Doctor Archive
Thread: Why the hostility towards the Docs that crafted the buffs/stims that you use?
MyT_Chicken wrote:
Again I wish you would stop pointing fingers at me like everything happening is my fault just because I realize the potential of the changes. And next time you use my name I would appreciate it if you spelled it correctly.
TarMangani wrote:
Zulu_Dawn wrote:
Just curious as to why the majority of the posters on thisforumappear to have such a negative opinion of the people that crafted & sold buffs/stims for a living.
A Chef/AS/WS/(insert crafting profession) does exactly the same thing, makes a product & sells it at a profit.
Why is/was it wrong fora Docto do the same with buffs/stims?
*Disclaimer - Yes, I know I can pickup the med crafting line of BE and craft 'enhancers/stims' post-CURB.
I don't believe that to be the case, and I'm a crafting doc. I think you'll find most people are antagonistic against what they label "buff-bots" and the ever-so-stereotypical "people who went doc just to get rich."
In reality there really aren't that many "buff-bots." As in people who only enter the game and buff all the time...As a doc who has done his share of buffing, it gets very, very boring quickly, and the 12-15K you may be making per buff really doesn't seem as worth it when you consider your time wasted.
Now if they're speaking of the AFK buffer, well that's another story. As for me, I see nothing wrong with a player who sets up his toon in a house and offers a buff service. I see some frustration with those who setup camp at a starport and buff using a macro and are AFK, but again, I can't say that the majority of docs do that either, though they do exist.
People believe that the AFK macro style of healing is the downfall of the profession, (hence the reason for the change). To some like My_T Chicken, even afk tumblers and the like are cheaters... it just depends on your interpretation...
To the puritanical style of healer, the CU is their dream come true. The look upon the crafting and buffing doctors asobjects of scorn or pity, and say things to us like "well if you want to craft, just go BE!" However what they're really saying is "find another profession, you no longer have any place within our noble ranks..." They put quotes around our words when the quote us when we call crafting or buffing a play style, as if the very idea of such a thing were foreign to them.
The CU has produced it's own fair share of frustration, flaming, glee and all other areas of the spectrum...It's to be expected...
However in the end the combat healer playstyle wins out. The devs are forcing a re-org of the professions and we players simply need to pick up the pieces and move on...
How is quoting you saying that you think tumbling is cheating pointing fingers at you? (My bad on the name...)
Darksfallen wrote:
/everything is MiTea-Chkin's fault
MyT_Chicken wrote:
Again I wish you would stop pointing fingers at me like everything happening is my fault just because I realize the potential of the changes. And next time you use my name I would appreciate it if you spelled it correctly.
TarMangani wrote:
MyT_Chicken wrote:
Again I wish you would stop pointing fingers at me like everything happening is my fault just because I realize the potential of the changes. And next time you use my name I would appreciate it if you spelled it correctly.
TarMangani wrote:
Zulu_Dawn wrote:
Just curious as to why the majority of the posters on thisforumappear to have such a negative opinion of the people that crafted & sold buffs/stims for a living.
A Chef/AS/WS/(insert crafting profession) does exactly the same thing, makes a product & sells it at a profit.
Why is/was it wrong fora Docto do the same with buffs/stims?
*Disclaimer - Yes, I know I can pickup the med crafting line of BE and craft 'enhancers/stims' post-CURB.
I don't believe that to be the case, and I'm a crafting doc. I think you'll find most people are antagonistic against what they label "buff-bots" and the ever-so-stereotypical "people who went doc just to get rich."
In reality there really aren't that many "buff-bots." As in people who only enter the game and buff all the time...As a doc who has done his share of buffing, it gets very, very boring quickly, and the 12-15K you may be making per buff really doesn't seem as worth it when you consider your time wasted.
Now if they're speaking of the AFK buffer, well that's another story. As for me, I see nothing wrong with a player who sets up his toon in a house and offers a buff service. I see some frustration with those who setup camp at a starport and buff using a macro and are AFK, but again, I can't say that the majority of docs do that either, though they do exist.
People believe that the AFK macro style of healing is the downfall of the profession, (hence the reason for the change). To some like My_T Chicken, even afk tumblers and the like are cheaters... it just depends on your interpretation...
To the puritanical style of healer, the CU is their dream come true. The look upon the crafting and buffing doctors asobjects of scorn or pity, and say things to us like "well if you want to craft, just go BE!" However what they're really saying is "find another profession, you no longer have any place within our noble ranks..." They put quotes around our words when the quote us when we call crafting or buffing a play style, as if the very idea of such a thing were foreign to them.
