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Message Edited by Jediwind on 04-18-2004 12:02 AM
Me to...i highly enjoy the SW flight sims..and if SE is twitch like how it seems to be...i got endless fun there 
But then again..im also good in FPS..and therefore like the gun packing style...despite SWG being "turn based"
"all combat professions in this game have to be evenin PVP and PVE"
Sorry Jediwind, but you are incorrect.
All combat professions should not be balanced in PvE and PvP. Why? Because all combat professions do not cost the same in terms of skill pts. This is why rifle is so out of balnce. At 92 skill pts there is no way for any other master combat profession to stand a chance. Not only do the have a huge dps, but in the case of commando and bh, they have a huge skill pt advantage as well.
What needs to be balanced is the skill costs for those weapons or skills that have the most impact on PvP/PvE.
This next bit is not directed soly at you JediWind, so don't take it that way.
What I don't understand is how everyone continualy gets caught up in this Master/Dabbler nonsense. This game was not ment to be played one profession at a time. That is why you get 250 pts to choose your skills instead of picking just one or two professions and being locked in.
"I am a master commando and I can't win a PvP fight with my flame thrower!" Is not a very good argument for why things have to change.
"I am a master commando with 169pts invested in my combat skills and I cant out damage or takedamageanywhere near as well as a riflemen(72 range + 40 melee D) who only spends 92pts. Please show me the logic here." Is.
Recognize the real problem.
Edit: Added rifle defense numbers.
Message Edited by AlufNull on 04-21-2004 10:04 PM
AlufNull wrote:"all combat professions in this game have to be evenin PVP and PVE"
Sorry Jediwind, but you are incorrect.
All combat professions should not be balanced in PvE and PvP. Why? Because all combat professions do not cost the same in terms of skill pts. This is why rifle is so out of balnce. At 92 skill pts there is no way for any other master combat profession to stand a chance. Not only do the have a huge dps, but in the case of commando and bh, they have a huge skill pt advantage as well.
What needs to be balanced is the skill costs for those weapons or skills that have the most impact on PvP/PvE.
This next bit is not directed soly at you JediWind, so don't take it that way.
What I don't understand is how everyone continualy gets caught up in this Master/Dabbler nonsense. This game was not ment to be played one profession at a time. That is why you get 250 pts to choose your skills instead of picking just one or two professions and being locked in.
"I am a master commando and I can't win a PvP fight with my flame thrower!" Is not a very good argument for why things have to change.
"I am a master commando with 169pts invested in my combat skills and I cant out damage or takedamageanywhere near as well as a riflemen(72 range + 40 melee D) who only spends 92pts. Please show me the logic here." Is.
Recognize the real problem.
Edit: Added rifle defense numbers.
Message Edited by AlufNull on 04-21-2004 10:04 PM
After a number of months as a master commando, I'm throwing in the towel. As stated above, I agree the game is not meant to be played one profession at a time-except maybe for those attractive master dancers!
But, seriously, I have reviewed the skills from a number of the professions and I've decided to build my own commando from the skills I believe are most commando-like, when compared to what real-life commandos actually do.
Here's my template(and I'm going after skills, not so much for defensive superiority):
Scout: 4-0-0-0 For terrain negotiation and mask scent
Commando: 0-0-4-0 There's gotta be SOME heavy weaponry
Rifleman: 2-4-0-0 True commandos have sniper skills
Carbineer: 0-3-4-0 Crippling shot and counter attack
TKA: 4-0-4-0 I went for meditate since I'll have no medic. Could just as easily taken column four instead.
And, of course, prerequisites for all the above. It's a shame I must tear down my master commando and spread myself out over several professions to have skills that will make me feel like I'm a commando.
AlufNull wrote:
"all combat professions in this game have to be evenin PVP and PVE"
Sorry Jediwind, but you are incorrect.
All combat professions should not be balanced in PvE and PvP. Why? Because all combat professions do not cost the same in terms of skill pts. This is why rifle is so out of balnce. At 92 skill pts there is no way for any other master combat profession to stand a chance. Not only do the have a huge dps, but in the case of commando and bh, they have a huge skill pt advantage as well.
