Droid Engineer Archive
Thread: New De need some advice please!
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WickedMidget
Tue May 25, 2004 11:16 am
#1
Hey everyone,
Im starting on DE and needa few tips from the master's. What kind of resources will I need ,and what can of harvesters should i start to put down to get those resources? What can i craft that will give the most exp with the smallest amount of resources used. Thanks in advance for all your help!
Tanooshman
Tue May 25, 2004 11:40 am
#2
Welcome!
You'll need Mineral and Chemical Harvesters Gas Harvesters are optional - you can pretty much buy inert gas on the market. Once You're Master Droid Engineer you'll want your own and lots of them.
Start with MSE deeds just metal and chemical - Practice - use the cheapest resources you can.... Head on up to Advanced Blueprints. Then start Advanced Droid Frames. Steel and Fibreplast.
Practice those until you're Master!
Gavvot
Tue May 25, 2004 1:03 pm
#3
This statement doesn't imply I have proof, it does imply I have experience in droid building, other crafting professions, and programming.
I do experiment on most if not all the items.
But the result doesn't change whatever the experiment is.
If your fond of proof, just prove me wrong.
EDIT : Beside, even if experimentation on other stuff does do something, it isn't visible in anyway, so doesn't add any value to the droid, so, doesn't matter.
I do experiment on most if not all the items.
But the result doesn't change whatever the experiment is.
If your fond of proof, just prove me wrong.
EDIT : Beside, even if experimentation on other stuff does do something, it isn't visible in anyway, so doesn't add any value to the droid, so, doesn't matter.
Message Edited by Gavvot on 05-25-2004 10:04 PM
JodoKai
Tue May 25, 2004 2:25 pm
#4
Pallida wrote:
Gavvot wrote:
You'll mainly need steel, copper, fiberplast and aluminium.
The few modules on wich experimentation does matter are based on conductivity and OQ, so that's what you're looking for.
Fiberplast with high OQ is also usefull, as most of the hih droids are based on that for HAM.
(Yes.. this is a [snip/paste] from an earlier post)
*sigh*
Here we go again.... As I have stated before, there is absolutely no proof, with one notable exception (a developer's statement of effect regarding droid-mounted crafting stations), that resource quality and experimentation have absolutely no effect on any/all modules and subcomponents that are used in construction of a droid.
We have "conclusions" that players have drawn from tests... However, conclusions are not "proof" unless no other means of determining "proof" exists. Statements such as that in the above quoted post are misleading and imply that the poster does indeed have "proof" of effect.. proof that available only via a developer statement of effect.
What exactly do you require for proof? You have a Dev statement and thousands of tests done by hundreds of DE's. What would it take for you to give up this rediculous statement every time someone says this? I've made droids with 10 quality sub-components and got the EXACT SAME results as the ones that had -7 quality sub-components. If that's not proof what is? Tell me, short of the Almighty himself standing in front of you saying "IT HAS NO EFFECT", what it will take to convince you? The Dev's have already said they won't talk numbers, so I agree with the above poster, the whole world has taken it for a FACT that quality sub-components doesn't matter. The burden of proof now lays on your shoulders. Prove to the rest of us the world is flat or give this up please.
BoAbdor
Tue May 25, 2004 4:15 pm
#5
So Pallida you ae saying that using really high quality resources and experimenting has no effect on combat modules?!? Why then does the combat rating change and the min/max damage of the finished droid change based on experimentation? I believe what we have here is a case wher some modules, mostly the newer ones, depend on resources and experimentation but the olders modules do not.
Wirebiter
Tue May 25, 2004 5:24 pm
#6
/rolls eyes
here we go again boys and girls........
TK, can we get a sticky link to this argument and just refer to it as needed?
-thanks
P.S. we could call it "DEAD HORSE!!!!!!!!!!"
CHODA----MDE/Droid teacher to the Kettemoor massess
JodoKai
Tue May 25, 2004 7:11 pm
#7
BoAbdor wrote:
So Pallida you ae saying that using really high quality resources and experimenting has no effect on combat modules?!? Why then does the combat rating change and the min/max damage of the finished droid change based on experimentation? I believe what we have here is a case wher some modules, mostly the newer ones, depend on resources and experimentation but the olders modules do not.