The CU has produced it's own fair share of frustration, flaming, glee and all other areas of the spectrum...It's to be expected...
However in the end the combat healer playstyle wins out. The devs are forcing a re-org of the professions and we players simply need to pick up the pieces and move on...
How is quoting you saying that you think tumbling is cheating pointing fingers at you? (My bad on the name...)
I'll defend MyTea on this one........ (sorry, that name is gonna stick now...... :smileyvery-happy
Nobody is against crafting docs, I think it's pretty crappy that I won't be able to craft my own meds when I need to. What some of us are against are macros that allow you to train, gain XP, level up, when you're not actually playing the game........you're off at work, sleeping, whatever, while the rest of us are ATK playing our way through the grind. The same for buff-bots........I sit ATK and buff, not as often as I used to, but still pretty regularly, so every credit I get I earned. That's a whole 'nother post, though, do a search for them.
I feel bad for the crafting docs. As it was, they had limited combat skills, if they wanted a couple of vendors, but enough to go out and fight, have fun that way.......now, if you want to craft, you pretty much have to give up ALL combat skills, and with SP buffing pretty much going away (although, we'll see), that source of income is gone also......not just for those who buff, but for the docs that made the buffs. Hard to sell a product when the demand has dropped drastically. Again, though, that's speculation. I honestly don't think the demand will drop much, but instead of a doc buying 1-2 mil worth of buffs at one shot, they'll be buying just what they need, and since tipping for medical services is gonna be pretty much non-existent for awhile, docs won't be buying much. It is a blow, overall....and not just for the "rich docs".......I don't make that much, nor have that much, I honestly make an equal amount running missions and looting as I do buffing in a starport for a night.
On the other hand, you might see more docs, now that the most boring part of the grind is gone. That was the hardest for me, crafting ABEC's for hours to make MD. I think it will level out ok, it's just gonna take some getting used to.
Twitchie wrote:
TarMangani wrote:
MyT_Chicken wrote:
TarMangani wrote:
Zulu_Dawn wrote:
Just curious as to why the majority of the posters on thisforumappear to have such a negative opinion of the people that crafted & sold buffs/stims for a living.
A Chef/AS/WS/(insert crafting profession) does exactly the same thing, makes a product & sells it at a profit.
Why is/was it wrong fora Docto do the same with buffs/stims?
*Disclaimer - Yes, I know I can pickup the med crafting line of BE and craft 'enhancers/stims' post-CURB.
People believe that the AFK macro style of healing is the downfall of the profession, (hence the reason for the change). To some like My_T Chicken, even afk tumblers and the like are cheaters... it just depends on your interpretation...
Again I wish you would stop pointing fingers at me like everything happening is my fault just because I realize the potential of the changes. And next time you use my name I would appreciate it if you spelled it correctly.
How is quoting you saying that you think tumbling is cheating pointing fingers at you? (My bad on the name...)
Nobody is against crafting docs, I think it's pretty crappy that I won't be able to craft my own meds when I need to. What some of us are against are macros that allow you to train, gain XP, level up, when you're not actually playing the game........you're off at work, sleeping, whatever, while the rest of us are ATK playing our way through the grind. The same for buff-bots........I sit ATK and buff, not as often as I used to, but still pretty regularly, so every credit I get I earned. That's a whole 'nother post, though, do a search for them.
I feel bad for the crafting docs. As it was, they had limited combat skills, if they wanted a couple of vendors, but enough to go out and fight, have fun that way.......now, if you want to craft, you pretty much have to give up ALL combat skills, and with SP buffing pretty much going away (although, we'll see), that source of income is gone also......not just for those who buff, but for the docs that made the buffs. Hard to sell a product when the demand has dropped drastically. Again, though, that's speculation. I honestly don't think the demand will drop much, but instead of a doc buying 1-2 mil worth of buffs at one shot, they'll be buying just what they need, and since tipping for medical services is gonna be pretty much non-existent for awhile, docs won't be buying much. It is a blow, overall....and not just for the "rich docs".......I don't make that much, nor have that much, I honestly make an equal amount running missions and looting as I do buffing in a starport for a night.
There is no "defending" MyT because I didn't make any attacks against him. MyT has said in previous posts that, in his opinion, macros such as tumbling and the like are cheats, and to use them is cheating. Nothing more, nothing less. I quoted his statement in my post saying I didn't see much of a problem with it, but that he does. It wasn't libel or anything malicious, I just needed someone else's point of view to show both sides of a debate...
