Doctor Archive
Thread: Economy so out of Whack makes buff pricing arbitrary
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Onahj_Zicohr
Wed Jul 28, 2004 3:21 pm
#1
I ran calculations on what it costs resources wise to make 1 set of buffs with a 25 use yield. The criteria I used were that in one instance all resources cost 100 cpu and in the other instance rare resources were 100 cpu and other resources were just 25 cpu. The bottom like is that in both cases there was 100000 and 180000 credits profit built into each when we are charging 10K a buff. That is even using Bivoli and Brandy.
I have gotten the open letter to doctors about upping our prices and am just saddened by it. Even when factoring in time to create them only the best of the best buffs should be getting more than that 10k arbitrary price. The just because I can attitude of charging whatever for that buff is what is causing these inflationary pressures.
The more I think about it the more I find it humorous that Jabba was only owed a few thousand credits by Han Solo and I can make that in about 6 minutes. That a spaceship with hyperspace capabilities could be bought for under 10000 cr according to Luke and so on.
I know there are underlying reasons Buffing is so overpriced but something should be done to bring the WHOLE economy in check as a whole. I think when buffs were equalized an arrogance went through the whole doctor profession into some sort of self congratulations. The buffs have NEVER changed strength, the only thing that was removed was randomness. An 850 buff always AVERAGED somewhere in the 2100's. Or course we now have Bivoli, halva and brandy but a buff is still a buff. Why the price inflation.
Well this may have been said a 100 times before but I finally wanted to put my few thoughts down. I hope that the combat revamp remedies both sides (doctor / hunter) of this overinflated economy. It isn't good for the game as a whole.
HZ
Master Doctor / Novice Pistoleer
Starsider
Naboo
I have gotten the open letter to doctors about upping our prices and am just saddened by it. Even when factoring in time to create them only the best of the best buffs should be getting more than that 10k arbitrary price. The just because I can attitude of charging whatever for that buff is what is causing these inflationary pressures.
The more I think about it the more I find it humorous that Jabba was only owed a few thousand credits by Han Solo and I can make that in about 6 minutes. That a spaceship with hyperspace capabilities could be bought for under 10000 cr according to Luke and so on.
I know there are underlying reasons Buffing is so overpriced but something should be done to bring the WHOLE economy in check as a whole. I think when buffs were equalized an arrogance went through the whole doctor profession into some sort of self congratulations. The buffs have NEVER changed strength, the only thing that was removed was randomness. An 850 buff always AVERAGED somewhere in the 2100's. Or course we now have Bivoli, halva and brandy but a buff is still a buff. Why the price inflation.
Well this may have been said a 100 times before but I finally wanted to put my few thoughts down. I hope that the combat revamp remedies both sides (doctor / hunter) of this overinflated economy. It isn't good for the game as a whole.
HZ
Master Doctor / Novice Pistoleer
Starsider
Naboo
HuntinHeads
Wed Jul 28, 2004 3:26 pm
#2
but you have to realize that as the economy is out of whack........ the prices of things keep going up because people have more money. More expensive things lead to more expensive buffs in order to keep up with inflation.
Onahj_Zicohr
Wed Jul 28, 2004 3:36 pm
#3
Exactly my point. INFLATION is not good for any economy there has to be a better mechanism for siphoning off credits than their currently is. I was pointing out that there is no underlying validation for the pricing of Buffs other than well that is the going rate. Supply and Demand are not working properly in our economy.. Does anyone have insight (true economic insight) as to why things are not coming to some happy more realistic medium.
HZ
Master Doctor / Novice Pistoleer
Naboo
Starsider
HZ
Master Doctor / Novice Pistoleer
Naboo
Starsider
ShinmaRyche
Wed Jul 28, 2004 3:53 pm
#4
Supply and Demand. Very high demand, and the price WILL go up. Last night I was in the Dant mining outpost grinding doc crafting, and there werent any docs buffing at all. People were screaming and spamming for a doc to buff. I was getting so many tells asking if I could buff, I changed my profession tag above my head. The one doc that showed, was started charging 20k for 2100ish buffs, and he had a line.lol. Until a master doc showed up and he went down to 8k or something like that.
Tholcrist
Wed Jul 28, 2004 4:26 pm
#6
i buy my buffs as getting +20 set of clothes would jsut take too much time that i don't ahve to put into it. that means i have to buy my buffs from people that do. i worked out that i have to charge 11.5k a buff jsut to break even so thats 12k for a small profit when competitions around, 15k when server starts up. At any rate getting a 15k buff most people make it back in 2-3 missions of normal kind, doing ER's you double your cost in a single missions as far as i see it we are doing them the favor of buffing if they want cheaper buffs then they should a) help harvest resources for docs so they become cheaper as there is more of it, or b) go become a doc themselves so they can buff for free. this is my two bits, but as a recent master doc i never minded paying 15k for buffs, it's the people that try to charge 20k that annoy me even though i can make it back quickly it's just arrogant.
Houdani
Wed Jul 28, 2004 6:36 pm
#7
Well, I still charge 10k when a group of people ask me to buff them. I don't advertise and I don't camp starports as a matter of preference. In general, I don't buff for money. With that said ...
Buffs are not driving the inflation. Rather, the buff prices are just reacting to the economy. The economy has been hosed almost since inception, but has been exagerated as a direct result of mission payouts being much too massive. The "sinks" the game uses to remove the massive influx of money are woefully ineffective. Inflation is the result of much more money flowing in than out.
Keeping buffs at a low arbitrary price of 10k won't do anything tofix the economy. Reducing mission payouts to a tenth of what they currently pay would be much more effective.
