Jedi Archive
Thread: Root cause of nerfs
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Jacella
Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:15 am
#1
Let's start by defining terms:
PVP=GCW (SF vs SF)
Forced PVP = Bounty Hunters or old style FRS
There has been a lot of discussion about forced pvp. Patch history supports that reduction in threat to forced pvp has directly lead to reductions in Jedi strength. PVP hasn't.
The following Forced pvp related patches and their jedi nerfs:
- Group Visibilty removed = Healing nerf, MP nerf, AI nerf
- Removal of names and payouts from BH terminals = FS nerf, proposed Cloak nerf, increased mind/action/force costs.
The following PVP related nerfs:
none
So, when people complain about GCW pvp leading to nerfs, please look at the patch history and make your conclusions based on that.
MsNiL
Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:17 am
#2
This was changed becouse Jedi grindingdid not work in the CU.
Jacella wrote:
- Group Visibilty removed = Healing nerf, MP nerf, AI nerf
- Removal of names and payouts from BH terminals = FS nerf, proposed Cloak nerf, increased mind/action/force costs.
Only real difference with Jedi now and then was that toughness was removed in the CU, and then they did not have enough time to replace it. Jedi is what they are now due to lack of time to upkeep old design for a new system, not becouse of a new design.
Message Edited by MsNiL on 10-03-2005 08:19 PM
Jacella
Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:18 am
#3
MsNiL wrote:
This was changed becouse Jedi grindingdid not work in the CU.
Jacella wrote:
- Group Visibilty removed = Healing nerf, MP nerf, AI nerf
- Removal of names and payouts from BH terminals = FS nerf, proposed Cloak nerf, increased mind/action/force costs.
Yes, and lead to Forced PVP nerfs. Jedi lose strength every time Forced PVP gets nerfed.
MsNiL
Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:19 am
#4
The old system did not work in the new.
Jacella wrote:
Yes, and lead to Forced PVP nerfs. Jedi lose strength every time Forced PVP gets nerfed.
Pre-cu jedi could grind fine without being hunted.
Post-cu Jedi can now grind fine without being hunted.
If anything Jedi grinding was nerfed hard in the CU and then fixed by having the groupvis removed.
Message Edited by MsNiL on 10-03-2005 08:21 PM
GlargTheKelfn
Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:20 am
#5
pvp has been the cause of almost every nerf since the game started and
OMG, nerf eyeshot, i was kd for the entire fight.
that was the 3rd week of the game, when i joined.
very very few, if any, nerfs have occured due to players being too tough for the pve monsters. they just buff the monsters.
OMG, nerf eyeshot, i was kd for the entire fight.
that was the 3rd week of the game, when i joined.
very very few, if any, nerfs have occured due to players being too tough for the pve monsters. they just buff the monsters.
Angamarth
Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:22 am
#6
Jacella wrote:
Let's start by defining terms:
PVP=GCW (SF vs SF)
Forced PVP = Bounty Hunters or old style FRS
There has been a lot of discussion about forced pvp. Patch history supports that reduction in threat to forced pvp has directly lead to reductions in Jedi strength. PVP hasn't.
The following Forced pvp related patches and their jedi nerfs:
- Group Visibilty removed = Healing nerf, MP nerf, AI nerf
- Removal of names and payouts from BH terminals = FS nerf, proposed Cloak nerf, increased mind/action/force costs.
The following PVP related nerfs:
none
So, when people complain about GCW pvp leading to nerfs, please look at the patch history and make your conclusions based on that.
How about actually taking the nerf calls of the time into account? Like, all the doctors throwing a fit on these boards because Jedi could outheal them, leading to Jedi healing nerfs? All the GCW people complaining that Jedi should be removed from the GCW because Jedi could kill turrets too easily with their great defenses and healing, leading to Jedi healing nerf? How about all the people complaining that a Master Defender was unkillable in PvP and that ruined the GCW leading to a root being palced on AI?
Just looking at the patch notes doesn't tell you squat.
Message Edited by Angamarth on 10-03-2005 11:22 AM
shadowdragon2k
Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:22 am
#7
unfortantly its became easyer and easyer for you to gain and grind a jedi. that is why youve became weaker and weaker. if you had a perma death system where after 3 deaths youd lose something very valuable (all pre pub 9's know what i mean) then you would become stronger again. the problem is the jedi proffesion was ment to be a risk Vs Reward system. take out the risk then your gonna have less reward
more risk means stronger Jedi
WookieOgre
Mon Oct 03, 2005 11:27 am
#8
Jacella wrote:
The following Forced pvp related patches and their jedi nerfs:
- Group Visibilty removed = Healing nerf, MP nerf, AI nerf
- Removal of names and payouts from BH terminals = FS nerf, proposed Cloak nerf, increased mind/action/force costs.
Have to disagree.
healing nerf happened because Jedi healing was the bomb when the CURB hit. It was so much better than everyone elses that it lead to an OVERNERF, that being making all non-Jedi healing greater in power while knocking our down.
MP nerf, ok what exactly are you talking about. It's always been gimped since the CURB. If anything since the CURB the Devs have lowered the action and force costs (from what I remember). Where is MP getting nerfed because of group visibility?
AI nerf, had nothing to do with visibilty. Let me repeat, nothing. Devs are clueless on how people use their templates/skills in game and come to horrid conclusions. It was nerfed because it was deemed overpowered in combat, PvP and PvE. PvE because you could kill almost anything in game and in PvP people spouted this nonsense that Defenders were immortal and there was no way to counter AI in PvP. In both cases the devs were horribly misinformed, in PvE I never used AI unless it was a bugged mob that did 15k damage which they agreed shouldn't have been in the game to begin with....them saying they wanted to nerf AI because Jedi were soloing stuff they shouldn't proves how cluessless they are since there are templates that can solo the exact same stuff. PvP, the counter is a Mez.....stop hitting the Jedi and wait for the AI to wear off, bam one hit dead Jedi. See of course this caused many people to actually think rather than bash buttons so of course lets take the easy road and nerf it on the assumption people are too stupid to counter it with a mez.
Cloak nerf, again overraction due to the whining about Looters/exploiters. Nothing to do with removal of names lol.
Every nerf just about has everything to do with balancing PvP.
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