pm
#1
Many posts on these msg boards offer tips to train folks on how to be successful in the pvp space game.
So why don't we build in a duty mission called pvp training that allows players to practice fights vs opponents similar to enemy players.
IE first wave is 1 Xwing/Tie Interceptor/Freelancer ship with 1500/1500 shields, 800/800 armor, lvl 7 guns that do 1500-2500 dmg.
Second wave would be tougher, a tier 4 enemy.
Third wave would be 2 Tier 2 ships, then 2 tier 3 ship, then 2 tier 4 ships.
Master ships would show up once in a while as the command vessel or something.
All these ships should be very aggressive and fast, similar to how the awings did without jousting back and forth not too long ago.
This would give players a way to practice and setup their ships and try different configs.
Second wave of fighters could have bombers with missles so players get to see how to deal with missles.
Learning this way will allow people who don't run into other overt players enough to feel like they have a way to practice.
So why don't we build in a duty mission called pvp training that allows players to practice fights vs opponents similar to enemy players.
IE first wave is 1 Xwing/Tie Interceptor/Freelancer ship with 1500/1500 shields, 800/800 armor, lvl 7 guns that do 1500-2500 dmg.
Second wave would be tougher, a tier 4 enemy.
Third wave would be 2 Tier 2 ships, then 2 tier 3 ship, then 2 tier 4 ships.
Master ships would show up once in a while as the command vessel or something.
All these ships should be very aggressive and fast, similar to how the awings did without jousting back and forth not too long ago.
This would give players a way to practice and setup their ships and try different configs.
Second wave of fighters could have bombers with missles so players get to see how to deal with missles.
Learning this way will allow people who don't run into other overt players enough to feel like they have a way to practice.
SpaceCrazy
Mon Apr 04, 2005 7:23 pm
#2
While the idea is good, any kind of PVP training has to come against another player or it's useless. The big difference between PVE and PVP is not your opponent's ship, but the intelligence flying it. An AI will not be able to give you a realistic PVP experience because it cannot be programmed to perform the often illogical things an actual person would do to stay alive and win. Fighting a player is a completely different thing than fighting a computer.
The only way to PVP train is to actually go against another player. And the best way to learn from your mistakes would be to for the two players to discuss the battle and while Player B beat Player A so that Player A can see where they made their mistake and work to correct it for next time.
The only way to PVP train is to actually go against another player. And the best way to learn from your mistakes would be to for the two players to discuss the battle and while Player B beat Player A so that Player A can see where they made their mistake and work to correct it for next time.
KaylBreinhar
Mon Apr 04, 2005 7:24 pm
#3
PvE ships have crappy aim - if they gave them aimbots, we'd get toasted in a second. A computer IS a better pilot than a human in JTL due to the simple fact that it's operating with zero lag.
The best evasion training that exists thus far in this game is aggroing the ISD or Freedom Station (depending on your faction) and exposing yourself to the turret fire as many times as possible, learning to put erratic movements into your flying in an attempt to make it nigh impossible for an enemy to draw a bead.
The best evasion training that exists thus far in this game is aggroing the ISD or Freedom Station (depending on your faction) and exposing yourself to the turret fire as many times as possible, learning to put erratic movements into your flying in an attempt to make it nigh impossible for an enemy to draw a bead.
Message Edited by KaylBreinhar on 04-04-2005 10:25 PM
KaylBreinhar
Mon Apr 04, 2005 7:27 pm
#4
That being said, I think there should be a Tier 6 and 7 added with ROTW - Tier 6 would mean a highly experienced pilot, and Tier 7 would mean an elite pilot.
They should be the Nightsisters of the skies.
They should be the Nightsisters of the skies.
Tumbler2002
Tue Apr 05, 2005 9:24 am
#5
SpaceCrazy wrote:
While the idea is good, any kind of PVP training has to come against another player or it's useless. The big difference between PVE and PVP is not your opponent's ship, but the intelligence flying it. An AI will not be able to give you a realistic PVP experience because it cannot be programmed to perform the often illogical things an actual person would do to stay alive and win. Fighting a player is a completely different thing than fighting a computer.
The only way to PVP train is to actually go against another player. And the best way to learn from your mistakes would be to for the two players to discuss the battle and while Player B beat Player A so that Player A can see where they made their mistake and work to correct it for next time.