If it comes off as anything but that then it's not my intention. I'm not out to drag anyone's name through the mud, (especially MyT as his grasp on all this is much stronger than my own and I learn a lot from his posts).
Anyway, just wanted to ensure that was clear, (and to ponder why I'm up at my keyboard typing this at such an unseemly hour as I'm CST...
TarMangani wrote:
There is no "defending" MyT because I didn't make any attacks against him. MyT has said in previous posts that, in his opinion, macros such as tumbling and the like are cheats, and to use them is cheating. Nothing more, nothing less. I quoted his statement in my post saying I didn't see much of a problem with it, but that he does. It wasn't libel or anything malicious, I just needed someone else's point of view to show both sides of a debate...
If it comes off as anything but that then it's not my intention. I'm not out to drag anyone's name through the mud, (especially MyT as his grasp on all this is much stronger than my own and I learn a lot from his posts).
Anyway, just wanted to ensure that was clear, (and to ponder why I'm up at my keyboard typing this at such an unseemly hour as I'm CST...
It's all good (Little stressed out the other day). But if the game doesn't have a "Pause" button....there should be no AFK play period. I've said it before, but its a good point. For those that have played any Multiplayer FPS online, if you step away, your most likely gonna get shot and killed.
HL : TFC, I'm always a sniper, and I just LOVEEEEEE those people that say in spatial "AFK for a sec" while in the middle of the map. I make it a point to blown their heads off with my Sniper Rifle as many times as I can. Just so I can listen to them whine ("I WAS AFK MYT YOU F****** B**** A** HOLE") I always reply "Is there a pause button? No? I didn't think so, next time you better log out if you don't wanna get kill 15 times in a row."
If the game doesn't have a pause button, you shouldn't be AFK. Macro's are awesome....I use then every day, but they should not allow you to be AFK. That is SOE's fault.....it's a Bots fault because the sploit that "Flaw" in the macro system.
Ojes wrote:
MyT - I'm curious what your take is on harvesters, factories, and vendors that are operational when their owners are not at the keyboard? It seems a bit hypocritical of SOE to condemn AFK activities when they provide these in-game devices that are undeniably beneficial due to the fact that they function 24/7.
Well considering all of those actually cost money to operate I don't care. Factory's craft what 3x longer then doing so by hand? Those items are beside the point, they cost maintence and power to run. Whats it take to leave your toon AFK for 24/7? Nothing but an in game macro, that is the difference between Bots and Harvesters, factories, vendors.
AFK Loot bots that camp places like Lord Nyax get allthis uber loot and skill tapes and then sell them for millions? What did it cost to do that? *MAYBE* the cost of buffs....Yet they make millions for spending 3.5 hours AFK ruining gameplay for other people.
AFK Entertainers claim they provide a "Service" which they do....yet they also cause lag, spam, server load, grief actual people that play the profession, and still expect you to pay money even though you don't "have" to.
AFK Medics / Docs (or wanna be docs/ tumblers) ruin gameplay for others by being AFK and ignore people that come in...setting a bad example for all the otherplayers that actually play the profession. And people tell me "Well I don't wanna be a healer I'm doing this for XX reason." Then why waste your time, go hide in your guild hall or something if you wanna be like that.
Shall I continue? Last time I checked SWG didn't have a Pause button, but please correct me if I'm wrong.
Yeah...no idea where I'm going with this..just felt lke typing it out. Ignore me like the Devs always do
Panthu wrote:
Personally, I can't wait till this forum is full of chat about healing strategiesand whines about squishy damage dealers that run away from you and tanks who go nuts and ag more than you can heal them through, lol. Real Healer strategy and chat is fun! Most people would expect to find that on a Healer board... not more crafting talk. *shrug*
We had that once. Tales of people macroing sayings such as "Stop running away, idiot!". Different encounters in which silly combat folks would either run headlong into death OR ignore the Doc/CM as death ran at them. Discussions of which view to play in best, etc. All interspersed between talk of which way was the best to create the strongest meds possible, which types of resources made the most powerful healing items... It was nice.
Only reason 'crafting talk' has been the focal point is the lack of need for healing in group situations.
I'll miss both types of discussions, personally. They were enlightening and fun.
I'm not hostile towards crafting Docs, but I'm glad for the move to Healer play personally.
