Force Sensitive Archive
Thread: Where Do You Stand
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Shamora
Thu Feb 03, 2005 12:44 pm
#1
I am half way home to Jedi when it hits me. Is this LONG GRIND really necessary. Who out there have dreams of a better system to reach Jedi. I am all for the Village, I thought it was a nice addition. But once again something that starts out real good, turns real bad. Why does the current system have to be such a long and boring grind. Why can't it be a quest based system like there are in other SOE based games. Is it the the WILL of SOE to push people away from SWG. If there idea of a good game is a boring, non-interaction grind then its sad to say that they will slowly start loosing people. Something needs to be done to keep and possibly bring back vetrans that have left due to lack of content and being bored to death.
I would like to hear your ideas on how to improve the current system. How would you adjust what you have seen and experienced. Does the current system meet oreven come close tothe kind of system you thought it would be. Your voices should be heard, no matter how wild and crazy they are. What are your thoughts?
ChoNaguriai
Thu Feb 03, 2005 2:01 pm
#2
Games that are easy get boring fast and offer no sense of accomplishment. Dev's clearly states from the beginning that Jedi could be obtained by any player. Current system allows that. What you have issue with is the timeframe. The rate of obtaining your unlock is a reflection of how much you play.
This only support the notion, novel as it may seem, that people who work harder are rewarded sooner than those who do not. It's like entering the Boston marathon. Some people finish in 2 hours, others in 20 hours. Both finish, the only difference is the amount of work being put in.
Frankly if I was a one or two day a week player who finially unlocked after say a year of gameplay and suddenly the devs made it so everyone could be a Jedi. I would be pissed off. Why? Because my effort would suddenly be invalidated.
Stop trying to get a free pass. Put any spin on it you like, but the central core of every one of these arguments is "I don't want to work as hard or as long as I will have to for Jedi, make it easier".
This only support the notion, novel as it may seem, that people who work harder are rewarded sooner than those who do not. It's like entering the Boston marathon. Some people finish in 2 hours, others in 20 hours. Both finish, the only difference is the amount of work being put in.
Frankly if I was a one or two day a week player who finially unlocked after say a year of gameplay and suddenly the devs made it so everyone could be a Jedi. I would be pissed off. Why? Because my effort would suddenly be invalidated.
Stop trying to get a free pass. Put any spin on it you like, but the central core of every one of these arguments is "I don't want to work as hard or as long as I will have to for Jedi, make it easier".
Greywulf0
Thu Feb 03, 2005 3:03 pm
#3
Well, I do not like the current system. However, it is infinately better than the previous profession hologrind. No offense meant to people that like to play image designers or tailors, but I am not suited to a profession such as those and I would never have mastered it. (Has nothing to do with crafting, but because I am color-blind it is awfully hard to make any product for other players...'no I want purple skin with green hair! This is blue with red')
However, I see no point in becoming a jedi in this game. The only reason I am doing the village quests is so that I can unlock my second character slot.
"Who out there have dreams of a better system to reach Jedi."
I am not really a PvPer. As such, I have no designs to become a jedi, which will force me to be a PvPer. It has been stated before, but I am not certain where, what the inherent flaw in this system is.
1. Jedis are centered around PvP combat. (The only playersthat can be put on the BH boards are jedis, if they use their power infront of players/npcs then they go onto the boards, forced into overt status if they progress far enough, etc)
2. To unlock jedi, you have to grind incredible amounts of PvE experience.
3. The only thing that PvEers cannot master quickly is jedi, making it the ultimate goal for certain types of PvEers.
Therefore, if you area PvPer, you either have to endure an incredible amount of time PvEing to become jedi and to receive all the fun PvP combat. If you are a PvEer, you spend your time unlocking a jedi, only to never use them because you aren't into PvP.
Solution 1: PvEers sell their Jedi on ebay. I would never do that, because I spent so much time with the character I have
Solution 2: Open the second character slot to everyone and let the second character be a padawan.
Solution 2 con: Then there will be jedi everywhere! -- I already can't go to a busy starport and see several jedis wandering around, so what is the difference?
MadcowwithSARS
Fri Feb 04, 2005 1:13 am
#4
I think its only a grind if you make it a grind, if you go out and do your normal thing your XP will naturally cap, then go to the village and cash it in. If you make it an effort to do the XP soley for grinding jedi then you will feel it as a grind. It is all in how you approach a problem in how it feels.
deacster25
Fri Feb 04, 2005 1:38 am
#5
Shamora wrote:
I am half way home to Jedi when it hits me. Is this LONG GRIND really necessary. Who out there have dreams of a better system to reach Jedi. I am all for the Village, I thought it was a nice addition. But once again something that starts out real good, turns real bad. Why does the current system have to be such a long and boring grind. Why can't it be a quest based system like there are in other SOE based games. Is it the the WILL of SOE to push people away from SWG. If there idea of a good game is a boring, non-interaction grind then its sad to say that they will slowly start loosing people. Something needs to be done to keep and possibly bring back vetrans that have left due to lack of content and being bored to death.
