Droid Engineer Archive

Thread: Droid Engineers calling multiple droids to rehash an old debate

Straker_Atrella
Wed Oct 13, 2004 2:48 pm
#14
While as much as I would love this idea, it appears I am in the minority with thinking this is a bad idea.


Droid Engineer is a crafting profession, we craft Droids then sell them, or give them in some cases.


There are many other crafting professions as well. Not a single one of them gets any kind of "perk" that other people don't get. This would be the same as.......


Giving Chefs bigger stomichs, so they can eat more.

Giving Archs more lots.

Letting Armorsmiths wear better armor.

Letting Tailors wear cool clothes nobody else could.

Letting Weaponsmiths use 2 weapons instead of one.


They all use Droids for Merchant Barking and crafting as well.


A BE can make Pets, but can't use anymore then anybody else, they would need to pay the skill points for CH.


While it would be cool, and even make sense that DE's could use more Droids, it just wouldn't be really fair.



-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Droid Vendor at Resurection near Theed on Naboo -5757 6222. Both carry a wide variety of maxed Droids, I also carry every type of Droid and Droid supply.

*Straker Atrella: Dark Jedi * Atrella's Wench: Master Droid Engineer / Artisan / Scout / Merchant * Dark Vortex: Ranger / Rifleman * Havana:Musician / Dancer / Image Design * Enigmatica : Doctor / Swordsman* CrazyEyes: Role playing BH.
Straker_Atrella
Wed Oct 13, 2004 4:51 pm
#15
I understand what you are saying. We do far more support then other classes, at least question wise. Yea maybe we maintain the droids with supplies like batteries and stims, but that is really just another product.


I'm sure Chefs get lots of questions about Foods, and WS's get lots about adding loot componants, I know I bug my WS friend a lot.


Don't get me wrong, I love droids. We want to feel like our product and profession is special and different.


The truth is that were make a product, just like all the other crafting professions.


Perhaps if we agreed to give up on Droid Decay forever, and in trade have the ability to call a second non-combat droid, that would fly. Just adding it to us would not go over well with the other crafters, and rightly so IMO.



-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Droid Vendor at Resurection near Theed on Naboo -5757 6222. Both carry a wide variety of maxed Droids, I also carry every type of Droid and Droid supply.

*Straker Atrella: Dark Jedi * Atrella's Wench: Master Droid Engineer / Artisan / Scout / Merchant * Dark Vortex: Ranger / Rifleman * Havana:Musician / Dancer / Image Design * Enigmatica : Doctor / Swordsman* CrazyEyes: Role playing BH.
Drashk
Wed Oct 13, 2004 6:09 pm
#16


Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:


Drashk, I don't agree. The term "combat droid" and "utility droid" doesn't currently relate to the chasis, it literaly only relates to the modules inside. So to say an R-series droid is not a utility droid is incorrect when its carrying anything BUT combat modules.


The point that I was trying to get across is that the only distinction between Utilty and Combat Droids is the ability to install Combat Modules. When the Combat Modules were added, the R-series recieved a huge bump in HAM. This applies to LE Repair Droids as well. Unless the HAM value of these droids was associated with the Combat Modules, then they are still considered 'Combat Droids'. I know that you may disagree with me on this one, however I don't think that the code, as it is, knows the difference. This would be yet another issue that would be needed to addressed before a Droid Engineer is given the ability to call more then one droid.





Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:


Firstly, we know droids use "SOME" of the standard pets rules while also holding there own. There is obviously somekind of "droid detection" test going on to prevent you from calling more than one droid in the first place. Its got nothing to do with creature handling abilities since even an MCH is only able to call 1 droid (though able to call 1 droid and multiple pets).


Secondly, most, if not all, of the "flags" required to make this code already works. How? Because there are already tests happening when you have a droid called that allows you to take it into combat or not. What ever variable tells the game than an R2 can or cannot be programmed for attack is obviously the same variable that can be tested for to decide if more droids can be called or not. As a programmer myself, I can see multiple ways of doing it that don't involve much of a modification to the script that already exists to prevent you calling more than one droid.



The 'flags' may exist, but take a look at how long it would take to debug the current flags, add the additional flags, and then debug the way that the new flags interact with each other.




Straker_Atrella wrote:

While as much as I would love this idea, it appears I am in the minority with thinking this is a bad idea.