Oteb,
Actually Pallida is saying the exact opposit. He's saying there is no proof that the quality of sub-components (droid brains, EGPM, EMM etc) has no effect. The literally thoudands of tests done by all the DE's mean nothing to him. Unless a Dev sends him a PM telling him it has no effect he won't believe it. Pallida, like I said before, you're telling all of us the sun isn't yellow it's purple, so the burden of proof lies with you. You want us to believe something that we've all taken as a given, so please either prove your point or give it up.
AudioOrgana
Tue May 25, 2004 10:01 pm
#8
JodoKai wrote:
The literally thoudands of tests done by all the DE's mean nothing to him. Unless a Dev sends him a PM telling him it has no effect he won't believe it. Pallida, like I said before, you're telling all of us the sun isn't yellow it's purple, so the burden of proof lies with you. You want us to believe something that we've all taken as a given, so please either prove your point or give it up.
LMAO.
It's not even about "tests", it's about common sense.
Dosome peoplethink that droids have some hidden stats? Let's see, what can droids do with no modules - follow you around is about it. Is there some secret stat that affects how fast they follow you?
There is no effect for most of our items (the exceptions being certain modules and final droid HAM) with experimentation because largely our items have no stats/abilities. There is nothing to effect. It's like spice - it either exists, or it doesn't - there is no varying quality.
Anyone who doesn't get this a) obviously has never really used/made droids seriously, or they would see this, and b) instead of arguing about it we should just sit back and laugh at them as they waste time/resources/energy experimenting on the "mechanism quality" of a Droid Sensor package, bwahahahaha.
JodoKai, you are absoultely right - when someone makes such a uninformed statement it is up to them to prove the point. In this case, it's just common sense and experience - and nothing I have read here has even begun to invalidate either.
If there is some magical internal quality rating we can't see, it obviously doesn't matter to actual gameplay or we'd know about it - in either case, it's silly to argue about.
When I get players complaining to me about the dome falling off the R3 I sold them because the "mechanism quality" and "durability" isn't high enough I'll start to worry - until then sensible DE's know better, and those that don't can comfort themselves in being better than the rest of us. I mean, there is nothing going to be hurt by a DE experimenting on these useless stats - except to those people that have negative attitudes towards total wastes of time. 
AO
starcraftWS
Wed May 26, 2004 12:03 am
#9
Welcome!
These forums are a wealth of information. I would highly recommend reading the FAQs and other stickies at the top of the forum.
As for what resources you'll need... lots and lots of named minerals/metals, and to a lesser degree some named chemicals and gases
(of course, many of our schematics use generic "copper" or "polymer", etc.). Some of our high-end schematics require factory parts,
so you'll most likely be running a few of those as well.
Best way to learn the trade is to tinker.
Tarne_Monter
Wed May 26, 2004 12:32 am
#10
As far as harvestors go, you'll probably want several(3-4) medium minerals, a couple medium chemical(2 or so) and a couple medium gas.
That should keep you going while you grind up. Also watch out for some of the rare spawns. Check out www.swgcraft.com for schematics so you know what resources to look out for.
Also if your server has a DEA join up with them.
That should keep you going while you grind up. Also watch out for some of the rare spawns. Check out www.swgcraft.com for schematics so you know what resources to look out for.
Also if your server has a DEA join up with them.
Gavvot
Wed May 26, 2004 12:44 am
#11
You'll mainly need steel, copper, fiberplast and aluminium.
The few modules on wich experimentation does matter are based on conductivity and OQ, so that's what you're looking for.
Fiberplast with high OQ is also usefull, as most of the hih droids are based on that for HAM.
The few modules on wich experimentation does matter are based on conductivity and OQ, so that's what you're looking for.
Fiberplast with high OQ is also usefull, as most of the hih droids are based on that for HAM.