I would like to hear your ideas on how to improve the current system. How would you adjust what you have seen and experienced. Does the current system meet oreven come close tothe kind of system you thought it would be. Your voices should be heard, no matter how wild and crazy they are. What are your thoughts?
I agree that it was a long and boring grind. Jedi is no different, especially when you work during the week and realize it takes2 weeks to get just one box. However, how you feel is exactly the intent of this system. I am sure there are better ways in which they could make getting jedi, but completelyquest based COULD = easier, and in order to ebb the waves of jedi that would cover the servers, they made it long. It is long, but not necessarily boring. There is no law anywhere that says you have to have jedi within the 3 week phase change limit. Unlock all six branches, and just play the game. You will get there eventually. In this form, jedi is obtainable by casual gamers and power gamers alike, only difference is that power gamers will get it quicker, as always. I had friends that go to force sensitive, saw what was ahead, and quit. They thought it was going to be easy and quick. Just remember patience. Patience is the most of anything that you will need for the fs/jedi grind.
Shil
Tue Feb 08, 2005 3:48 am
#7
If they were to make it quest based, lots of little, detailed missions, not only would it take ages to release, but it could represent tonnes more bugs etc. They'd need to think of enough quests to last 18 weeks, design it, test it and then implement it.
This way we're doing the hard work, not them. They give us a few missions, then a ton of xp needed to complete them.
I'm not sure how big the SWG DEV team is, but it's got to be pretty stretched at times, meaning they need to focus on many issues (existing and future), and create and implement new content. Poor guys probably spend half their day in meetings anyway.
This way we're doing the hard work, not them. They give us a few missions, then a ton of xp needed to complete them.
I'm not sure how big the SWG DEV team is, but it's got to be pretty stretched at times, meaning they need to focus on many issues (existing and future), and create and implement new content. Poor guys probably spend half their day in meetings anyway.
Doc_Rocker
Tue Feb 08, 2005 5:10 am
#8
I'm all for Jedi being hard.. but when you actually break down how long it will take to unlock, and then fill all six FS boxes, then do the Padiwan Trials, then start the horiffic Jedi Grind.. the average 2 day a week player is really put off..
Assuming you have already mastered a combat profession such as TKM
6 FS trees in 2 types = (((175+250+350+450)*4)+50) + (((175+250+350+450)*2)+50) * 1000 = 7,450,000 FS XP
If all done with Weapon eg TKM = 30:1 trade in therefore 7,450,000 * 30 = 223,500,000 Weapon XP
I live on Corillia and like doing Sharnaff Lairs grouped with a friend = 4K per sharnaf average, 6 per lair = 24,000 XP per lair
= 223,500,000 / 24,000 = 9312 Sharnaf lairs to grind
takes an average of 5 mins at TKM to do a Sharnaf Lair, 12 per hour, so 776 hours to grind
if you average 3 hours play at a time = 258 days to get to the Padiwan Trials... if you play every day, which most people don't
I have no idea what sort of XP you get at Jedi, but i suspect its slower as you cant wear armour
Firstly i would like to see a more quest based system using a Padiwan/Master system.. Just like in the Films
Secondly Why is FS xp any different to combat/weapon/crafting xp.. why should there be a trade in system.. just like in space you get space combat xp.. why couldnt a quest system provide specific FS xp, therefore removing the need to trade in HUGE amounts of regular xp..
this would remove the grind.. i realise that there are people out there that say that you should play the game and the XP will come naturally... this would be exactly the case if you get rid of the xp trade in system and replace it with a system that allowed you to do exactly that.. play not grind
This would then be more attractive to regular players.. i understand that people don't like seeing so many Jedis around... so this will need to be addressed... i am not proposing anything for that.. i wouldnt know how to please everyone
On the PvP/PvE side of things.. i object to being boxed in and made to PvP when i reach Jedi.. why should i.. if i want to go hunt nightsisters or a Krayt why should i be made to fight a MBH with his posse in tow.. i'm not aggroing them.. why aggro me..
This game is about what you want to do.. there is a place for PvP and PvE in the 'regular' game.. why cant the Devs makea place for it as part of Jedi..there have been plenty of suggestions about removing yourself from PvP.. which i agree with
Just my thoughts after a long night on the FS grind... getting there slowly
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