Droid Engineer is a crafting profession, we craft Droids then sell them, or give them in some cases.


There are many other crafting professions as well. Not a single one of them gets any kind of "perk" that other people don't get. This would be the same as.......


Giving Chefs bigger stomichs, so they can eat more.

Giving Archs more lots.

Letting Armorsmiths wear better armor.

Letting Tailors wear cool clothes nobody else could.

Letting Weaponsmiths use 2 weapons instead of one.


They all use Droids for Merchant Barking and crafting as well.


A BE can make Pets, but can't use anymore then anybody else, they would need to pay the skill points for CH.


While it would be cool, and even make sense that DE's could use more Droids, it just wouldn't be really fair.


Straker has hit many of the points that the Correspondents bring up all of the time, when one profession makes a comment on adding some to their profession.


There are a lot of checks and balances in place for each profession and are based upon such things as prereqs, skill point use, and professional role.


The Droid Commander profession idea is basically the answer to higher level combat droids. One of the many reasons that the profession wasn't added a few months back was due to trying to define it as a profession, so that it is distinict is some form. Before Droid Engineers are given Droid Commander like abilities, I think that we need to know all of the facts about what the Droid Commander profession would and would not do.


I'd think that everyone would like things be done correct the first time around, instead of pushing for something in the short term and possiblely having it removed at some point later down the line.


We've all heard the saying ' Measure twice, cut once.'





Making SWG more Star Warsy. One droid at a time.
Vampiric_Hoshi
Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:10 am
#17
"however I don't think that the code, as it is, knows the difference"


The code, as it is, knows whether an R2 unit with a combat module has the "attack" option in its radial and ones that do not don't. That alone tells you that there is already a scripted check on the combat abilitiy of all droids since the R2 uses the same script that every other droid makes. Therefore, the code and all variables needed to decide if a called droid is combat-capable is already in place. This means modifying the code that says you can only have 1 droid called is not that much work at all, its simply taking the combat-capable test and adding it to the test that checks for a called droid.


For instance, assume that the current code in a very basic raw format looks something like this:


if ( $droid_exists )



Abandon all hope
Vampiric_Hoshi
Thu Oct 14, 2004 4:20 am
#18

"however I don't think that the code, as it is, knows the difference"


The code, as it is, knows whether an R2 unit with a combat module has the "attack" option in its radial and ones that do not don't. That alone tells you that there is already a scripted check on the combat abilitiy of all droids since the R2 uses the same script that every other droid makes. Therefore, the code and all variables needed to decide if a called droid is combat-capable is already in place. This means modifying the code that says you can only have 1 droid called is not that much work at all, its simply taking the combat-capable test and adding it to the test that checks for a called droid.


For instance, assume that the current code in a very basic raw format looks something like this:


if ( droid_exists== false { do_call_function }


Obviously there is a lot more to it than that, but essentialy thats what the current code would be doing. Checking for the existance of a called droid and if the responce is "false" (meaning there is no called droid) then a droid is called.


Then there's another check happening everytime you look at the program radial that in a very basic raw format would look like this:


if( droid_attack == yes ) { display_attack_command }


Here, the script checks if the droid is combat capable, if the answer is yes it displays the "attack" command on the program radial. Most likely, every droid has an entry in the database that lists "combat_capable - yes or no"


You see where I'm getting here? Its just a series of IF statements andpars checks that already exist with a few modifications.


Lets also not forget that a similar system is already in place for creature handlers so ultimately is re-using existing code and just hashing it into the DE profession.


People keep comparing Droid Engineer to crafting professions like Weaponsmith. Well how many weapons can a Weaponsmith store? Are they limited to only being able to own 5 of their own creations?


Droid Engineer is NOT a crafting profession like architect, weaponsmith, chef or tailor. Its not a support class like Bio Engineer either. Itsa breed of its own and therefore should not be restricted by rules of other professions just because it has similarities.


The point here is that as a profession, only being able to call 1 droid hampers a Droid Engineer's ability to Engineer Droids



Abandon all hope
Drashk
Thu Oct 14, 2004 5:13 am
#19


Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:


"however I don't think that the code, as it is, knows the difference"


The code, as it is, knows whether an R2 unit with a combat module has the "attack" option in its radial and ones that do not don't. That alone tells you that there is already a scripted check on the combat abilitiy of all droids since the R2 uses the same script that every other droid makes. Therefore, the code and all variables needed to decide if a called droid is combat-capable is already in place. This means modifying the code that says you can only have 1 droid called is not that much work at all, its simply taking the combat-capable test and adding it to the test that checks for a called droid.