What needs to be balanced is the skill costs for those weapons or skills that have the most impact on PvP/PvE.
This next bit is not directed soly at you JediWind, so don't take it that way.
What I don't understand is how everyone continualy gets caught up in this Master/Dabbler nonsense. This game was not ment to be played one profession at a time. That is why you get 250 pts to choose your skills instead of picking just one or two professions and being locked in.
"I am a master commando and I can't win a PvP fight with my flame thrower!" Is not a very good argument for why things have to change.
"I am a master commando with 169pts invested in my combat skills and I cant out damage or takedamageanywhere near as well as a riflemen(72 range + 40 melee D) who only spends 92pts. Please show me the logic here." Is.
Recognize the real problem.
Edit: Added rifle defense numbers.
Message Edited by AlufNull on 04-21-2004 10:04 PM
So you are saying that because we need higher Skill points that we should be good at PVE but
BLOWAT pvp. Not only does that go againest PVP but it is not right to rate a Profession by how much skill points i use. You say PVP and PVE should not be even but half the most used professions in the game do a good job in both PVP and PVE. aI been killed many times by pistoleers and as a novice pistoleer 0-0-1-1 in PVE i can still kill most NPCs save for the ones that need a group for. We know how strong rifleman is and I have seen a rifleman do well in PVE. With a swordsman on a different server i can say they do well in PVE because but need some help on the big guys and do well in PVP. As a master Commando i can kill most NPCs save for very strongs NPCs, in PVP irarelykill someone in PVP and kill only the dumb unbuffed morons.
"So you are saying that because we need higher Skill points that we should be good at PVE but BLOW AT pvp"
Sorry, you are going to have to reference where I said anything even remotely like that.
What I am saying is this is not a professions based game. The profession skill pts are not equal, so you can not compare one combat profession to another directly.
If you got your way and all the combat professions were equal in PvP/PvE then you would be shooting yourself in the foot because you pay 169 skill pts for your skills and pistoleer/rifle/carbing pay 92.
What I am trying to do, is point out that you and a majority of others are going about this argument the wrong way. A stand alone commando should not be equal to a stand alone pistoleer. The commando should have a distinct advantage because the comando invests almost double the skill pts
Not that anyone actualy plays a stand alone profession.
You need to drop this idea of profession vs. profession. The only professions that should be balanced are carbine/rifle/pistol becuase the cost the same and have the same requirements.
AlufNull wrote:
"So you are saying that because we need higher Skill points that we should be good at PVE but
BLOWAT pvp"
Sorry, you are going to have to reference where I said anything even remotely like that.
What I am saying is this is not a professions based game. The profession skill pts are not equal, so you can not compare one combat profession to another directly.
If you got your way and all the combat professions were equal in PvP/PvE then you would be shooting yourself in the foot because you pay 169 skill pts for your skills and pistoleer/rifle/carbing pay 92.
What I am trying to do, is point out that you and a majority of others are going about this argument the wrong way. A stand alone commando should not be equal to a stand alone pistoleer. The commando should have a distinct advantage because the comando invests almost double the skill pts
Not that anyone actualy plays a stand alone profession.
You need to drop this idea of profession vs. profession. The only professions that should be balanced are carbine/rifle/pistol becuase the cost the same and have the same requirements.
Golrok wrote:
Some of the rank or skill tree stuff will have an effect in the battle, but like said before a "novice" could take out a "master" pilot. I think twitch is great addition, though some will disagree.
I think it scares some people though cause it really can't be macroed, you can't look up some recipe to afk power your way through it. You have to be there to be good and thatI think scares some hardcore RPGers.
Actually, in my case, I love JTL to be twitch, but what scares me is with my computer and connection, it may be unplayable. Not just PvP but PvE as well. When you have ingame skill modifiers, then the connection becomes less of an issue. When it comes to twitch, any lag can make the game unplayable.
I hate it when I play Counter Strike, and I die, then a second later I see the player that killed me run around the corner. Don't kid yourself, this will happen. Someone that was facing away from you suddenly hits you because he really wasn't facing away from you. Even the best pilots can't counter against that because there skill tells them that the are not being targeted. I guess we will see people that will be good at predicting lag, but that doesn't make it better.