On the plus side, with MOB baddies getting their special attacks back on Thursday, maybe the free money that's spewing out of mission terminals will be stemmed considerably. I can only hope.
H.
Phonelesscord
Wed Jul 28, 2004 11:17 pm
#8
Buff prices and Slice prices are Rising because they simply never met the economy's inflation. Take for example an Armorsmith, see how much they charge for a set of comp compared to a few months ago, now look at us. We charge the same we have for quite awhile while everything else grows in price. An armorsmith selling comp can make 200% his expenses on a set of armor (he makes PROFIT 2x what he puts in, so charging 3 times the cost of materials)
Weaponsmiths make about 100% profit on average, we make 60-75% on average...
I too miss the days when 1000 credits was a large sum, but those days are over as sad as it is. Us making nearly no profits WILL NOT lower the high inflation. I will always charge 15-20k per buff, except for guildies. I can't afford the rising prices of Avian met.. 100-600 cpu based on quality... Some docs can make more profit based on what they PAYED for Avian in the past to make thier current buffs, Ill repeat, "PAYED!" They spent the lower costs before inflation,. to new crafters like myself, this IS NOT an option (selling at 10k)
Oh, and I wrote that letter ya got most likely
-Sacbut
Weaponsmiths make about 100% profit on average, we make 60-75% on average...
I too miss the days when 1000 credits was a large sum, but those days are over as sad as it is. Us making nearly no profits WILL NOT lower the high inflation. I will always charge 15-20k per buff, except for guildies. I can't afford the rising prices of Avian met.. 100-600 cpu based on quality... Some docs can make more profit based on what they PAYED for Avian in the past to make thier current buffs, Ill repeat, "PAYED!" They spent the lower costs before inflation,. to new crafters like myself, this IS NOT an option (selling at 10k)
Oh, and I wrote that letter ya got most likely
-Sacbut
Message Edited by Phonelesscord on 07-28-2004 11:19 PM
Onahj_Zicohr
Thu Jul 29, 2004 6:31 am
#9
My thoughts in general is that they could reform the economy quickly with one major change... Change the formula as they did the first few weeks of the game in how many credits are SPEWED OUT of the mission terminal.Justdivide thoseto something more reasonable so that the risk/reward is more matched... A buff should honestly be 20% of the cost of a mission for 3 hours (my thoughts) instead of the 3 percent it is now. I know what I said sounds contradictory but there has to be either a bigger drain or smaller spiget.
I remember the day when this was awefully tough then along comes things (levelized buffs, more peopl mastering) that threw it back into the credit spitting machine it is... Another solution is if you are a Master TKM you can't get the easier missions REGARDLESS of the strength of the Ham Bar...
Onahj_Zicohr
Thu Jul 29, 2004 6:33 am
#10
TKM was used as an example not picking on them btw... ANY Super profession in general is what I meant
taycie
Thu Jul 29, 2004 6:41 am
#11
On average the going rate on my server is 12k (which is what I charge if/when I decide to sell).
We've not had any decent herbivore meat in awhile so Im waiting to see if the prices start going up (which it will). Theres always some doctor there that is willing to pay obscene amounts of money (150cpu for decent herbivore) which affects the rest of us.
PhiGon
Thu Jul 29, 2004 6:55 am
#12
For doctors that have the patience to gather all of the best resources to make their own buff packs, yes, I can understand 10k seeming low, but for many of us who buy our buff packs, 10k is a very profitable price. Here's my situation:
Each buff pack crate cost roughly 165,000 credits
6 x 165,000 = 990,000 credits
Each buff has 29 uses and there are 10 sets per crate
29 buffs * 10 = 290 buffs
For illustration purposes, a doctor sells all buffs (not giving any away free or using on self)
290 buffs * 10,000 credits per buff = 2,900,000 credits
Cost for buffs minus Total Revenue:
2,900,000 - 990,000 = 1,910,000 credits
Material Cost per buff packs:
3414 credits per buff
Profit Margin for Buffing at 10k credits each:
293%
This doesn't factor in items such as Bivoli or Havla but Bivoli would have to be calculated seperately to determine how many customers you could buff in one filling of Bivoli and that would be amplified by taking Havla.
Each buff pack crate cost roughly 165,000 credits
6 x 165,000 = 990,000 credits
Each buff has 29 uses and there are 10 sets per crate
29 buffs * 10 = 290 buffs
For illustration purposes, a doctor sells all buffs (not giving any away free or using on self)
290 buffs * 10,000 credits per buff = 2,900,000 credits
Cost for buffs minus Total Revenue:
2,900,000 - 990,000 = 1,910,000 credits
Material Cost per buff packs:
3414 credits per buff
Profit Margin for Buffing at 10k credits each:
293%
This doesn't factor in items such as Bivoli or Havla but Bivoli would have to be calculated seperately to determine how many customers you could buff in one filling of Bivoli and that would be amplified by taking Havla.
BrJLa
Thu Jul 29, 2004 9:20 am
#13
On our server, it's tough finding a doc that's buffing the public. You're lucky if there's more than one in Coronet, and you can forget (most of the time) about finding them anywhere else.
Why? Because $10K at 30 people per hour is $300K. And if you're buying your packs, or even just some of your resources, your profit is lower still. So for a Doc buying their packs, it's maybe $200K an hour. For something that sure doesn't feel like "playing".
So $10K isn't arbitrary. It's the minimum amount it takes to motivate someone to sit around and buff the public. That's economics.
If the price is too low, then no one will buff. If the price is too high, then everyone will buff. I think right now on our server, the price is too low. It would sure be nice if you could count on finding a buffer at Dant Mining, or Theed even.
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