For instance, assume that the current code in a very basic raw format looks something like this:


if ( droid_exists== false { do_call_function }


Obviously there is a lot more to it than that, but essentialy thats what the current code would be doing. Checking for the existance of a called droid and if the responce is "false" (meaning there is no called droid) then a droid is called.


Then there's another check happening everytime you look at the program radial that in a very basic raw format would look like this:


if( droid_attack == yes ) { display_attack_command }


Here, the script checks if the droid is combat capable, if the answer is yes it displays the "attack" command on the program radial. Most likely, every droid has an entry in the database that lists "combat_capable - yes or no"


You see where I'm getting here? Its just a series of IF statements andpars checks that already exist with a few modifications.


Lets also not forget that a similar system is already in place for creature handlers so ultimately is re-using existing code and just hashing it into the DE profession.


Let us look at it from a slightly different angle.


We are currently experiencing a number of reported bugs with Probots. Probots with a 0 Combat Rating currently have the ability to cause damage as if they had a full 550 Combat Rating, when attacked or put on defend. This issue is, of course, a bug.The thing about it is that it only effects the Probots, but not the DZ70, which appears to have the same functions. This would suggest that there isn't always a single 'blanket' script written for all droids, but rather that each droid set has its own script.


If we look further, we will see that there are a number of instances that support that there isn't a single 'blanket' scirpt. Every chassis specific bug that we have ever seen points to this. In order to even begin thesetting up code, to allow a Droid Engineer the ability to call more then one non-combat droid, each and every droid would have to be coded and debugged and more then likely it would need to be debugged again at some later point, when a new function was introduced.


People keep comparing Droid Engineer to crafting professions like Weaponsmith. Well how many weapons can a Weaponsmith store? Are they limited to only being able to own 5 of their own creations?


Droid Engineer is NOT a crafting profession like architect, weaponsmith, chef or tailor. Its not a support class like Bio Engineer either. Itsa breed of its own and therefore should not be restricted by rules of other professions just because it has similarities.


The point here is that as a profession, only being able to call 1 droid hampers a Droid Engineer's ability to Engineer Droids


If this was real life, I would completely agree with you. The problem with this very passionate statement is that its based upon how you feel and look at the profession through the eyes of the profession. No matter how the case if argued, no profession can ever have it all.


The game environment is based upon checks and balances within its design.From a non-emotional, game balanced, point of view, can you name one reason that Droid Engineers would be justified the ability to call more then one droid at a time? This is the angle that needs to be examined and hashed out.



I hope that you know that I am playing Devil's Advocate on this one. I'm just trying to show the kind of resistence that such an idea would see when put before a certain Red name that likes the word NO.


One more thing that I want to point out, which is always my first and foremost question for any good idea that I see floating around on the DE forum - Would it be development time well spent, when compared to other issues? We always have to take into consideration that any time spent on one issue will always mean that another issue could fall by the way side.


Would this ability be more important then......


  • creating a Decay system that ensure a healthier droid market?

  • increasing the number of Droid Chassis' that we can produce?

  • giving each droid a distinict function?

  • a profession that would increase the number of customers that we have?

  • adding more modules to our profession?

  • fixing our semi-busted experimentation system?

  • giving our creations a little more 'personality'?





Making SWG more Star Warsy. One droid at a time.
Jenden
Thu Oct 14, 2004 6:11 am
#20




Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:


"however I don't think that the code, as it is, knows the difference"


The code, as it is, knows whether an R2 unit with a combat module has the "attack" option in its radial and ones that do not don't. That alone tells you that there is already a scripted check on the combat abilitiy of all droids since the R2 uses the same script that every other droid makes. Therefore, the code and all variables needed to decide if a called droid is combat-capable is already in place. This means modifying the code that says you can only have 1 droid called is not that much work at all, its simply taking the combat-capable test and adding it to the test that checks for a called droid.


For instance, assume that the current code in a very basic raw format looks something like this:


if ( droid_exists== false { do_call_function }


Obviously there is a lot more to it than that, but essentialy thats what the current code would be doing. Checking for the existance of a called droid and if the responce is "false" (meaning there is no called droid) then a droid is called.


