Fencer Archive
Thread: ANSWER HOLO'S QUESTION!
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While I have your attention Raphayl - how's the website going?
Did you see my post onyour other thread? PM me if you want to collaborate.
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- Washu
I dont think Holo was talking about an 'increase' to speed here, and I definitely dont think the speed is based on your skill (as in, I have 'elite fencer' running speed).
What Raph means is as he said :
'There's already a movement modifier in place based on the weapon you're using, but it's very slight'
It's based on what weapon you have in your hand. And no one is going to run any 'faster' I dont think, you just suffer a movement penalty based on your equiped weapon. You can already see this (I think) by running along and switching from a vibroblade to a rifle. You seem to run slower with the rifle. You probably have your best speed with no weapon, SLIGHTLY slower with a 1hs wpn, and slower yet with a rifle. The differences are just too small to really notice.
Here is where Raph is suggesting they could make some change. Perhaps gun holders should be suffering a slightly higher move penalty then they currently are.
This may be a moot discussion at this point:
http://forums.station.sony.com/swg/board/message?board.id=Development&message.id=383515&view=by_date_ascending&page=1
It looks like the decision has been made.
I weighed in on Holo's latest post (above) by saying I don't think the KD and Posture Change timer of 30 seconds should apply to PvP. Or at least that it should not be as harshin PvP.
- Washu
BAHHH - I meant to say it should not apply to PvE.
**edit** - never drink wine while you post.
- Washu
I think we need an ability like beserk that gives us a temporary speed boost, instead of damage boost.
Could also give us a dodge boost at the same time.
Or as others have said, have bonuses to run speed in the higher skill lines. After all. .. any fat, out of shape, emphasema suffering, amputee can shoot a gun and hit a bullseye on a target.... you have to be physically in shape to fight melee....
Here was what I had to add.
Personally, I think its a change that needs to affect melee, and only melee. If folks stress decreasing this or that on ranged folks, its not only going to unbalance PVP, but kill the ranged folks in PVE. This was the directon I wanted to shoot for with this idea )
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My personal take on this is that melee should have a middle ground, a bit better run and a bit better defense while running as far as ranged is concerned.
As far as it being logical or not, I see a great deal of logic in it.
It stands to reason that a practicioner of a melee art form in a Star Wars based universe, heavy in range combat and such, would devote a great deal of time not only in defending against ranged attacks (current ranged defenses), but also in avoiding such attacks as they attempt to close the obvious advantage a ranged combatant has, the distance. This would not be a skill every novice practicioner would have either. This would have to be developed at a master or near master level.
In game terms, melee users would have a slightly faster run speed ONLY with melee weapons, and have a greater ranged defenseONLY whenmovingat a running pace. This issomething that should only manifest itself at the higher tiers of the melee skill trees, due to the fact that logically and game wise, only master or near masters would have such skill. Furthermore, if it were given at a lower tier or such, anyone could easily train a few lower rankes and get such an advantage, not just pure dedicated melee practicioners. This should be seperate from regular ranged defense simply beacaue stationary defense and the idea of a moving and dodging defense are two entirely different things. They should not stack, but be held as two seperate defenses. If someone were moving a bit around an opponent, or walking, this running ranged defense should not apply.
This SHOULD NOT be implamented as an aspect such as greatly reducing ranged players damage or accuracy as it stands. If it were in any way tobe implamented as a change to them, you are effectively weakening them for melee weaknesses instead of putting the changes on the melee themselves. To weaken ranged to achieve this, you would in effect hamper their PVE abilities for a PVP fix.
Ranged should always have the logical advantage to be able to damage melee from affar, period. But melee should alsohave a fighting chance to close the gap and attack as well. This shouldn't make the range advantage moot. As it stands, a ranged practicioner can "kite" a melee easily enough, damaging while moving away, and in effect, the gap would never close. It should be a 50/50 % chance for melee to get to the ranged. Half the time the charge will fail and they die, the other half, the running defense and the slightly better run speed pay off, and they take out their mark. Much should be said for Ranged as well. Their prime advantage the distance would allow them to kill melee before they even get to melee range, the other half of the time, the melee survive, dodge and catch up, taking them out.
Keep in mind, this is a PVP issue. Though I must say, even ranged using NPCs kite melee at times ;-) It is indeed encouraging to see some concern being taken on this matter, and I as well as I am sure the entire melee comunity thank you!
