Doctor Archive

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bioshock wrote:

They pay it because they have no choice.

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Message Edited by Songe on 04-30-2004 04:55 PM

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Songe wrote:

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bioshock wrote:

They pay it because they have no choice.

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Wow I didn't know people absolutely had to get buffed, nor that you were omniscient and knew for sure what all the players of this game think. They have the choice to either not get buffed by this person or level up the doc tree as we did. That being said, I agree with you, I guess that nobody ever pays anything willingly and they would rather get it free... Fortunately things don't work this way, or there would be no more crafters, nor docs to buff at all. There will always be people to complain that things are too expensive anyway.

Message Edited by Songe on 04-30-2004 04:55 PM

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I like it. You start out by quoting me, then make a combination snide comment/personal insult (if you are going to personally insult someone, at least do it up right and ease up on the patronizing, it just makes you look soft and squishy), and then you follow that up by proving my point exactly. "They have the choice to either not get buffed by this person or level up the doc tree as we did." - which is pretty much the same as what I said, "pay or else do without".


Either way, if they need something, whether it be armor or buffs or food, they have no choice but to pay whatever ripoff prices thieving sellers choose to charge.

You can play around with it and try to sugarcoat it all you want, but that's the reality and it stinks.



At any rate, I've had enough of arguing with you. You haven't actually made a valid point in quite a while, and you are defending a weak position anyway (and not doing a great job of it), so there isn't much point in taking this any farther.

Message Edited by bioshock on 04-30-2004 02:19 PM

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CaptainStormy wrote:

tell you what

1. When i can pay 5-10 CPU for good avian meat like every other resource, on my server even the best herbivor meat only goes for at most 25 cpu. when i can pay that price range instead of the insane amount of 200cpu for bad avian meat and insane prices for the good stuff, we have a spawn of avian meat a while back that was 800 in all stats, in shift it was selling for 500 cpu. thats crazy.

2. When i dont have to have some BE bivoli to buff people. I hate this stuff, its really not worth the price, on my server its 150K ( more with alot of the cheifs ) for a crate of 25 thats three uses per stack. and that extra 25 wound treatment gives me about an extra 300 - 400 points that really isnt worth the price honestly.

3. When people offer to pay me a fair price for my other services like rezing, wound healing, curing poison/desease, things like that. Reguardless of what you think, docs are underpaid for all of there services, yes including buffs, but even more so on the rest of the stuff. Almost noone tips when you heal them when they ask you to, and many dont even say thank you, most just run off.

4. When docs are no longer mistreated. I know ive gotten atleast 10 invites to go to the corvet that were all only because i was a doc, none of these groups offered to pay me, yet they all expected me to stay in the back, not fight, not get any loot and heal them all. Why would i go on something like that, at first i thought it was only the first group that wanted me to, but i got many more invites like it, then i thought it was just me, but no, other docs on my server have gotten the same. Also whenever people stop thinking docs are here to only serve them, i cant tell you the number of time that ive gotten a tell from somone i dont even know that has espected me to travel a long way to come rez them, and when i said no they bad mouthed me for so long that i had to /addignore them

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If I wanted too, I could buff for free every other set I produce, and still make money.

When I was a new doctor I made a **edit** load of716 buffs that last 3 hours. While not that great I only charge 6K for all 6 of these on shadowfire, while my top end 890ishgo for 20K a set, sometimes 30 depending on my mood.

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bioshock wrote:

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Songe wrote:

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bioshock wrote:

They pay it because they have no choice.

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Wow I didn't know people absolutely had to get buffed, nor that you were omniscient and knew for sure what all the players of this game think. They have the choice to either not get buffed by this person or level up the doc tree as we did. That being said, I agree with you, I guess that nobody ever pays anything willingly and they would rather get it free... Fortunately things don't work this way, or there would be no more crafters, nor docs to buff at all. There will always be people to complain that things are too expensive anyway.

Message Edited by Songe on 04-30-2004 04:55 PM

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I like it. You start out by quoting me, then make a combination snide comment/personal insult (if you are going to personally insult someone, at least do it up right and ease up on the patronizing, it just makes you look soft and squishy), and then you follow that up by proving my point exactly. "They have the choice to either not get buffed by this person or level up the doc tree as we did." - which is pretty much the same as what I said, "pay or else do without".


Either way, if they need something, whether it be armor or buffs or food, they have no choice but to pay whatever ripoff prices thieving sellers choose to charge.

You can play around with it and try to sugarcoat it all you want, but that's the reality and it stinks.



At any rate, I've had enough of arguing with you. You haven't actually made a valid point in quite a while, and you are defending a weak position anyway (and not doing a great job of it), so there isn't much point in taking this any farther.

Message Edited by bioshock on 04-30-2004 02:19 PM

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That's a really odd way of looking at things. I guess you think that doctors should somehow subsidize combat character professions by providing them low cost buffs. Well in that case shouldn't rangers also be forced to sell avian and herbivore meat at lower prices as well just to subsidize doctors? Moreover, who would be the judge of these prices? Really, who would be the person(s) in charge of keeping the prices low? Who would enforce the prices? You? Well comrade, I think that is just a bad idea.