Then there's another check happening everytime you look at the program radial that in a very basic raw format would look like this:


if( droid_attack == yes ) { display_attack_command }


Here, the script checks if the droid is combat capable, if the answer is yes it displays the "attack" command on the program radial. Most likely, every droid has an entry in the database that lists "combat_capable - yes or no"


You see where I'm getting here? Its just a series of IF statements andpars checks that already exist with a few modifications.


Lets also not forget that a similar system is already in place for creature handlers so ultimately is re-using existing code and just hashing it into the DE profession.


People keep comparing Droid Engineer to crafting professions like Weaponsmith. Well how many weapons can a Weaponsmith store? Are they limited to only being able to own 5 of their own creations?


Droid Engineer is NOT a crafting profession like architect, weaponsmith, chef or tailor. Its not a support class like Bio Engineer either. Itsa breed of its own and therefore should not be restricted by rules of other professions just because it has similarities.


The point here is that as a profession, only being able to call 1 droid hampers a Droid Engineer's ability to Engineer Droids





It may seem like each droid has a simple combat_capable flag, but its just as likely that each droid has a static command list of commands it can be programmed for, and each droid that has the attack command can be programmed with the attack command, if it can't be programmed. If it has a combat rating of 0 (what you get if you put no modules in) it still has a damage/attack rating (just look at the probot/DZ70), it just doesn't have the command. While you may be able to search through the list every time you want to call another droid, thats a bad way of doing it.



Jenden Morn - Master of Droids- Tarquinas
Droid Engineer Blue Glowy
Owner, Operator, and Founder of DarkStar Inc.
Groupy of the best band in the galaxy, Solar Flair
3D art of Jenden by Saeelwenea

Straker_Atrella
Thu Oct 14, 2004 2:00 pm
#21




Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:



People keep comparing Droid Engineer to crafting professions like Weaponsmith. Well how many weapons can a Weaponsmith store? Are they limited to only being able to own 5 of their own creations?


Droid Engineer is NOT a crafting profession like architect, weaponsmith, chef or tailor. Its not a support class like Bio Engineer either. Itsa breed of its own and therefore should not be restricted by rules of other professions just because it has similarities.


The point here is that as a profession, only being able to call 1 droid hampers a Droid Engineer's ability to Engineer Droids




Now your talking 2 different things. I agree that DE's should be able to HOLD more droids. That is our product, we should be able to hold more then 5. That is totally different then using them.


Products areMADEby crafters. Products are USED by customers.


You can determine a crafter by the bonus's that he gets by crafting a certain product. IE a weaponsmith makes better weapons then a chef would.


Customers don't get bonus's to using a product unless they have spent skill points to get an extra Cert.


When it comes to USING droids, we are customers. We may think we are different, we may want to be different, but for balance reasons, we are just crafters.





-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Droid Vendor at Resurection near Theed on Naboo -5757 6222. Both carry a wide variety of maxed Droids, I also carry every type of Droid and Droid supply.

*Straker Atrella: Dark Jedi * Atrella's Wench: Master Droid Engineer / Artisan / Scout / Merchant * Dark Vortex: Ranger / Rifleman * Havana:Musician / Dancer / Image Design * Enigmatica : Doctor / Swordsman* CrazyEyes: Role playing BH.
Vampiric_Hoshi
Fri Oct 15, 2004 4:44 am
#22
"When it comes to USING droids, we are customers"


If that were the case, we wouldn't gain extra colours to paint droids after they've been created. We would have the same pallette choice that average joe's get. But we don't. Why? Because we are considered to "know" all there is to "know" about Droids. We are effectively the gods of the droid world. We have skills and abilities regarding everything droid-related that no one else in the galaxies posses. Therefore we gain a bonus tool to paint our droids with a larger variety of colours than anyone else. This is not part of droid creation as we get to colour droids before we hit the build button. This is an added bonus, a present if you like, for being a Droid Engineer.


So is it therefore not pheasable to think that if we, the Droid Engineers, are able to have a larger colour pallette after a droid is built that we, the Droid Engineers, may posses other DE-only bonuses such as being able to call more droids.


Lets break things down a little here and have a look at what after professions can do that we don't get the luxery of;


¬ Colouring objects - Aside from Composite Armour and vehicles, no other crafted objects can be painted by customers. If they want a new coloured object they have to go back and buy a new one.