Don't you mean the 'traditional' Healer play? Because, no matter what, there was and is 'Healer Play' with the current Medical Profession set-up. Even if you don't want to admit it
The ones that really have my sympathy are the ones like Texxie, who are worried about the loss of downtime rewards and social spaces. That is a unique thing in SWG Doctors have always been tied to and I hate to see that slipping away... but the crafting? Pfft, won't be missing that.
I'll really miss the old days... when I could sit in the Tyrena hospital, wound healing players while talking to them about what they'd done that play session:
Me: "Man, you look like you got chewed up by a rancor"
Patient: "Chewed up and spit out..."
Me: "No worries pal, I'll get you fixed up in no time."
And then watch as they would be surprised by the speed and amount of healing I could drop on 'em when I used my C and D woundpacks using advanced comps and heavily experimented for power. Or sitting in a campsite between skirmishes and healing up your groupmates as you discuss what they did right or wrong, and how funny it was when so-and-so ran straight into the jaws ofa kraytbecause they were running from a kreetle and weren't paying attention.
I'll miss handing out some advanced B woundpacks to n00b medics to help them out, or dropping some nice resources on a low-level doc so they could make a few advanced comps, or just wandering by some random stranger in trouble and dropping a charge off a Stim-E onto them.
The downtime socialization, the crafting, the gameplay...I'll miss it all because, for me, it was all part and parcel of being an MCM/MD.
vortexala wrote:
Yeah...no idea where I'm going with this..just felt lke typing it out. Ignore me like the Devs always do
Panthu wrote:
Personally, I can't wait till this forum is full of chat about healing strategiesand whines about squishy damage dealers that run away from you and tanks who go nuts and ag more than you can heal them through, lol. Real Healer strategy and chat is fun! Most people would expect to find that on a Healer board... not more crafting talk. *shrug*
We had that once. Tales of people macroing sayings such as "Stop running away, idiot!". Different encounters in which silly combat folks would either run headlong into death OR ignore the Doc/CM as death ran at them. Discussions of which view to play in best, etc. All interspersed between talk of which way was the best to create the strongest meds possible, which types of resources made the most powerful healing items... It was nice.
Only reason 'crafting talk' has been the focal point is the lack of need for healing in group situations.
I'll miss both types of discussions, personally. They were enlightening and fun.
I'm not hostile towards crafting Docs, but I'm glad for the move to Healer play personally.
Don't you mean the 'traditional' Healer play? Because, no matter what, there was and is 'Healer Play' with the current Medical Profession set-up. Even if you don't want to admit it
The ones that really have my sympathy are the ones like Texxie, who are worried about the loss of downtime rewards and social spaces. That is a unique thing in SWG Doctors have always been tied to and I hate to see that slipping away... but the crafting? Pfft, won't be missing that.
I'll really miss the old days... when I could sit in the Tyrena hospital, wound healing players while talking to them about what they'd done that play session:
Me: "Man, you look like you got chewed up by a rancor"
Patient: "Chewed up and spit out..."
Me: "No worries pal, I'll get you fixed up in no time."
And then watch as they would be surprised by the speed and amount of healing I could drop on 'em when I used my C and D woundpacks using advanced comps and heavily experimented for power. Or sitting in a campsite between skirmishes and healing up your groupmates as you discuss what they did right or wrong, and how funny it was when so-and-so ran straight into the jaws ofa kraytbecause they were running from a kreetle and weren't paying attention.
I'll miss handing out some advanced B woundpacks to n00b medics to help them out, or dropping some nice resources on a low-level doc so they could make a few advanced comps, or just wandering by some random stranger in trouble and dropping a charge off a Stim-E onto them.
The downtime socialization, the crafting, the gameplay...I'll miss it all because, for me, it was all part and parcel of being an MCM/MD.
Message Edited by redog22 on 04-07-2005 06:35 PM
Message Edited by redog22 on 04-07-2005 06:36 PM
redog22 wrote:
i didnt make my doc to go healing in battle i made him to make buff packs i use and sell some . i dont like that just take that away . a lot off doc put a lot off time and money in to rescources, yes i make some money but my alt made just as much geting aa @ cc .but no big deal i can drop my doc and play my jedi if they dont nerf him to death to martukk /wolfgang ps well i get banded for this to ???????
Message Edited by redog22 on 04-07-2005 06:35 PM
Message Edited by redog22 on 04-07-2005 06:36 PM
well buffs as we knoware gone now.....