Game Guides Archive
Thread: A large rant full of memories, gripes and the root of all evil.
Page 3 of 3
Wimble-Poon
Thu Oct 21, 2004 8:12 am
#27
Well firstly, wow, didn't really expect this thread to keep on creaping back up onto the first page, secondly, thankyou all for kind comments.
I don't understand Degage's comment about solo'ing, you do not need buffs to solo, before buffpacks were readilly available people could still kill nightsisters, myself and 1 other could kill elder's together cross-healing, solo play works perfectly well un-buffed it just takes time.
Also, your preference differs not one bit from mine, i like to be able to chill on my own as much as the next person, but that was never an issue, i could kill a rancor on my own sure, but in the time it took me to solo one for 4k xp i could have killed 2 in a team for 3k a go and less risk of death, the incentive to play with people was there.
I focused on buffs as my ultimate evil, many have pointed out other's, all true, buffs however, are what i decided to focus my wrath on simply because the more i thought about my time in SWG the more i found what i percieved to be the negative aspects were almost always closely linked with the increase in the buff culture.
I based it all on myself, i am no different from anyone else, i stand proud in my 90% sliced comp suits with my PSG's, crates of server best brandy and buffed to the nines. My whole ranting post was simply just me moaning at myself that i did not see what i was doing to myself, the lure of uber-ness took away all the fun i had in SWG.
To anyone who reads through my post and thinks; "Pfft, guys an idiot i rove my buffs." I haven't an ill word to speak of you, i merely ask that in another 2-6months when you've quit galaxies (if nothing changes), that you come back here and give it another read and maybe how the game once was might sound more appealing.
In closing, i miss terribly the people of SWG, i miss hunting with you, i miss dieing with you, i miss growing up with you, we all play MMORPG's because of the interaction with people, galaxies is losing it's multiplayer element,it's loosing it's very soul.
Why hunt with someone else when you can do it just as easily on your own and for greater gain?
I won't bump this up anymore, please don't all start arguing, we all have our own opinions, thats life, i wanted to let of alittle steam about something i felt quite strongly about, and as much as anything, i wanted to read a few other peoples tales of there noobie days and see if they enjoyed them as much as i did.
Ty kindly and goodnight
Wibb.
I don't understand Degage's comment about solo'ing, you do not need buffs to solo, before buffpacks were readilly available people could still kill nightsisters, myself and 1 other could kill elder's together cross-healing, solo play works perfectly well un-buffed it just takes time.
Also, your preference differs not one bit from mine, i like to be able to chill on my own as much as the next person, but that was never an issue, i could kill a rancor on my own sure, but in the time it took me to solo one for 4k xp i could have killed 2 in a team for 3k a go and less risk of death, the incentive to play with people was there.
I focused on buffs as my ultimate evil, many have pointed out other's, all true, buffs however, are what i decided to focus my wrath on simply because the more i thought about my time in SWG the more i found what i percieved to be the negative aspects were almost always closely linked with the increase in the buff culture.
I based it all on myself, i am no different from anyone else, i stand proud in my 90% sliced comp suits with my PSG's, crates of server best brandy and buffed to the nines. My whole ranting post was simply just me moaning at myself that i did not see what i was doing to myself, the lure of uber-ness took away all the fun i had in SWG.
To anyone who reads through my post and thinks; "Pfft, guys an idiot i rove my buffs." I haven't an ill word to speak of you, i merely ask that in another 2-6months when you've quit galaxies (if nothing changes), that you come back here and give it another read and maybe how the game once was might sound more appealing.
In closing, i miss terribly the people of SWG, i miss hunting with you, i miss dieing with you, i miss growing up with you, we all play MMORPG's because of the interaction with people, galaxies is losing it's multiplayer element,it's loosing it's very soul.
Why hunt with someone else when you can do it just as easily on your own and for greater gain?
