Image Designer Archive

Thread: Poll: XP gain what should it be? **Dev help wanted**

Kwee
Fri May 07, 2004 8:48 am
#14
Thank you for this poll Sir Voor Everyone please continue to give feedback, I"ll be passing the thread along to our dev.




Kwee Glitterwing of Starsider
Ex Image Designer Correspondent ~ Elder Tailor
& Kwee-kwee ~ Master Image Designer
Gamer Girl Columnist ~ swg.warcry.com
Ivory & Topaz of TC ~ Elder Dancers, IDs, Musicians

Kamalla
Fri May 07, 2004 11:10 pm
#15

Okay, after parusing several important threads from the past couple of days I have a couple ideas that I haven't seen suggested yet.


1)XP/Tent issue: If there was some kind ofxp bonus or time discountfor non-master ID'ers within the current NPC city tents, then someone casually looking for image design would be certain of finding an image designer in a tent. This would also give theID'ers who still needxp their needed victims. Then if Master Image Designers could ID anywhere without time issues or restrictions, they would be happy with their freedom, but couldstill be sought after for thier more advanced skills.


2) ID Terminal/Placeable Tent issue: I really like Sir Voor's idea of having some kind of spa item (like a hot tub) in lieu of the sterile terminals. But if just the ITEM was placeable by a Master Image Designer, then ID's could place them in their salons or elsewhere in their established player city. This could be the balance of both worlds!


BTW: I have been reading the forums for some time now, but only now have I been getting involved. If i ever actually met some of you (like Kwee &Sir Voor), it would be like meeting a celebrity!


Kamalla Fray

...of Gorath

Master Image Designer & Apprentice Swordsman
Sir_Voor
Sat May 08, 2004 12:55 am
#16

Bump


More


"constructive" feedback


Wanted - dead or alive









[`M Sir VOOR N`\

NJ62
Sat May 08, 2004 8:06 am
#17
Changes do NOT stack for body & cosmetic mods. I got 300 xp for changing both height and tattoo. This means that Voor's figures would be more like 25-30 hours PER LINE = 120 hours for the profession, solid grinding, not counting getting to novice.



n'Jessi
former correspondent, former player
All your hawtpants are belong to me.
www.swgtailor.com
PLEASE REGISTER FOR THE SWGTAILOR OFFSITE FORUM (IMAGE DESIGNERS WELCOME TOO)
NJ62
Sat May 08, 2004 8:07 am
#18
Oh yeah... 5 minute timer? TORTURE!!! 2 minutes is just about right, because you spend about a minute tweaking, a minute waiting. But 5 minutes is prime time for a bathroom break.



n'Jessi
former correspondent, former player
All your hawtpants are belong to me.
www.swgtailor.com
PLEASE REGISTER FOR THE SWGTAILOR OFFSITE FORUM (IMAGE DESIGNERS WELCOME TOO)
Electro
Sun May 09, 2004 6:17 pm
#19
I was told to post this here... put it in another thread originally....


Let us examine for a moment the experience gain as currently implemented on test for Image Design, beginning at base entertainer, and working up through Master Image Designer.


As it stands now, the tent does nothing to reduce timers (at least for base entertainer, which is all I could test.) This means that the smallest change takes two minutes per change, experience per change is set based on the timer, not on the number of changes made, and self-ID gains experience at half the rate of changing another person. Changes to cosmetic items (hair style, color, makeup) grant 100 exp on others, 50 on self. Changes to facial features (eye color, lip size, nose protrusion, etc.) require 5 minutes and grant 300 exp on others, 150 on self. Body changes take 10 minutes (oh ... my... god...) and grant 600 exp on others, 300 on self. Since this is the same exp rate per minute as facial changes, I ignore body changes in my analysis.


Thus, to maximize exp gain per minute, the beginner should do hair color/style/makeup for the first two boxes, then eye color or whatever they wish after that until master.


100 exp every 2 mins for first two boxes

300 exp every 5 mins for all the rest of the boxes


Assuming the aspiring ID always has unlimited access to a test subject and there is zero downtime....


The first two boxes require a total of 6000 experience.... (6000/100)*2 = 120 minutes or exactly two hours.

The next two boxes (needed by all master entertainers) require 25000 experience.... (25000/300)*5 = 417 minutes or approximatelysevenhours

Novice Box requires 10000 experience .... (10000/300)*5 =167 minutes or two and two thirds hours


Thus...with zero downtime under perfect conditions it takes:


9 hours to grind out ID for Master Entertainer

11 2/3 hours to grind to Novice Image Designer


Once Novice Image Designer is reached, it takes (10000+20000+30000+40000)*4 =400000 experience to master


At the same rate of gain, assuming the tents reduce the wait time in half (not yet working) this takes an additional....


(400000/300)*2.5 = 3333 minutes or about 55.5 hours


Thus, total time assuming perfect conditions, to grind from base entertainer to Master Image Designer would be over 67 hours. In reality, most of the grind will probably be on the Image Designer herself, doubling the time taken, and there will be downtime added. Theseare best case scenarios. The reality is it would take substantially longer than the best case, very likely as much as double or more.


I can't imagine that anyone would subject themselves to this. It would mean doing nothing but staring at the Image Design UI nonstop for 3 real days, not to mention the partner that has to stare at it too. The rate of gain, even for power grinding is simply glacial as currently implemented, and in reality, would spell the end ofthe profession if it went live (as Master IDs retire, they simply would not be replaced under these conditions.) I can't see anyone subjecting themselves to this process voluntarily, and I ground out ID without macros over several weeks.


Suggestions for Improvement


  1. Eliminate self-ID penalty entirely
  2. Remove wait time from ID interface and make it like doctors, current ID session finishes, you then have to wait on a timer to ID the next person
  3. Reduce wait timers substantially, perhaps to 1/2/3 minutes respectively. 10 minutes would still be reasonable for stat migration.
  4. Possibly allow multiple exp types per session to stack (i.e. max exp per session would now be 1000, 100+300+600)

In any case, something needs to be done to get this grind time into the realm of reasonability. An hour or two as it is now is of course ridiculous, but three days under perfect conditions is equally broken.


Syzygy-Gorath
Mon May 10, 2004 5:43 pm
#20
So…I started grinding ID on TC just to make sure we weren't overreacting about the XP gain issue. Put it this way: it took me an hour to get ID1. With only cosmetics and n00bstyles available at novice entertainer there is absolutely no way a new ID, or an aspiring master entertainer, is going to be able to do this. Tent time bonuses don't work. The self-ID penalty is crippling (keep in mind we get XP for working on ourselves where other professions don't…why? Because no one wants what novice entertainers have to offer!) There's no way we're going to see any new masters once this goes live. This has to be changed NOW! We can't afford to wait and lose any potentials that may see this and give up.



œ Slone Varnillian œ Eicia Obai œ Panda-Sy œ
Most of the universe's problems can be solved by the application of a brick to the side of the right head.
The problem is if you don't have a big enough brick or can't find the right head. The devil is in the details.
œ Galena Varnillian œ Ammon œ Gwrtheyrn œ

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