Image Designer Archive
Thread: The Corr-ID communication thread :) Last edited: Sat, May 8th
Many ofthe bugs that popped up yesterday were a big surprise for the devs. So a big yay for the testers (Test Center victimsand ID's)and yay for the devs Message Edited by Kwee on 05-08-2004 12:54 PM
Kwee wrote:
No timer for master id's - Being considered
Kwee wrote:
Ok I've gotten a ton of new info from our dev today about how things should be (and will be) working:
EXP - 25 exp per change was buggy. It should be fixed soon on TC, is supposed to be 100 exp for cosmetic changes, 300 for physical changes, 600 for stat migration. Half of all of those if you ID yourself. These may very well be tweaked based on our feedback.
These are fine, but I would suggest that for master IDs there is no (or almost none) XP and that the timers are removed.
No MIND - This is a bug, things will once again take mind to do, but I believe it will be less than before, to allow for multiple changes (again our feedback will be important here)
TIMER - Is intended to be 2 min for cosmetic changes, 5 mins for physical changes, 10 mins for stat migration at the max (feedback please)
These are really long! This means that when someone says "make me fat", I have to wait 5 minutes with them to do it? If this is going to be the case, then prices for body modications are going to go *way* up! The stat migration one will be worse. If it is popular or there are not enough of us image designers on, we will literally spend hours with a huge line of people coming in for stat migration. This timer should be on their end, not ours. We make the instant change and can go on to the next customer and they have to wait for 10 minutes for the stat change to go into effect. This should grant no XP.
We have more than a month left of people hologrinding. I *really* don't want to be stuck in a tent with a bunch of hologrinders all day (with the time bonus of the tents, this is where they will be) with them screaming for training, while I have a huge line of people waiting for stat migration and regular ID sessions.
Tent benefit - Tent should cut the time in half for cosmetic and physical changes, so 1 min and 2 1/2 mins respectively
This is a good idea, but I still don't see the reason for the timer for master image designers. No timer should be a benefit of becoming a master ID.
How to do stat migration? - Player does it first on their screen, then they come to us to have it activated. (currently buggy, we aren't needed)
Thanks! I was really confused about this!
How to do holo-emotes - There is a /holoemote command that will be patched in today. If you just have one active you just type /holoemote. If you have more than one you have to specify the name afterwards. But remember this is broken right now so we still can't test it.
I was really confused about this one too! I want to test it, so I hope they fix it soon.
Bugs - Those of you whoreported the recepient was getting the exp instead of the ID'er found the key to aBIG bad bug. It all came down to one code booboo that should fix a lot of the problems we've been seeing, hopefullywe'll see itpatched super soon
Well, if we are good at anything, we are good at breaking things....oh wait...
Clothes are default colors - On the plate for checking into
No timer for master id's - Being considered
I agree with this one and see no reason not to do it. We are not grinding anymore so it does not affect the reason for the timers in the first place!
When do we get what? - That info will be added to the skill tree interface
- Ah, so let me see if I understand this correctly... you only get xp if you MAKE a change now? Hmmm that's good in theory, but I worry that this penalizes ID's who spend a lot of time with a customer who can't make up his/her mind. At least if you can revert to normal, and the person clicks accept, you salvage some experience from a picky customer 30 minute horror episode (we've all had those)
- Timers: I'll have to see this in action but I think 5 minutes is hugely long for a physical change (downsize to 4 mins/2mins in tent? 2 mins was UNBEARABLY long as it is
), and they are often not the most requested changes. - Will the xp stack?
- What if you make 1 physical change and 1cosmetic change?
- Will you get more xp for doing multiple cosmetic changes or just xp for doing a single change (i.e. lip color + eyeshadow, versus just lipcolor).
- Making master ID's with no timer will be problematic for the casual player who desires to skill up by doing ID requests. How are they to do so if everyone wants to flock to a master for an insta change (nobody wants to wait 5 minutes for a quickie "max height plz") (I know master ID's want insta changes but we have to think about the ability of the casual ID to level without having to grind, and we need to keep the client base for the novices viable).
Thanks Kwee for the intel, and I'll be on testing tonight
NJ62 wrote:
- Making master ID's with no timer will be problematic for the casual player who desires to skill up by doing ID requests. How are they to do so if everyone wants to flock to a master for an insta change (nobody wants to wait 5 minutes for a quickie "max height plz") (I know master ID's want insta changes but we have to think about the ability of the casual ID to level without having to grind, and we need to keep the client base for the novices viable).
Its hard for a non-master of any profession to compete with masters anyway. As the tailor correspondent, you should already know that only master tailors can make synthetic cloth . Well, it seems that way anyway! Pretty much the only benefit I can see for these timers (except for controlling XP) is that now if someone wants some image design at the starport, I can now justifiably say "No. It will take too long and we will miss the shuttle".