¬ WeaponsmithsArmoursmiths and Tailors get bonuses for repairing their crafted items making them the preferred choice when you need an item repaired to make sure it doesnt fail. Droid Engineers get no extra bonuses in repairing droids. We repair droids just the same as anyone else.

¬ Architects, Weaponsmiths Tailors and Chefs arnt restricted to how many of their crafted items they can use, regardless of how many they can store. If a weaponsmith wants to make 50 blasters and use them all he can do without having to delete 5 each time. Why can't we? Even Architects are only limited by their amount of lots.


The list goes on. Ultimately, Droid Engineer is gated in every aspect of being a crafter and a profession in SWG. We are limited in what we can build, what we can own and what we can use. We are bogged down with rediculously high component/sub component needs and excessively high resource and rare resource requirements. Our products are broken, worthless or obselete. Abilities that were once required to be done by a Droid Engineer such as painting droids can now be done by everyone. In short, the developers have made us the scum of the crafting world.


We are the forgetten, the betrayed andthe unwanted.


Its only fair we gain things like this to try and repay to us what we were promised when Droid Engineer was first mentioned.


Forget the damn Combat Revamp, give us a PROPER Droid Revamp! Not 2 wasted months of development time with a result of a bunch of worthless modules that barely work.



Abandon all hope
Straker_Atrella
Fri Oct 15, 2004 5:59 am
#23




Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:

"When it comes to USING droids, we are customers"


If that were the case, we wouldn't gain extra colours to paint droids after they've been created. We would have the same pallette choice that average joe's get. But we don't. Why? Because we are considered to "know" all there is to "know" about Droids. We are effectively the gods of the droid world. We have skills and abilities regarding everything droid-related that no one else in the galaxies posses. Therefore we gain a bonus tool to paint our droids with a larger variety of colours than anyone else. This is not part of droid creation as we get to colour droids before we hit the build button. This is an added bonus, a present if you like, for being a Droid Engineer.


So is it therefore not pheasable to think that if we, the Droid Engineers, are able to have a larger colour pallette after a droid is built that we, the Droid Engineers, may posses other DE-only bonuses such as being able to call more droids.


Lets break things down a little here and have a look at what after professions can do that we don't get the luxery of;


¬ Colouring objects - Aside from Composite Armour and vehicles, no other crafted objects can be painted by customers. If they want a new coloured object they have to go back and buy a new one.

¬ WeaponsmithsArmoursmiths and Tailors get bonuses for repairing their crafted items making them the preferred choice when you need an item repaired to make sure it doesnt fail. Droid Engineers get no extra bonuses in repairing droids. We repair droids just the same as anyone else.

¬ Architects, Weaponsmiths Tailors and Chefs arnt restricted to how many of their crafted items they can use, regardless of how many they can store. If a weaponsmith wants to make 50 blasters and use them all he can do without having to delete 5 each time. Why can't we? Even Architects are only limited by their amount of lots.


The list goes on. Ultimately, Droid Engineer is gated in every aspect of being a crafter and a profession in SWG. We are limited in what we can build, what we can own and what we can use. We are bogged down with rediculously high component/sub component needs and excessively high resource and rare resource requirements. Our products are broken, worthless or obselete. Abilities that were once required to be done by a Droid Engineer such as painting droids can now be done by everyone. In short, the developers have made us the scum of the crafting world.


We are the forgetten, the betrayed andthe unwanted.


Its only fair we gain things like this to try and repay to us what we were promised when Droid Engineer was first mentioned.


Forget the damn Combat Revamp, give us a PROPER Droid Revamp! Not 2 wasted months of development time with a result of a bunch of worthless modules that barely work.






So because we paint Droids better afterwards, that means we should get to call extra droids? MA's get more Vehicle Pallates, should they get better vehicles? If shipwrightes get more Palatte options as well, should they get better ships? Sorry I just don't see the paint connection to calling more then one droid.


Armorsmiths, Weaponsmiths and Tailors DON'T get a bonus to repairing items. The only things that help are tapes and FS repair.


Archs, WS's, Armorsmiths, and Chefs ARE 100% limited on how much they can use at a time. They don't get more lots, bigger stomichs, more layers of armor, or duel weld. They USE items exactly like everybody else.