I think this is something that would help players. Considering there is nothing in game that offers any sort of training this could be very helpful for new comers.
It would be easy to setup the duty mission so it drops progressively more difficult fighters on you and get more aggressive and have better aim. It wouldn't be the best way to train, but at least it's something. Could also build in info about using the "target nearest enemy player" key, using/avoiding missles, I think players could learn a lot from an NPC that was as powerful as an average player... After all it's not very easy to find overt players a lot of the time.
SpaceCrazy
Tue Apr 05, 2005 11:21 am
#6
Tumbler2002 wrote:
I think this is something that would help players. Considering there is nothing in game that offers any sort of training this could be very helpful for new comers.
It would be easy to setup the duty mission so it drops progressively more difficult fighters on you and get more aggressive and have better aim. It wouldn't be the best way to train, but at least it's something. Could also build in info about using the "target nearest enemy player" key, using/avoiding missles, I think players could learn a lot from an NPC that was as powerful as an average player... After all it's not very easy to find overt players a lot of the time.
But you're STILL fighting NPC's. Players do NOT fight like NPC's, especially in a twitch-base game like JTL. Your idea will help players become better pilots yes, but only against NPC's. You can solo all 9 pilot squadrons solo, never dying once, and you'd STILL get your butt kicked by a player in a ship with comparable equipment because players do not fight in the same predictable patterns that NPC's do. The only way to get better at PVP is to participate in PVP and try to figure out what you do wrong when you lose. And figure out what the other guy did wrong when you win.
Tumbler2002
Tue Apr 05, 2005 1:18 pm
#7
SpaceCrazy wrote:
But you're STILL fighting NPC's. Players do NOT fight like NPC's, especially in a twitch-base game like JTL. Your idea will help players become better pilots yes, but only against NPC's. You can solo all 9 pilot squadrons solo, never dying once, and you'd STILL get your butt kicked by a player in a ship with comparable equipment because players do not fight in the same predictable patterns that NPC's do. The only way to get better at PVP is to participate in PVP and try to figure out what you do wrong when you lose. And figure out what the other guy did wrong when you win.
That is the whole idea. Letting players adjust with NPC's that have similar stats to players so that the adjustment is more gradual. Going from the Pilot tree to pvp is a pretty big step and with something like this there is an inbetween area where players don't have to be overt and can see how different combat is.
Vegitaa
Tue Apr 05, 2005 2:06 pm
#8
Not to flame or anything.. but the best PvP training is to go overt and head to Kessel. Yeah, I know on most servers you'll just be sitting there waiting for ever then someone comes up fast on your six... two-four shots... Boom!
The most useful PvP training I've done is, get you and a buddy. Arm your ships with lvl2 player crafted blasters (this way they do identical damage). Then go somewhere and /duel each other. With the lvl2 blasters you will not pop in 4 shots and you can actually get some decent manuevors going.
Training against NPC's would be futile although I would like to see NPC's pulling more manuevors than turn left while rolling, turn to a head-on joust, or stop on a dime. PvP training would be done best with a couple of friends, some low damage blasters, no droid programs, and a good wide open sector like Tattoine or Naboo (low level NPC's that will generally leave you alone)
Tumbler2002
Tue Apr 05, 2005 2:26 pm
#9
The most useful PvP training I've done is, get you and a buddy. Arm your ships with lvl2 player crafted blasters (this way they do identical damage). Then go somewhere and /duel each other. With the lvl2 blasters you will not pop in 4 shots and you can actually get some decent manuevors going.
That is a really good idea. Kudos to you.
Message Edited by Tumbler2002 on 04-05-2005 02:30 PM
Ducimus
Tue Apr 05, 2005 2:27 pm
#10
The best PvP training in the game, is for you and a buddy to equip a level 1 disruptor and go /duel each other in a quiet, out of the way corner of space.
EDIT: nevemrind, someone already said it.
EDIT: nevemrind, someone already said it.
Message Edited by Ducimus on 04-05-2005 02:28 PM
Vegitaa
Tue Apr 05, 2005 2:41 pm
#11
Ducimus wrote:
The best PvP training in the game, is for you and a buddy to equip a level 1 disruptor and go /duel each other in a quiet, out of the way corner of space.
EDIT: nevemrind, someone already said it.
Message Edited by Ducimus on 04-05-2005 02:28 PM
LOL! We think too much alike! LMAO!
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