Doctor Archive
Thread: So what do you established crafters think of this?
Page 2 of 2
KDenelor
Mon Feb 14, 2005 9:23 am
#14
as a very established crafter on my server, I love this.
this is what I always immagined the bazaar could/should be.
Happymob
Mon Feb 14, 2005 9:54 am
#15
diepa wrote:
This will allow any crafter, regardless of location to compete.
Not really. If this change went in the way it was originally written, only 2 factors would matter - item quality and item price.
Every server has at least 1 established doctor with the following:
- Over 100 million high quality resources, many of them more than a year old
- Over 1 billion credits
- 20 or more factories of production
- Multiple alts
- 12 experimentattion points
How is the new doctor, with younger resources and only 10 experimentation points supposed to compete selling 410/42 veggie stims when the established mster is selling 425/45 veggie stims? The mega crafter can (and in many cases will) just drop their price to match thenew crafter. If the mega craftercan't keep up with production, they will just put more factories down. I'm amazed at how many crafters actually run 10 or more alts.
By making price and quality completely transparent, you remove any hope that the smaller crafter had of competing. Currently, a new doctor can do the following and succeed with relative ease:
- Focus on bazaar sales. The mega crafters don't bother here, but the proposed system removes this option since everything is effectively on the bazaar.
- Move to a player city without a good doctor crafter. This allows the new doctor to capture part of the market from other citizens. This goes away, since all shopping will be global, rather than local.
- Sell from a mall. Maybe they aren't the primary reason someone goes there, but people will buy meds on an impulse while shopping for something else, like weapons.
- Focus on making their shop somehow unique - maybe they stock meds and resell medical related foods, droids, and BE clothes. Maybe they carry C, D, and E woundpacks. Maybe they just decorate well. Maybe they are known for great customer service. All of this becomes devalued when the first place a player goes to shop is the bazaar rather than a shop.
I am thrilled that they have effectively moved this from in development to in concept. Let's find ways to ease the pain of shopping (in particular going to all those basically empty vendors) that don't hurt the crafter playstyle. I don't want to cede all my business to the Wal-Marts of the galaxies.
HealerChic
Tue Feb 15, 2005 4:51 am
#16
You all have some very good points here, but honestly I think this is a wonderful idea once they smooth out the edges.
People have been sick of running around to empty or near empty vendors for quite awhile now. So even if I have a well stocked vendor w/ good quality and low prices it can still be very hard to reach interrested customers. They might go to a well established vendor with higher prices just because that's all they know exists out there and they don't want to take the time to roam around the entire galaxy to find something cheaper.
Well with this they won't have to, and the cheaper merchant is finally rewarded. Will it cut into the pockets of well known merchants? Yes. Is it better for the Mom and Pop stores w/ the same or near same quality? IMA Yes. And I don't know about everyone else, but I'd rather see some credits in 20 people's pockets then just one.
I think this has the ability to loosen the hold that the one or two rich crafters now currently have on the market, andI can't wait. ~Assuming SWG doesn't take an awesome idea and completely ruin it upon execution.
Kristle
Meds and More on Flurry
Dant. Vendor only 300 away from MO at -720, 2880
toothlessviper
Tue Feb 15, 2005 6:05 am
#17
I'm not sold on this... I've worked many hours to make the shop look good as well as have a large stock of items. with this system all i need is a tent and alot of stock.. hell ill put everything on one vender and just put it on map.
I think a better idea would be to have a listing that shows what type of items are on the venders and people would have to go look to see prices..
This would blow up my in house specials ( i do this for people who use my shop )
I hate shopping empty vender also. ive done the 6 hours looking thing.
But my personal thought is, people love finding a fair priced well stocked vender. If you set it up this way new crafters will have a hard time keeping up with the large scale crafters. I keep a hugh stock, but someone trying to break in will not be able to compete with me, for the simple fact that i have MILLLLLions of resources stored 13 factories running around the clock,I could just low ball everyone.
I know some crafter on my server have 50 to over 100 of the resource deeds. that alone is going to keep the rich crafters even richer.
The deed thing is going to destroy the balance of the market as it is. now this ( if it goeslive )will just allow the same people to cripple the market.
just my tooth's cents .........
toothlessviper
Tue Feb 15, 2005 6:31 am
#18
healer chic. I see where you are comming from. But like real life ( I run a Buiss in real life ) Ive seen what open bids ( as in this system ) can do. You will not be able to compete with the larger scale operations. The large scale people can just crush you with low balling your product. Trust me on this ive seen it done. here is what might go down.
1. this system goes live....
2. some hold back at first to see what your prices are going to be. ( say 72k a set for buffs ) cheap! at first this sells well as you get alot of people buying first few day )
3. your vender start to get lower in stock. but you are happy you finally get some of that market. others follow your lead.
4. the large crafters say fine you want to do it that way! they put the 50 resource deeds into use. dont need lots right now so all are put into factories. and they start crafting.
5. here comes the low ball. 60k a set for buffs. 1500 sets on vender. now a price war has started.
6. you try to compete. you drop prices. but your resources are not what the large crafters are, you fall behind.
7. he ups the fight. drops prices again. 55k a set. hes not making a profit but who care he is selling a ton. he is already rich and starts buying up more of the resource deeds and with his large stock of resources saved up he keep it up at such cheap prices.
8. you are not able to compete. cant afford to buy the deed and harvest to keep up with his massive money supply. your shop is donw to almostno sales a few loyal customers
9. you get tired of trying to fight someone who has so much, you give up and quit crafting meds.
10. many like you quit.
11. the large scale crafter buys up the resources of the people who quit. the few who are still trying to keep up cant afford them.