Anyway, if we *have* to keep the timers for everyone, then the timers and the XP should be adjusted. So instead of having a 2 minute timer and 200 XP for a cosmetic change, we have a 30 second timer and 50XP for a cosmetic change.
Thanks for the info
Let see by doing an cosmetic and physical changes on the same ID, it should give you 400exp and have a 5 min timer.
So with each tree needing 100,000exp it will take 250 IDs, and that is 1250mins or 20-hours per tree!?!
Kwee wrote:
TIMER - Is intended to be 2 min for cosmetic changes, 5 mins for physical changes, 10 mins for stat migration at the max (feedback please)
If they have done this to prevent people from grinding ID to master in a few hours, then they have successfully gone into overkill mode. The hologrind will be over soon enough, don't code this in just to fight that "Hey this code over here allows peopel to do bad things, let's code something new to do bad things so people won't want to do the other bad things". 2 minutes is to long in itself for me to sit there and do simplechanges. 5 minutes is ridiculous and 10 minutes is absurd. You honestly want me to sit there for 10 minutes after I change something and stare at a screen waiting for the 10 minutes to end so someone can accept it?
Do a little test right now. I want you to stop what you are doing and sit perfectly still for just 5 minutes doing nothing. No wiping your nose, no scratching an itch, no clicking other windows on the computer. Just sit and stare at my text here for 5 minutes. When you are done, you'll realise that 5 minutes doing absolutely nothing is stupid.
Sorry, but the developers are successfully making this ID and I'm sure others want to drop it and take up anything else. After this patch I'm gonna have to spend half my time in a NPC city at a tent, and I'm gonna have to spend 5 minutes on the shuttle there, 5 minutes per mod session while I'm there, and 5 minutes on the shuttle back. Thanks for the time sink. I can't believe this.
If they keep all this time sink and requirements for me to leave the player city that they encouraged me to go into in the first place, then I won't be an ID anymore. And I won't be alone in dropping it.
All along I have been told the exp system would probably need tweaking and WOULD be tweaked if it turned out to be too torturous.
Kwee wrote:
Please remember this is on Test Center right now. No complaining is allowed, only constructive feedback
Sir_Voor wrote:
Thanks for the info
Let see by doing an cosmetic and physical changes on the same ID, it should give you 400exp and have a 5 min timer.
So with each tree needing 100,000exp it will take 250 IDs, and that is 1250mins or 20-hours per tree!?!
OK let say you're also doing stat migartion at a rate of 6 per hour thats 3600exp per hour add to that 12 ID @ 400 per hour that is 3600exp + 4800exp = 8400exp per hour MAX. That is 11.9-hours per tree!!!
Agreed, Voor, it should not take 20 hours per tree. Even within a tent that is 10 solid hours per tree, and that's just too much when you consider that during a 1 hour session when you can technically do 24 image designs, you realistically will not be doing all those ID's. You'll be trying to wrangle clients, they'll take longer than the timer to pick, etc etc. In an hour I would imagine that you can do maybe 10 image designs (as a casual player working the way up, non-grind-wise).
If you want the casual player to be able to master in a month, then it needs to be about 20 hours of casual play, which includes all that "slop" time wrangling clients, discussing changes after the timer has expired, etc. This would probably boil down to fewer than 10 hours of hard-core grinding. This would not be out of line with other professions, as most crafting & combat professions can be done in 2-3 days of solid grinding (probably adding to 10-15 hours total).
Please keep in mind that other professions can get experience solo (with the exception of doctors). Also, even in teh case of doctors, the "victim" does not need to accept any healing or otherwise interact with the doctor (it's not the same one-on-one tedium). Grinding is boring. Helping someone grind is really boring.
I would say that if changes do not stack xp, and the max that you can get for a 2.5 minute session is 400 xp, that is greatly disproportionate to advancement in other professions and needs to be reevaluated. Ideally the system should take no longer than it took a non-spiced non-macroing ID under the old system (for me: 3 weeks, and I was not casual about it, I just had to regen mind pool often!)
Kwee wrote:
Please remember this is on Test Center right now. No complaining is allowed, only constructive feedback
only constructive feedback!... What fun is that? ....
I feel with a 10 or even 5 min timer, we will be prime targets for griffers. having us wait until the timer is up then wait until the trade window's timer is up, then make a rude comment and run away.
I would like a 2-min timer for every thing, and have the exp upped so novice to master takes 7-10 hours. and the exp for self ID should be increased to 80% - 90% of norm, not 50%.
Aww no I'm sorry, I've been on my constructive postingsoapbox more than usualwith all the negativity we've had on the forum the past couple of days
Korrack wrote:
Kwee wrote:
Please remember this is on Test Center right now. No complaining is allowed, only constructive feedback
I apologize Kwee. I didn't mean to be non-constructive. I'll just go away now.
Regardless, my comment was made in a light hearted tone, just hard to convey that via text. You've always been a great poster