If your talking about storage in the datapad, that is entirely a seperate issue from calling them at once.




-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Droid Vendor at Resurection near Theed on Naboo -5757 6222. Both carry a wide variety of maxed Droids, I also carry every type of Droid and Droid supply.

*Straker Atrella: Dark Jedi * Atrella's Wench: Master Droid Engineer / Artisan / Scout / Merchant * Dark Vortex: Ranger / Rifleman * Havana:Musician / Dancer / Image Design * Enigmatica : Doctor / Swordsman* CrazyEyes: Role playing BH.
Vampiric_Hoshi
Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:03 am
#24
"Armorsmiths, Weaponsmiths and Tailors DON'T get a bonus to repairing items"


You are wrong my friend. Armoursmiths, Tailors and Weaponsmiths get a bonus for repairing the corresponding item. I.E. Armoursmiths get a +100 repair bonus for repairing armour. Ask a master of any of these 3 to check his/her mods in the skills window and they will find the repair mod sitting in there.


Also, to my knoweldge MA's do not get any extra colours than anyone else. My non-Artisan character gets just as many paint options when painting a vehicle as my MA/MDE character does. He doesn't, however, get as many colours to choose from when painting droids.


My point is simple. Droid Engineer is NOT just about building droids. If that's all you personaly wish to do then thats your choice, but don't limit the rest of the DE community because you can't see beyound crafting. As a Droid Engineer, we should be responcible for building, maintaining, poweringand repairing droids. In order to do that effectively we need to be able to call crafting droids, power droids and a repair droid at the same time. Also considering the amount of components and resources we are expected to carry with us and the fact we can't wear packs because of the DE bandoleer as well, it is very important for a DE to have extra droids called for extra active storage space.


You're very good at picking apart people's points as to why we SHOULD get it, but you are yet to give reason why we SHOULDN'T.



Abandon all hope
Straker_Atrella
Sun Oct 17, 2004 4:16 am
#25




Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:

"Armorsmiths, Weaponsmiths and Tailors DON'T get a bonus to repairing items"


You are wrong my friend. Armoursmiths, Tailors and Weaponsmiths get a bonus for repairing the corresponding item. I.E. Armoursmiths get a +100 repair bonus for repairing armour. Ask a master of any of these 3 to check his/her mods in the skills window and they will find the repair mod sitting in there.


Also, to my knoweldge MA's do not get any extra colours than anyone else. My non-Artisan character gets just as many paint options when painting a vehicle as my MA/MDE character does. He doesn't, however, get as many colours to choose from when painting droids.


My point is simple. Droid Engineer is NOT just about building droids. If that's all you personaly wish to do then thats your choice, but don't limit the rest of the DE community because you can't see beyound crafting. As a Droid Engineer, we should be responcible for building, maintaining, poweringand repairing droids. In order to do that effectively we need to be able to call crafting droids, power droids and a repair droid at the same time. Also considering the amount of components and resources we are expected to carry with us and the fact we can't wear packs because of the DE bandoleer as well, it is very important for a DE to have extra droids called for extra active storage space.


You're very good at picking apart people's points as to why we SHOULD get it, but you are yet to give reason why we SHOULDN'T.






First let me be clear about something. I LOVE being a Droid Engineer. I love making the Droid, I love the complexity of putting them together in different combinations. I love finding the different color combinations and making each droid look different. I love having customer support, and answering peoples questions.


Repairing, maintaining, and powering a Droid? When was the last time you repaired a droid and it REALLY needed it. Ohh I may muck around fixing peoples droids once in a while, but without decay, they hardly need it. Maintaining a droid? How do you do that? The last time I checked droids didn'r wear out. Powering a Droid. Yep we do that. So does anybody else with batteries or a power Droid. I sell probably 3 power droids a day. Everybody does that, nothing special about that.


Your mistaken about the +100 Armor repair. They get +100 Exp and Assembly, not repair. Check it yourself if you want too. There are no numbers suggesting at all any bonus to repair. In fact many tests have been done, as well as I'm pretty sure Devs said that besides tapes and FS there is no bonus. They WANT crappy repairs, they WANT stuff to wear out.


Calling extra droids would be very nice, I would like it a lot. Yet I am able to step outside the proffession and what I would like and see that it really wouldn't be fair to other professions, they get no such bonuses.