Kudos and forever RAR!
Rooksarii, Fencer and Smuggler of the Watchkeepers, Radiant
This is what Iposted on the discussion thread. I posted it here to get your (repsected) opinions on these ideas.
Perhaps this simpler, more universal solution would work.
I made a post already regarding my thoughts on exactly what implications running should have on the various weapon-holders. However, that reponse was conditioned by the way the question was presented. The problem is that no practical way currently exists for 1 player, melee or not, to attempt to expand or close the distance between themself and another with any degree of control. After giving this some thought, I have found what could be a more universal and balanced solution that applies equally to ranged persons and melee. Please allow me 1 minute of your time to explain my idea.
Part 1: The radar and PvP
Currently, the radar screen shows all creatures and persons with radar range. This gives zero chance to anyone to sneak up on their target unless that target was completely unaware (afk). Stealth and sneaking around in general was a big part of the SW movies. If the imperials had radar that functioned as it currently does in this game, Luke, Han, the princess, Ben, and Chewy wouldn't have had a chance.
Instead of having the radars give away the positions of everyone in a full 360 degree circle, narrow the field down to approximately a 160 degree arc in the direction you're facing. Perhaps the different races (having eyes oriented differently on their heads) could have slightly differing arcs to account for variations in their natural peripheral vision, but that's not essential.
By having a 160 degree forward arc, opportunity for stealth manuevers, tactical distractions, and sneakiness in general come into being. It gives someone a chance to try and get behind a target and approach unnoticed unless the target turns around to glance over their shoulder occasionally.
If you wanted, perhaps those of friendly faction could still show on your radar when behind you since they can communicate their position to you. Or perhaps only those grouped with you would. But opposing factions, and those with TEF's to you should not show on radar outside of your forward 160 degree arc.
How does this help melee without crippling ranged? It gives melee and avenue of approach in which anattempt to close the gap before being slaughtered. If the ranged person should happen to turn around and spot the melee in time... yes, the melee should be laid out. However, if the melee if cautious and times it right, they can quickly run up behind a ranged person and do the same. Reversing the scenario, asniper could sneak up behind a melee, and "Bang!" Call the coroner.
This change applies equally across the board, not directly rewarding or penalizing any profession more or less than any other. This inherent weakness to all must be actively exploited to be a benefit to anyone, and doesn't interfere with ranged personnel's ability to PvE.
Part 2: Functionality of Burst Run
Currently, when you activate Burst Run, you get a chunk of HAM removed, and a timer is set during which the character in question can burst run. This is a very neat idea, but it has a few aspects that contribute to the problem.
For one, you lose the HAM and the time available to Burst Run whether you get the chance to use it or not. If you hit Burst Run, and suddenly don't get the chance or don't have the need to use it (you just stood there, or only took a few steps) then you still loose the entire chunk of HAM, the timer to Burst Run, and now you can't do it again until the "tired" counter resets. This means in PvP combat, a melee must use Burst Run to have any realistic chance to close to a ranged assailant. However, once that is used (even if only a few seconds of it) the whole of that resource is gone.
What I propose is to perhaps make Burst Run a toggled modifier to normal running. If you are running, and want/need to go faster, you press down on your Burst Run hotkey and you are in Burst Run mode. For the entire duration you Burst Run, your HAM is continually drained to reflect the effort involved. Have the HAM drain all pools equally to not advantage or disadvantageany profession over another. Once you let off the Burst Run hotkey (or hit it again if toggled) then you drop out of Burst Run back to normal run.
This would allow for a more strategic use of Burst Run. Melee could use it to quickly close the gap to their target, so long as they feel they can spare the HAM cost. Of course, their target could elect to Burst Run away... again providing they felt they could spare the HAM cost. Neither of which completely removes the option of Burst Run in the near future as the current all-or-nothing version does.
Combining the Burst Run and Radar modifications listed above would go great lengths to allieviating the frustration of melee's without imposing additional penalties to ranged.
Thank you for taking the time to read this.
What are your thoughts on this?
~Lyahpar~
La Femme Fencer
"Thrust if you love Fencers!"
I love both your ideas Lyahpar, especially the radar thing. It's something Ive hated myself....I can't sneak up on someone.
Lets push hard to get these heard!