It really does seem you are overlooking the ability of people to just say no and do without. There really isn't someone with a knife to their throats forcing them to pay for the buff. The buffee simply has to make an economic choice and think whether the cost of the buff is offset with the benefits given. Your point seems to allude that the buffees are somehow held hostage by doctors when in fact there is no coercive behavior exerted on either side of the transaction. You hardly seem to give any credit/blame for the person on the other side of the buff for willingly paying.

The only determining factor on prices for anything is what someone is willing to pay for it, and what someone is willing to sell it for. There is no such thing as too cheap/too expensive prices. The market and those players partaking in said market will determine the prices accordingly. Arguing one side or the other really makes little sense.

There is no such thing as overpricing as long as people are willing to pay that price.

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relaxin wrote:
That's a really odd way of looking at things. I guess you think that doctors should somehow subsidize combat character professions by providing them low cost buffs. Well in that case shouldn't rangers also be forced to sell avian and herbivore meat at lower prices as well just to subsidize doctors? Moreover, who would be the judge of these prices? Really, who would be the person(s) in charge of keeping the prices low? Who would enforce the prices? You? Well comrade, I think that is just a bad idea.

It really does seem you are overlooking the ability of people to just say no and do without. There really isn't someone with a knife to their throats forcing them to pay for the buff. The buffee simply has to make an economic choice and think whether the cost of the buff is offset with the benefits given. Your point seems to allude that the buffees are somehow held hostage by doctors when in fact there is no coercive behavior exerted on either side of the transaction. You hardly seem to give any credit/blame for the person on the other side of the buff for willingly paying.

The only determining factor on prices for anything is what someone is willing to pay for it, and what someone is willing to sell it for. There is no such thing as too cheap/too expensive prices. The market and those players partaking in said market will determine the prices accordingly. Arguing one side or the other really makes little sense.

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Well, your first paragraph basically breaks down like this:

You start out by saying I have an odd way of looking at things...okay I'll certainly admit to that. If having a conscience, being ethical and having a sense of fair play is odd (and it certainly seems that it is...at least around here), then you can definately call me odd. But I don't kill-steal or ninja-loot either...and that also seems to be odd...at least in this game.

Then you go on to make a false assumption about what I think - then make a few comments to reinforce the tenets of that false assumption - then attempt to characterize me as a communist based upon your false assumption...

Nice try, but no cigar. It's total BS built upon a completely false assumption. (Not only that, but let me also say it was transparent and weak. You'll just have to try harder. I really hope that wasn't your best shot.)

At no time have I ever mentioned subsidies, other than to say that it is not my job to prop up the business of a doctor who pays too much for their buffs - or charges too much for their buffs - by raising my prices so that they can charge more. I.e., I won't subsidize their mistakes - or their greed - by adjusting my prices to accommodate them. Implying that I should actually puts YOU in the postion of seeming to advocate subsidies, Comrade Doctor.

But -I- certainly haven't advocated subsidies in -any- way. I would have to say that you must have pulled that whole line of reasoning out of your ass.

The TRUTH is that I don't subsidize anyone - I DO MAKE A PROFIT. A HEFTY PROFIT.




As for overlooking anything, that is again, false. I have clearly stated (perhaps in another thread) that people are faced with the choice to "pay or do without". OBVIOUSLY, that statement clearly indicates that I have NOT overlooked that people can do without. So, if it seems to you that I am overlooking that, it only shows that either you didn't read what I wrote, or you weren't paying attention when you read it. (Or that you just didn't understand it, which I'm not prepared to rule out either.)




"You hardly seem to give any credit/blame for the person on the other side of the buff for willingly paying" - here you make the same mistake that Songe made...that of assuming that just because someone -does- pay, that they paid "willingly". Of course that can be semantically argued on the basis of "the defintion of willingly", but I'm not even going to bother wasting time on that. The fact is that when faced with a choice of either pay X or do without, then even if someone really thinks that X is just too danmed much, they will most likely still pay, rather than do without. There is no implication that just because they paid, that they thought it was right or good or fair...it only implies that they didn't choose to do without.

Limiting peoples choices can be construed as a form of coercion. (Which is why price fixing and monopolizing are illegal.)

Now, of course, if there are 3 doctors buffing, and one charges 6k, and one charges 10k and one charges 15k, then if they chose to go to the higher one - for whatever reason - then yes, they -did- "willingly" pay that price. Perhaps they wanted a shorter line, or more powerful buffs. Yes absolutely, if they make that choice then it would be willingly. But if -all- the doctors there charged 15k then there is -only- the choice to pay whatever price or do without...and if they pay, it does NOT prove that they paid willingly. It only proves that they chose not to "do without".

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bioshock wrote:
But if -all- the doctors there charged 15k then there is -only- the choice to pay whatever price or do without...and if they pay, it does NOT prove that they paid willingly. It only proves that they chose not to "do without".

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DarthXanthic wrote:

What cap for 2500 for a buff?

Doctors can charge what they want, if you don't like it, go fight unbuffed.

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/agree how much money do you make off of a docs hard work gathering resources for your buffs...200k?+ stop crying about 12-15k for a buff and pay the bill...just be glad you dont have a h.m.o......how bad would the service be then?!