CUEmu - Thread Posts

GnomeAd

Wed Jan 28, 2004 12:42 pm

While I agree with the majority here that we would like to see some type of "droid certification" spread around to all or some of the other professions, this type of plan is always rejected pretty much out of hand by the devs. I think the reasons that they have given us are pretty poor, but I think I know the real reason behind it. The problem with the entire combat system in any MMO is balance. If you have one profession that is even slightly more powerful than another, players will flock to that and you have a real mess on your hands. (Can everyone say TKM? I knew you could. :smileyhappy

The problems with adding droid certs to existing professions is actually a three fold issue. The first is the one we keep hearing from TH which is "it's too much work to get done in a reasonable amount of time". While I disagree with him stating that to the customers (us), it's probably the argument he most commonly associates with the issue internally. After all, I'm sure none of the devs want to spend all this effort for what they consider at best 1/32 of the game content. It's going to be pretty labor intensive and let's face it, these decisions are made by the accountants in the end.

The second issue, which is really what they should be harping on more, is profession balancing. As I stated above, if one profession has an edge, it don't take long to get out to the others. For a good example of how TH words this, go see the posts he made on the CH balance and the reasoning behind them. (remember when he called all the CHs exploiters? :smileysurprised

By giving droid certs to only some of the professions, you will beeffectivley unbalancing the game in their direction. Even if you charge them more skill points or AXP points, it will still make them more attractive to the "templatechasers" and will cause a majority of the players to take up that profession.

Ok, I can hear you all asking, so I'll get to it. Why not give the cert to all the professions? The answer to this lies in the third issue. MMOs all have to be balanced not only against the players, but against the environment as well. The reason we have been seeing the old nerf bat swinging almost continually since this game was released is that it was not balanced properly from the beginning. I know that we all agree that this is all SOEs fault, and I think that most of the staff we have seen recently pretty much agree that this game was released too soon. Anytime you see these big swings in balance in the first few months of a game, it's pretty much a dead on bet that it wasn't ready for release yet. 'Nuff said about that by all. Currently, the devs are working towards trying to balance the environment. This is what TH is talking about in his "combat balance" posts. The first step in this direction was the balancing of the creatures. They used to be stronger than they wanted them in the end, so they nurfed them. Currently, the players are stronger than they want them in the end as well. These are the changes that will be taking place over the next couple of months. So how does this relate to the "all for one" certs? If they were to increase the power of the players, even if it was at a cost of some type of XP or skill points, they would have to go back and re-tweak the creatures again. Again, it's not the type of decision that is typically made by a developer. This decision is made by the bean-counters. The reaction of the devs to our proposals of the cert systems tell me that this decision has already been made. Right or wrong, there ain't gonna be a global cert.

Well, what are we left with? Can't give them to an existing profession. Can't give them to all the professions. We have to make a new profession to give them to. Enter the Droid Handler. The real issue here is that we DEs all want the existing stuff fixed, right? The harder the implementation of combat droids are to implement, the less dev cycles are left to fix stuff. While I'm sure we all are saying "why haven't they fixed this stuff yet", I don't have a good answer for that. Other than to say that we need to remember that we are just one profession in this game and thse decisions are made by who? That's right, the bean-counters. End of the day, even though this is a game to us, it's still a business. It's actually in our best interest that they run it as profitable as possible, 'cause the alternative is that it goes bye-bye.

Well, there it is folks. Sorry this got so long, but I've been struggling with this myself over the past few days and the vent felt kinda good. I think the only decision we need to make now is, do we want to keep playing DEs or SWG itself under these conditions. For myself, I'm gonna just bide my time and see how it all works out. Then I'll make both of those decisions.

Jenden

Wed Jan 28, 2004 3:13 pm

#2

duncje wrote:

My question is why can't they put the combat droids on the back burner and focus on bug fixes and added utility? Then, once that's in progress, worry about how to implement combat droids...

/sigh

GnomeAd pretty much sums it up, but I think another factor is again the effort vs reward issue. They put in combat droids, almost everyone is happy (with the exception of many DE's, which are a small portion of the player population). You put in utility modules, primarily only DE's are happy to any real extent. Other players will like the new and usefull modules, but it won't be quite the same game changing addition that it would be for us. They keep more people happy with combat droids than utility droids. Also, the impatient people who are more likely to cancel subscriptions tend to be the combat oriented people. Crafters tend to be a little bit more layed back and patient.

Jenden Morn - Master of Droids- Tarquinas
Droid Engineer Blue Glowy
Owner, Operator, and Founder of DarkStar Inc.
Groupy of the best band in the galaxy, Solar Flair
3D art of Jenden by Saeelwenea

EricTheGreat

Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:19 am

#3

In all that long-winded post, you never ever once mentioned Frank, who by your topic, is who is going to discuss the droid certs.

Where is Frank? When will he be revealed? Is he hidden way, possibly kidnapped, by some communist plot?

Or are unhappy droids, treadwells possibly, used their many limmbed mandible claws to rip Frank to shreads?

SAVE FRANK FROM THE COMMIES AND TREADWELLS

Kenner Aldric

~Deviancy At Its Best~

BH/Pistoleer Cowboy Extrodinaire, Recovering Old Timer MDE Spice Addict

GnomeAd

Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:21 am

#4

Sorry, got to rolling and forgot about Frank.

duncje

Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:24 am

#5

My question is why can't they put the combat droids on the back burner and focus on bug fixes and added utility? Then, once that's in progress, worry about how to implement combat droids...

/sigh

Beebo
Master Droid Engineer | Shipwright | Master Artisan
Crazy Beebo's Discount Droids & Ships {-1075 -2924} Bestine, Tatooine

duncje

Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:26 am

#6

EricTheGreat wrote:

In all that long-winded post, you never ever once mentioned Frank, who by your topic, is who is going to discuss the droid certs.

Where is Frank? When will he be revealed? Is he hidden way, possibly kidnapped, by some communist plot?

Or are unhappy droids, treadwells possibly, used their many limmbed mandible claws to rip Frank to shreads?

SAVE FRANK FROM THE COMMIES AND TREADWELLS

LOL. Thanks for the laugh, ETG

Beebo
Master Droid Engineer | Shipwright | Master Artisan
Crazy Beebo's Discount Droids & Ships {-1075 -2924} Bestine, Tatooine

GnomeAd

Thu Jan 29, 2004 1:32 am

#7

duncje wrote:

My question is why can't they put the combat droids on the back burner and focus on bug fixes and added utility? Then, once that's in progress, worry about how to implement combat droids...

/sigh

I think that the whole "P-mon" thing not only struck a chord with the developers, but with the reviewers and potential customers as well. I'm sure someone at SOE has some good marketing info saying that if they add combat droids, subscriptions should increase by x%. Again, it's a game to us and the devs, it's a business to SOE and they write the checks.

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Thread: Frank discussion on droid certs