Droid Engineer Archive

Ever heard of balanced gameplay? What about fairness? Maybe even a fighting chance? BAH!!! Who needs 'em. This is my look at Droid Engineers versus Creature Handlers. You be the judge of who has the upper hand, and who's had the ever-loving crap kicked out of their usefulness.

All arguements will be in this format: Droids vs. Creatures.

1. Toughest pet: 800+ HAM vs. 10,000+ HAM

2. Comparable number out at once: One 800 HAM vs. Three with many thousand in HAM

3. Total storable: 5 vs. 16

4. Mounts: No vs. Yes

5. Total available: 26 bodies, plus med/item/data/crafting modules vs. Way too many to count.

6. Total available that can attack: 2 out of 26 vs. All of them

7. Total exp in tree (counting novice, excluding master): 1,228,800 vs. 1,207,500

8. Exp gained by: Buying/Harvesting materials, Grinding a lot vs. Harvesting from creatures, Hiding from them.

9. Total SP to get Master: 92 vs. 106

10. Other benefits: Med, Item storage, crafting stations vs. Tricks, Variety of attacks, damage type variety.

Judging from the list above, I would be willing to pay the extra 8 SP (the only CH downfall) to get all of the CH-like abilities put into the DE trees, AND it would take about 20k exp less to do.../cheer

Feel free to add anything not here. Some I didn't list because I wasn't sure on are: Creature/droid perma-death?

Creature Handlers always get screwed.

how in this case is a creature handler getting screwed!?!? LOOK you can have 3 freakin pets out!!!! we can have no more than one!!! your pets are healable (wounds and damage) We can't heal any of our pets ourselves (wounds and damage)!!! Geeze CH's has nothing to complain about!!!

I believe thet was sarcasm, Jonaham.

Yes, most likely sarcasm. Anyone else have any thoughts on this?

Well if you think about it,..... How many out there in the vast SWG need DE? What like 2 or 3 different types of professions. And how many can use CH?(all of them) So untill they give us something to work with we will be only good to those 2-3 professions.

And another thing how much money and time do you think CH pay in order to get to master? Vs. DE!!!!

Big Beefie

Well if you think about it,..... How many out there in the vast SWG need DE? What like 2 or 3 different types of professions. And how many can use CH?(all of them) So untill they give us something to work with we will be only good to those 2-3 professions.

And another thing how much money and time do you think CH pay in order to get to master? Vs. DE!!!!

Big Beefie

The problem is that every profession COULD use our products, if our only combat droid were a little better. Artisan, Weaponsmith, Armorsmith, Archetect, Droid Eng, Tailor, Chef, Medic, Doctor, Combat Medic, Bio Engineer...All of these can use crafting stations to increase their usefulness. Private, mobile crafting stations are even better. No one wants them though, because they can just go to their house, or anyone else's house that's nearby.

With more combat oriented droids at hand, we would at least be a little more useful to the rest of the professions. How about mods to make any droid combat capable? No, that would make it just like it is currently, all the same except the way the body looks.

There is no balance. There is the nerf.

this is not the balance you're looking for.

To be the Devil's advocate....

I don't think it's fair to stack the two professions against each other in this way. I hear everyone talking about more combat droids, droidekas, probot nerfs, and how much more powerfull CH pets are. Well here's an interesting thought....

Droids aren't SUPPOSED to be fighters.

Yes there are the battle droids, destroyers,...and YES probots in the movies had SOME defensive capabilities..but lets not forget that the probot isn't DESIGNED for combat, it's a probe, it just has defensive measures. And any droids that WERE designed for fighting are no where to be seen in the classic trilogy (it's a safe bet they were outlawed after the clone wars).

Droids main function are to serve thier masters, do trivial tasks, help repair, pilot, translate, ect. While I DO love the idea of making battle droids and stuff, I think the focus should be on making droids more USEFULL, not nessesarily more POWERFUL. I've heard DEs complain that this is turning into P O K E M O N online, but it isn't going to feel any more like Star Wars if it becomes B A T T L E B O T S online either.