I won't bump this up anymore, please don't all start arguing, we all have our own opinions, thats life, i wanted to let of alittle steam about something i felt quite strongly about, and as much as anything, i wanted to read a few other peoples tales of there noobie days and see if they enjoyed them as much as i did.
Ty kindly and goodnight
Wibb.
DirtDigger
Thu Oct 21, 2004 8:41 am
#28
I read this post, and the ensuing replies a couple of hours ago and it's been mulling in the back of my mind. The suggestion of graduated buffs really does sound interesting to me.
I'm no master combateer (10 carbineer boxes) , but I also get bored of buffing up and suddenly finding myself invincible. There really is little choice other than getting buffed however. If the buff system were scaled properly then Noobs wouldn't be running around on Dath, and Vets would only buff up when going on heavy quests. If the scaling were done right, a noob could buff just enough for him to take on a Mountain Squill (believe me, that's reward enough when you're at that level) and keep the mystery of harder planets just that.
I'd also like to see a cool-off period.. Perhaps Vet buff lasts 1hr, but can't re-buff for 3. Noob Buffs last 2 hrs, rebuff after 3 ?
Oh and don't get me started on the universal armor composite armor.I'd love, love to see a few different ranges of armor added. (and WHY did they keep the ability to color composite whenever we want) ?
Suggestion too: (wrong forum, who cares..)adverse effects for wearing the wrong type of armor in the wrong environments. (heat exhaustion for Comp on Tattooine etc - different armor enhancements for different planets.)
rant, moan, whine, dream.... Ijust want to enjoy the game again.
milbot
Thu Oct 21, 2004 9:06 am
#29
Have to agree with the OP. I loved the thrill of the early days and the first time I went to tat and joined a group of 20 people to take on dewbacks.
As for the posters that like the current system and say they'll quit, please understand lots of people who played at the start have got bored a quit. While I have no official figures, it does look like subscriber numbers have gone down (basically I see very few people these days and lots of my friends have gone). They all got bored and hit cancel. While you may enjoy the game now, in a few months I'm sure you'll be doing the same as killing a krayt for the millionth time loses it's appeal. Crafting items is pointless as there's only a few players left to sell to and they already have suppliers.
Out of a group of 20, only two of us have played the game recently and my friend has found out his subscription has run out and has decided not to renew and I hit the cancel button last week.
This game has so much potential, but pandering to the solo artists is killing it. If you want to hunt solo, fine, go after the low level content like we did at the start. If you want to go for the high end stuff, find a group. I have to be very careful on Dath as nightsisters can one shot kill me, so Dath becomes a dangerous planet for me. The way it should be.
I hope to return one day when the game starts to realise its full potential (it does have buckets), but for now I can't justify $15 a month to play an massive single player online game (the rp died as well as the multiplayer).
Here's to a time when Star Wars really does rule the galaxy
Oh and my old timer memory. Spending 20 minutes walking to your destination, killing your mission and then getting killed by a random spawn so you didn't have to walk all the way back Who needs speeders, we had teleportation. (having no penalty for death was a bad thing though).
As for the posters that like the current system and say they'll quit, please understand lots of people who played at the start have got bored a quit. While I have no official figures, it does look like subscriber numbers have gone down (basically I see very few people these days and lots of my friends have gone). They all got bored and hit cancel. While you may enjoy the game now, in a few months I'm sure you'll be doing the same as killing a krayt for the millionth time loses it's appeal. Crafting items is pointless as there's only a few players left to sell to and they already have suppliers.
Out of a group of 20, only two of us have played the game recently and my friend has found out his subscription has run out and has decided not to renew and I hit the cancel button last week.
This game has so much potential, but pandering to the solo artists is killing it. If you want to hunt solo, fine, go after the low level content like we did at the start. If you want to go for the high end stuff, find a group. I have to be very careful on Dath as nightsisters can one shot kill me, so Dath becomes a dangerous planet for me. The way it should be.