Pallida
Wed May 26, 2004 12:50 am
#12
Gavvot wrote:
You'll mainly need steel, copper, fiberplast and aluminium.
The few modules on wich experimentation does matter are based on conductivity and OQ, so that's what you're looking for.
Fiberplast with high OQ is also usefull, as most of the hih droids are based on that for HAM.
(Yes.. this is a [snip/paste] from an earlier post)
*sigh*
Here we go again.... As I have stated before, there is absolutely no proof, with one notable exception (a developer's statement of effect regarding droid-mounted crafting stations), that resource quality and experimentation have absolutely no effect on any/allmodules and subcomponents that are used in construction of a droid.
We have "conclusions" that players have drawn from tests... However, conclusions are not "proof" unless no other means of determining "proof" exists. Statements such as that in the above quoted post are misleading and imply that the poster does indeed have "proof" of effect.. proof thatavailable only via a developer statement of effect.
sssssssssssSSS(:-<
EnigmaBSc
Wed May 26, 2004 5:54 am
#13
Actually, I have to side with Pallida on this one, but for slightly different reasons:
1. There are numerous ways in which the quality of components could possibly affect the final droid. Probability of critical failure on final combine, probability of great success on final combine, hidden caps on final droid, battery usage, speed and probably a few others. Some of these are virtually impossible to test. With the prices of droids, some of these can have a significant impact even with a tiny change (a 1% change to critical failure rate could save you an extra 60000 credit droid a month). Yes some of these are highly improbable, but remember, some of these effects could easily be caused by bugs.
2. This is an MMORPG. Things are subject to change at any time, either deliberately or accidentally. Just because experimentation doesn't matter today doesn't mean it won't matter tomorrow. If all Droid Engineers believe that experimentation doesn't matter then they won't ever bother to experiment and if things do ever change so that experimentation does matter, it will be a long time before we know about it.
3. Humans are notoriously hopeless at gut feeling statistics. The best way to know whether experimentation matters or not is to conduct peer-reviewed scientific tests, and to repeat these tests periodically, in case anything has changed. If we don't keep testing then if anything does change we won't see it.
I have no problem telling fellow Droid Engineers that experimentation on certain components is pointless TO THE BEST OF OUR KNOWLEDGE, but I believe they should be encouraged to make their own decisions as to whether they wish to experiment or not. If things do change in the future and experimentation does start to make a difference then it will be people like Pallida who notice it first. Let's try not to alienate him too much, so that if it does happen he'll come and share the news with us rather than deciding to get his own back and not tell anyone.
EnigmaBSc
1. There are numerous ways in which the quality of components could possibly affect the final droid. Probability of critical failure on final combine, probability of great success on final combine, hidden caps on final droid, battery usage, speed and probably a few others. Some of these are virtually impossible to test. With the prices of droids, some of these can have a significant impact even with a tiny change (a 1% change to critical failure rate could save you an extra 60000 credit droid a month). Yes some of these are highly improbable, but remember, some of these effects could easily be caused by bugs.
2. This is an MMORPG. Things are subject to change at any time, either deliberately or accidentally. Just because experimentation doesn't matter today doesn't mean it won't matter tomorrow. If all Droid Engineers believe that experimentation doesn't matter then they won't ever bother to experiment and if things do ever change so that experimentation does matter, it will be a long time before we know about it.
3. Humans are notoriously hopeless at gut feeling statistics. The best way to know whether experimentation matters or not is to conduct peer-reviewed scientific tests, and to repeat these tests periodically, in case anything has changed. If we don't keep testing then if anything does change we won't see it.
I have no problem telling fellow Droid Engineers that experimentation on certain components is pointless TO THE BEST OF OUR KNOWLEDGE, but I believe they should be encouraged to make their own decisions as to whether they wish to experiment or not. If things do change in the future and experimentation does start to make a difference then it will be people like Pallida who notice it first. Let's try not to alienate him too much, so that if it does happen he'll come and share the news with us rather than deciding to get his own back and not tell anyone.
EnigmaBSc
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