I think the Devs should take a serious look at how to make pets in general function more like thier movie conterparts. Let CHs have thier Rancors and Cowardly gurrecks...but Dewbacks should be riding animals, nothing more (no attacking). Rontos should hold items (pack animals)and Kaduus should be transportation. By the same token,Probots should be ...well, probes (with minor offensive capabilities), Protocols should actually translate, R2s should help fix things, slice computers and pilot ships (when the patch hits), and treadwells should patrol between harvesters, maintianing them. And YES, we can still get our Destroyer Droids for battling with.

My point is they are not meant to be opposing professions, with the proper developments, both could be incredible usful, and incredibly different, classes each with thier own strong points. As it stands we DEs are merely watered down CHs with metal pets and a few mildly functioning "modules" to make us different. With a little effort on the DEVS part, we should never have to worry about "competing" again.

Shale Deralic

Droid Designer, Tempest

Nice work, a well thought out show of the differences. You forgot one though:

11. Requires mastery of a second profession (Artisan) to be playable: Yes vs. No

Which really changes a couple:

7. Total exp in tree (counting novice, excluding master): 1,308,340 vs. 1,207,500
9.Total SP to get Master:140 vs. 106

But in all fairness, you should consider the things we have that CH doesn't:

1. Can enable medics to heal wounds outside a camp or medical center: Yes vs. No


2. Can enable any type and level of crafting to be performed anywhere: Yes vs. No


3. Can create entities that heal other entities of the same type: Yes vs. No


4. Can create additional entities that offer players additional inventory storage: Yes vs. No


5. Are "Starwarsy": Yes vs No (and I admit this one is weak)

And of course there'd be more up there if it weren't bugged (data modules, BLL storage, etc.). As an MDE, I agree that we need some help here. If you look at their posts, so do the developers, but they concede that our code has been unusually difficult to deal with.

What I wonder about is how so many DEs feel the need to compare, contrast and compete with Creature Handlers. It's apparent from the way the two classes are structured that they were designed with very differing functions and intents. It appears to me that CHs were clearly intended to be the combat class (since in the end this is really all creatures can do), while DEs were intended to be primarily a service/utility class (since our product assists other classes, especially those rooted in Artisan). Do I agree with the idea that we need more service class type stuff? Sure. Harvester droids, a function for the BLL, unique functions for the Protocol, Entertainer modules, and so on.

Would I like to be able to make some great combat droids? Oh, you bet. I was one of the first to gripe when the Probot got nerfed, and I've been an ardent supporter of us being able to craft combat droids. I think about that idea, however, and two things concern me:

First of all, if the certifications for combat droids get rolled into the DE tree, Droid Engineers become the ONLY true hybrid combat and crafting class in the game. We'd be able to take crafting XP and translate it seamlessly into combat XP, and NO ONE in the game can do that right now. It could be, to use GreenMarine's term, "game breakingly powerful". We would become Uber, and we all know what eventually happens to Uber classes: they get nerfed.

The second is a balance issue from another angle. Giving us combat droids is a sensitive issue, and I understand why there is much TLC and time going into it from development. When we get combat droids, we're suddenly encroaching on the ONLY market of both the Creature Handler AND Bio-Engineer. While we have a decent secondary market for our utility and service products, those two classes' only market resides in the combat arena. So, combat droids will disadvantage both those professions.

Am I saying we shouldn't get any combat abilities? No, not at all. But I think it should be done right the first time, rather than making us Uber and subsequently nerfing us down and upsetting a lot of people. While combat droids will be great, I think they will not be what would benefit us most. What will benefit us most is implementation of the many great service and utility enhancements that have been suggested here, and of which I named just a few of above.

Now, flame me if you must

Lets not forget vehicles vs mounts.

Mounts -Coming soon, only available from CHs, who only have to tame and teach a creature, total cash outlay, 5k at most, and thats to travel and feed pet till grown.

Vehicles - Hmm coming late 2004 at the rate they are going, and will probably require at least 1 other profession besides DE. Cash outlay? You can bet a whole lot for resources 15-20k minimum even if you mine your own.

Bottom line? There can be no comparison between the 2 professions. The one that should be great, sucks, and the one that should marginal at best, is god-like in combat and cash generating abilites.