I hope to return one day when the game starts to realise its full potential (it does have buckets), but for now I can't justify $15 a month to play an massive single player online game (the rp died as well as the multiplayer).
Here's to a time when Star Wars really does rule the galaxy
Oh and my old timer memory. Spending 20 minutes walking to your destination, killing your mission and then getting killed by a random spawn so you didn't have to walk all the way back
Who needs speeders, we had teleportation. (having no penalty for death was a bad thing though).Message Edited by milbot on 10-21-2004 05:09 PM
FreebiEaway
Thu Oct 21, 2004 10:00 am
#30
as much as i agree with every single word of the original post, i have to say that i'm not sure what the point is other than to lament a day gone by. i too am still playing, but although i do wish i could revisit those days, i can't say that i want them to return absolutely. i wrote a li'l piece called "The Spirit of Tatooine" where i said i missed the long hard runs from bestine to jabba's palace but i think that remains better a memory than a desire for vehicles to disappear.
i remember all our hunts pre-buff, and i was a ch/medic and it was fun, just like your post suggested. i did feel useful too. but do i want to spend a couple of months working on mastering tkm? no. do i want to do anything unbuffed? usually, no. one drawback i remember from those limited-use specials days was "gee, here i am autofiring with 6 other people and i have time to go to the kitchen to make a sandwich before this thing dies." is that what the game should be either?
have no fear though, the old game is still there. really. there is no reason why you and like-minded people (myself included) can not go out hunting unbuffed, on mounts, with medics and ch's, to take out a lair of robas or blurrgs (what we used to hunt), without uber composite and weapons. nothing is keeping you or me from doing this except ourselves. i want tkm faster, so i grind, alone, buffed, with solid armor. but there have been times when my template was finished for weeks, and i was bored with 'nothing' to do. those would be the times to revisit the past.
since the geo caves, dwb, and corvette came in, i've been somewhat annoyed that the only real adventure content added has involved ramping up the difficulty level to the point where there is no chance in bleep that non-elite masters can do anything, literally anything there. the equating of "fun and challenging" to "uber mondo 100k mobs with 80 resists" is specious, but that is the direction things have gone. and i ignore them all since rarely ever does the opportunity come up to visit them anyway. i'll leave that for buffy mcbuffington and the uberloot brigade. and so, a form of the original game lives on in that respect to me.
i don't know what the answer is, really, but returning to the past will never happen. be happy that it happened at all (just look at your local game shelf, count the titles, then count the ones you ever cared about). and see me on intrepid, and we'll get an old school hunt and pvp tourney going
to a like-minded person, i offer my own little story of the past.. enjoy.
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Intrepid&message.id=347302#M347302
Benar
Thu Oct 21, 2004 12:36 pm
#31
captenjonny wrote:
The landspeeder is a reference to how selective the old timers are about what they gripe about. SWG was conceived and started as requiring people to group. Since it's lauch however SOE has found that many, many more people want to hunt solo then interact. When I hunt, grouping would be nice but more times than not I don't want to fuss or TAKE THE TIME trying to put a group together - JEEZUMS! I just want to play!
I can hear the response form the "veterans" ... "Then you should just get a copy of Duke Nukem cause you're not "really" into MMORGs."
Nope, not the case at all. I like the interaction in the cantinas, I like bartering my wears and resources. I like helping newbies out. The "veterans" (a small but vocal group) seem to be fixated on taking six months to a year to develop your character to the point where you can play the game beyond kreetel hunting! Again who is stopping you from grouping? If there are so very many of you why don't you all make a date to go hunting on Dant without your armor and buffs? No one is stopping this type of play but you seem intent on stopping MY style of play - simply because not very many people WANT to go back to the "good old days".
There is a reason SOE doesn't set up a buff, armor and weapon nerfed server. Because it would be empty!!!!
One star me all you want.
Great advice! I'd never thought of that without the suggestion! 
Awesome Post Wimble!!