12. the large crafter then has the market all to himself. he raises prices now. to 110k a set. with noone out there to compete with, he can now..
trust me if a large scale crafter wants too he can do this. i know some large scale crafters who have 600 mil in cash and so many resources they dont even know what they have anymore.
should be interesting if this goes live to see how many fall.
Message Edited by toothlessviper on 02-15-2005 05:33 AM
Message Edited by toothlessviper on 02-15-2005 05:34 AM
BraindG
Tue Feb 15, 2005 6:43 am
#19
Sounds good to me..
It will save me going to Dant each time to load vendor. Just stick em on Lok, and im done.
Don't you just get the feeling soe are really, really trying to get the market value down on products? Atleast your products become more widley available, be a bit of a bummer regarding current customers. I mean, with more customers finding your products, the chances your stock being sold out will increase.
But then again, you dont have to turn on the galaxy wide function do you.
HealerChic
Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:45 am
#20
ahh, very true, any small scale crafter trying to compete with large scale market owners will fall. But they don't have to compete the way you assume they will in order to get a piece of the market and still turn a good profit.
If the smaller business tries to grow and replace the larger ones they will in turn run out of resources and possibly get "low balled." But if these small businesses only intend on making a moderate number of sales and broaden their customer base/awareness they will be in better shape after this change then before.
In fact, with this new system there is no pressure to stay stocked to keep customers. So small businesses don't have to have the massive stock of resources that the larger businesses do - they won't be hurting here.
I say this because people will look desired items up for cheapest price on the bazarr, if you have it they buy if you don't they select next page and another small scale supplier takes care of them.Now large scale market owners don't get this freedom. They have specific loyal customers they are obligated to keep things in stock for, and if they don't they run the risk of losing their loyal customers - even better for Mom and Pop shops.
So now we assume market owners lower prices. This will become a hurting time for all involved (except customers, lol). The good thing about this is it won't last forever and not all involved will quit the second prices hit rock bottom.Perhaps a few will, but even better for those of us who stick it out. We gain their customers.
Let the high enders lose money selling cheap. I myself will stop selling buffs the second i can no longer turn a profit. This doesn' t mean I won't pick it back up the second those prices rise, only to claim my share of the market, providing the same great quality at low but profit making prices. Note this is done w/out a profit loss the whole time.
That mind-set also under estimates the massive number of small Med shops out there.Once prices rise, these shops, new and old will show again. They can't all be bought all, so in the end the only one losing significant amout of credit are the high rollers trying to low ball everyone.
Slash_DPC
Tue Feb 15, 2005 7:54 am
#21
When I first read about this, I was kinda psyched. Now that I think about it, I'm not so sure I like the idea. Like Marrow said, people come to my vendor b/c they know its stocked. I take advantage of that fact and mark my prices up a little more then anyone else. There are some up and coming crafting doctors on Gorath that have to keep their prices lower to get established.
And something just hit me: b/c alot of us have to stuff backpacks w/ buffpacks and load them on the vendor, do you think people would really trust a labled backpack on the bizaar for 150k? I don't think so. I think people will still make the journey to you're vendor to buy meds. Just a thought =]
And something just hit me: b/c alot of us have to stuff backpacks w/ buffpacks and load them on the vendor, do you think people would really trust a labled backpack on the bizaar for 150k? I don't think so. I think people will still make the journey to you're vendor to buy meds. Just a thought =]
Happymob
Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:13 am
#22
HealerChic wrote:
I myself will stop selling buffs the second i can no longer turn enough profit.
Fixed. Everyone has some threshold of profit at which they will stop crafting. For some, a 1000 credit profit on a Stim B is enough. For others, it's 100 credits. But there is no doubt that if prices become completely transparent and drop, then we will lose crafters. I can't see how fewer crafters is a good thing under any scenario, given that this is a multiplayer game designed to cater to multiple playstyles, including crafters.
Some will switch to combat. Some will quit the game. In either case, the game becomes less interesting as a result. Just my 2 credits.
Ojes
Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:22 am
#23
Slash - I think people will HAVE to trust packaged buff sets if they want to have matched sets. If you don't do that, what are the chances that the customer would ever find a matched set out of a galaxy-wide listing of pharmaceuticals?
On my vendor, I stopped packaging sets some time ago due to some inventory bugs that hit me during that process. I have several customers that will still ask me when I am going to go back to packaged sets. They are so convenient to the customer (as you all know).
BraindG
Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:24 am
#24
ah, i thought he was refferring to people putting up backpacks (for example) with Brains buffs 900.31.12312.MU89 when, infact they were not my buffs, just someone taking the pi55..
toothlessviper
Tue Feb 15, 2005 8:27 am
#25
ahh, you make good points. I just dont see it going that way on my server. the problem is the resource deeds and if this goes live. the two together will make life hell on newer crafters. im not kidding when i say some have over 100 deeds. the most ive heard of is 167 deeds... now if you are a crafting doc.. ( newer ) the person with the large deed collection and free will on venders will be hard to keep up with. even if you are trying to supply a small market.
here is why.. im trying to supply the smaller market. its cool as long as my avian supply is the same as the large guy. as in the best avian to ever spawn on the server. the 100 plus deeds the other guy has will keep him in the best avian forever. Where do you think those people who buy your packs are going to go when you run out of the good avain ? they have to keep up with other people who buff, anyone who has sat and buffed know what im talking about.
ive seen people who are loyal customers have to go to other pack makers becouse noone will pay them for the lower power buffs when someone else is buffing for higer and longer at the same price. Its just a fact...
Im not worried becouse of this or the deeds. ill do this becouse i like it. I just worry about the newer guys who are interested in crafting.... I like seeing new crafters heck i even help them get started, its just i dont want to see a few overpower the rest. shrug.... should be interesting.
Page 2 of 2