Yet, I am in favor of extra droid datapad space, don't confuse the 2 issues, they are very different.




-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Droid Vendor at Resurection near Theed on Naboo -5757 6222. Both carry a wide variety of maxed Droids, I also carry every type of Droid and Droid supply.

*Straker Atrella: Dark Jedi * Atrella's Wench: Master Droid Engineer / Artisan / Scout / Merchant * Dark Vortex: Ranger / Rifleman * Havana:Musician / Dancer / Image Design * Enigmatica : Doctor / Swordsman* CrazyEyes: Role playing BH.
Drashk
Sun Oct 17, 2004 5:11 am
#26




Vampiric_Hoshi wrote:

"Armorsmiths, Weaponsmiths and Tailors DON'T get a bonus to repairing items"


You are wrong my friend. Armoursmiths, Tailors and Weaponsmiths get a bonus for repairing the corresponding item. I.E. Armoursmiths get a +100 repair bonus for repairing armour. Ask a master of any of these 3 to check his/her mods in the skills window and they will find the repair mod sitting in there.


Since when? I just checked and that is a negative on this one Hoshi. No bonus found on the TC code. There has never been a listed bonus to my knowledge.


My point is simple. Droid Engineer is NOT just about building droids. If that's all you personaly wish to do then thats your choice, but don't limit the rest of the DE community because you can't see beyound crafting. As a Droid Engineer, we should be responcible for building, maintaining, poweringand repairing droids. In order to do that effectively we need to be able to call crafting droids, power droids and a repair droid at the same time. Also considering the amount of components and resources we are expected to carry with us and the fact we can't wear packs because of the DE bandoleer as well, it is very important for a DE to have extra droids called for extra active storage space.


You're very good at picking apart people's points as to why we SHOULD get it, but you are yet to give reason why we SHOULDN'T.



Hoshi, again.....


If this was real life, I would completely agree with you. The problem with this very passionate statement is that its based upon how you feel and look at the profession through the eyes of the profession. No matter how the case if argued, no profession can ever have it all.


The game environment is based upon checks and balances within its design.From a non-emotional, game balanced, point of view, can you name one reason that Droid Engineers would be justified the ability to call more then one droid at a time?


The statement in Red is the key here. Everything that you have stated in the entirety of this thread is based upon 'real life' experience and is based upon emotional responses. Any profession could provide similar reasons for why their profession should be able to call more then one droid out at a time.


You however have not provided a Game Balaced reason as to why only Droid Engineers should be given this ability.


I'm going to call you out on 'If that's all you personaly wish to do then thats your choice, but don't limit the rest of the DE community because you can't see beyound crafting.' That is a trumph card that has been played too many times in the past. Droid Engineer is already a very unique profession. We have more abilities then most professions will ever see. Droid Engineer is already has a well defined role as being a crafting profession, just like Architects, Weaponsmiths, Armorsmiths, and Tailors. You may feel that Droid Engineers should be something more then the support role we are in, however that is simply not how the profession was designed.


We all have 250 Skill points for a reason. The way the system was designed, you can become a Master Craftsmen, with all of the needed support skills, a Master Combatant, with many routes to chose from, but limited Crafting Support, or a Jack of all Trades, but Master of none.


No singleprofession can have it all. The Droid Commander profession will be added at some point. Being able to call more then one droid at a time, and being able to store a greater number of droids, will more then likely fit into the realm of Droid Commander. Whether you like the Droid Commander profession or not is not the case here. The Droid Commander profession is the answer to having high level combat droids, with a skill point price tag.


Time and time again, people have argued that Droid Engineers should be able to use this or that droid functoin, or we should be able to have a greater number of droids at our disposal. Unfortunately all of the arguements that have ever been listed are flawed, based upon the 'rules of the game'. Skill point expediture, profession role, and balance are all rules of the game, not 'But we are Droid Engineers and should be able to this or that because we are Droid Engineers.' The 'rules of the game' are what the DEVs look at, especially the DEV team that we have now.


I want to repeat once again, that I am not trying to tear the idea down, but rather I'm trying to point out the flaws in how the debate is going about. This is how I see certain 'Tyrant' responding to this thread, only with a lot more words then he would normally use. If it was him speaking, the one word that I can see him using would be
NO






Making SWG more Star Warsy. One droid at a time.
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