*adds a signature to the petition*
I really love to hear that im not the only person that realises that it used to be alot funner before things were like this. I remember... the first time i ever heard of a Janta mission... there was about 12 of us, and i think 4 were MCH, with ranc's and grauls. I was a Doc pistoleer at the time, when docs were a good thing to have in a group and when social play was encouraged... *sigh*. If there was only a way to get this to the people whe really count. Let them know that the community wants to be challenged.
I cant honestly agree that either buffs or armor is the sole root cause. I think its a combination. Try hunting in 80% kin without using any specials... its not so bad even without a buff a master can kill most everything. In any case... i think they should just take secondary buffs and cap them. The big stat bars are really nice for a doc trying to keep 15 people alive
.
.Thanks again for saying what I've been thinking for so long.
Bobamagoo
Thu Oct 21, 2004 3:04 pm
#32
Bravo. I am a brand new player and already I agree compeletly. The only reason I stay any longer is the hope that perhaps JTL will begin with a game similar to the original SWG. Perhaps I can have similar experiences in space to what you had on the ground.
jphillips1868
Fri Oct 22, 2004 12:42 am
#33
The funny thing about the CH Nerf (JFreeman call it whatever he wants, but it was a nerf), was that the imepetus for doing it was that those characters were not taking nearly as much risk as other players when attacking a creature, because the pets absorbed all of the damage andsome of the pets were pretty tough. A few months later, buffs and significant armor were all of the rage. And all players were essentially given the near invulnerablity vs. PvE that the creature handlers ofoldhad, for 0 skill points.
I was actually a late adopter of the buffs/armourer phenomena. At the time, I was a mid level CH and a master rifleman, with some other professions thrown in. With that set up you can still hunt solo, even on Dath, Endor, Yavin, but you just had to be careful and play smart. Send in the pet on the mobs, wait till they agro it, attack the existing mobs with HS3 in turn until dead, auto attack the lair once or twice, wait for a spawn, rinse and repeat. I used ryscthe, glazed glucose paste, fishnak, (the pre chef-revamp mind foods, we didn't have vasarian brandy). You had to becareful you werent still spaming HS3 when the food wore off. I had my stats shifted slightly toward mind, but mostly toward focus, not like today. It was fun. I could jump in game, call a mission and get in a group forbigger stuff or do it mid level missions solo.
Now, I'm a rifleman/fencer/medic. I'm working on the FS quests/xp grind. After spending time to get buff, because now I couldn't hunt without one because my stats are fully shifted to mind, I go to Dath, start walking toward the village, find something, spam headshot3 or strafe shoot2. The mobs surrond me. I switch to gadeffi stick and spam. Im not really paying attention. I'll go get an beer, while im still spaming from the que. I come back, switch targets if any are still alive and repeat. I've fallen a sleep while doing this.
The problem is going forward, people aren't just going to like not being able to do things they once could. And there will be a signifcant down turn in the player economy as players as less able to earn as much money.But its the revamp is still probably worth the risk. Becuase if they don't do something, the game is going to die. The Devs don't see now it because they are so focused on JTL.
We can only hope i guess.
broombug
Sat Oct 23, 2004 7:38 pm
#34
I've been playing since Beta 3 and I agree with the 1st poster to a point. Currently my combat alt stays 90% unbuffed and unamored because I still like challenges. It makes you really learn what you can do and what your limits are. Its too boring to get buffed put on your armor and push one special until mob is dead. Rinse and repeat. The only reason I buff and armor is to do the high level content such as DWB, corvette, and also to PVP. It would be insane not to.
I will admit that Ihave overindulged inthe chef revamp and I am quite the glutton and alcoholic. 
WOWbeans
Sun Oct 24, 2004 3:08 am
#35
heh yea we had2 groupsof 17-20 on a krayt dragon ...... haha we got slaughterd .... woooo........ it waz great........
we where so nubs ..... and we luved it...........
alpinestreams
Sun Oct 24, 2004 3:27 am
#36
The problem goes way deeper than buffs alone. I'd love to see some of you hunt buffed with no armor. I'd bet most of you would suffer quite a bit of damage against higher level animals. (unless of course your a defense stacker)
I'm in the camp that says:
1) A slight reduction in buffs would be acceptable
2) A much bigger reduction in armor would be most desirable.
3) juice up the animals! Make Rancors truly fearsome creatures as portrayed in RTOJ!!!!
I'm in the camp that says:
1) A slight reduction in buffs would be acceptable
2) A much bigger reduction in armor would be most desirable.
3) juice up the animals! Make Rancors truly fearsome creatures as portrayed in RTOJ!!!!
Fingerofthrawn
Sun Oct 24, 2004 4:59 am
#37
Lol, I've been a wookie since a little after launch and mastered my first prof with no buffs OR armor (commando), and I can say that tempered buffs and armor would be helpful to the game- but in moderation. I have to say, it is kind-of a rush now being able to be the rock that people can run to when they get into trouble on the Vette, rather than the first and most cloned person in any group (PvP or PvE). But everyone loves to use the Rancor from ROTJ as an example for toughness (rofl), it looked fearsome to be sure- but Luke was both overrated and underequipped at the time- a couple of misconceptions (at least IMHO) see if you follow:
1) Luke was not a Jedi master- according to Yoda he wasn't even truly a Jedi until he faced Vader- more likely an initiate as he did go through a short training period, and-
2) He was unarmed when he faced the Rancor, with not much more than limited ability to move objects and Force persuasion at his beck and call- and Luke was never an unarmed fighter- used a blaster/carbine (?) and fighter pilot combo. Do you think the Rancor would've stood a snowballs chance if Luke had his saber?
And a gentle side note for BH that think a lone BH should match up with a Jedi- Bobba Fetts original mark was a smuggler (master, to be sure), but lets compare:
1)Bobba v Luke (ROTJ) even tieing him up first- his blaster was cut in half and he was 1 shot away from joining it when Luke went after bigger prey- like Jabbas Skiff full of pirates and thugs shooting at him.
2)Jango v Mace (AOTC) made a master retreat with a Dark Jedi master and a few SBDs as back-up sure, but then was made short work of when he had to face him one-on-one 
But I digress: so while I do agree that one person should not be able to stand in the middle of a Rancor lair without fear as the corpses pile up around, just because they have a good set of buffs, I don't believe that one lone rancor should be cause for evac if you have your weapon of choice, good armor, and decent buffs. Once again, just IMHO....
On to the buffs. I don't agree that buffs are the root of all evil, but... grossly overstatted buffs are. I mean, of course a toon that has 400 base stats and has this same toon totally statted to be buffed and armored at all times is going to be an uber-tank with 2500+ buffs and any combat skill at all, especially when you add 80% armor that can be modified even more on top. That is a 600% percent increase in HAM points FCS!!! By comparison, M/F/W can only be increased by 100-125%, I would rather see buffs lowered to a more manageable level of around 2-300%, which would allow soloing, just not at the level people have become accustomed to. With a slight decrease in armor (to around 70%- believe me it's still quite a drop when faced with MOBs doing 6-8k HAM damage with specials) 
And from that root have come theloot-whores, the POI campers and all the other elitistevil in the galaxy that keeps people solo. So if they do change the buff-system and the armor resists, they still have to fix the POI mess. Because running with a group still gets boring if all you can do is run a bunch of missions or roam for random spawns, or run the Vette (which sucks with a group since they put 48796143956432412 SBDs up there), so while I pretty much agree with your (very well written BTW- 5* for you) point, I have to add that if the root of all evil are buffs, then non-instanced POIs are the trunk. That's what keeps me from really enjoying grouping at least- getting 10-20 people buffed and travelling across the galaxy to a camped POI=no fun. So my addition- INSTANCE THE POIs SOE!!!!!! Please?
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