Doctor Archive
Thread: Why mind damage is fine the way it is...
But I think that having mind damage is fine the way it is. True, it means that healers are not completely effective in the field. True, it means that certain specials like /mindshot and /headshot are pretty devastating. But I think that this little "problem" is kind of what makes combat fun. If it weren't for the fact that, medical buffs and Stim E's aside, there is one part of your HAM that you had better protect or you're taking a dirt nap, there wouldn't be any risk to combat. Imagine the scenario of the devs did as requested and either nerfed mind damage or granted medics the ability to heal mind damage: you could stand there all day, even go AFK if you wanted, knowing that you're completely safe. This, in my mind, sounds boring.
There should be one pool that medics can't heal. Already, the fact that I can completely heal any of my teammates in one hit and any of their pets in 5 makes regular damage something to scoff at. If it weren't for the fact that I can't take care of your head, then combat wouldn't be any fun at all, not to mention the fact that it would be impossible to kill anyone in PvP unless you're solo dueling.
IRL, if you get injured and combat, that's kind of it. It's either minor enough that you can suck it up and keep going, or you're spending a few weeks in the hospital. In SWG, you can get beaten within an inch of your life - heck, you can get beaten beyond and inch of your life if you've got a Master Doc around - and be back in the action in no time. I say, keep mind damage the way it is. If you don't like it, stat migrate. Already, I'm running about 400 H and A with minimal Strength/Constitution/Stamina/Quickness (who needs regen when you can heal three times your pool size!?), but a mind pool in excess of 1600 and huge Focus/Willpower. I just buff my H and A whenever it looks like I'm going to be in combat. Whip out the old medical droid, slap on some buffs, and put him away again. 30 seconds, tops.
Keep mind damage as it is. It's better this way.
i disagree. There are still the limiting factors of the speed of heals and the Docs own mind as a limiter. It woulod be like saying we should not allow the other bars to not be healed because we can heal the damage right out from under a Pistoleer. In reality it is still difficult to full keep up with a Pistoleer as a healer. It ouwl be even worse as a Healer Pistoleer because you seitll have to fit in heals with shooting. If you're healing, you're not doing damage. that's great in a one on one faight against a non-healer, but in larger groups, with multiple targets in either PvP or PvE it's still pretty hard to prevent folks from going Incap from Health or Action, let alone Mind.
If you are only rarely running into Mind Incap problems, then I would humbly suggest that maybe there are just areas of the game and or styles of play that you just haven't explored yet. Personally i do think it is something of a problem. But I don't necessarily think Healing damage is the answer, necessarily, I do like the idea of getting Doc level buffs for Mind, though.
In all I think all of the Mind Damage threads we see here and on the other Medical professional forums is of littel to no real use until we get some guidance from the Devs on the issue. How do THEY percieve the balance issues of mind stimming or buffing abilities? What are the problems as they see it and what possible avenues of exploration are they willing to entertain? Without that guidance I think all we can really do here is spin our wheels. Those who think something should be done have little more to offer without that guidiance. Those who prefer the status quo can just continue stating that things should stay as they are with little chance of much rebuttle simply because those interested in change can't tell if their pleas are falling on deaf ears.
Without response I think the point in either direction of the debate is simply moot.
But I stand by my position. I see mind incaps all the time. The only reason they stand out is because they're the only kind that lay on the ground for more than 5 seconds. Everyone else is on their feet instantly. And mind buffs do exist: talk to any smuggler. Granted, there's a pretty hefty penalty after using spice, but it is a mind buff. Currently, mind damage is the only thing that creates any kind of risk in combat, and I want it to stay that way.
I would be in favor of something like a combat entertainer capable of playing a war march or something of that nature. But I would only want that to boost the regeneration of groupmates, not actually heal damage.
Think about it: how else are you supposed to kill someone? Unless you one-shot my buddy, I'm gonna apply 1200 healing to them immediately, and since I've buffed them to have 1500+ H and A, one-shotting them's gonna be tough.
Oh, and about the repeated incaps: you can only do that three times before you die anyway.
Valkyryn wrote:
It's a problem of tactics, not of balance. Besides, I'm a Doctor/Rifle Specialist going for CM. Why would I want them to nerf mind damage?
Think about it: how else are you supposed to kill someone? Unless you one-shot my buddy, I'm gonna apply 1200 healing to them immediately, and since I've buffed them to have 1500+ H and A, one-shotting them's gonna be tough.
Ah now the real reason why you don't want mind damage changed. I guess you can't look past your own profession(s) that use mind damage to your advantage to see that changing the way mind damage works in the game would be actually good for the majority of the players.
"One-shoting" or at least something close to it, coudl still be done with a bit of a revamp of the way Riflemen deal damage. I think that Mind cannot be fixed for Medics (or whoever would be given Mind dealing abilities) without also compensating the Rifleman/Two-Handed swordsmanprofessions accordingly. Whether that is through ensuring that their range is an advantage, reducing speed costs and/or reducing melee modifiers on them, or through increasing their damage dealing abilities to mind or someplace else or even some other method of compensation. It will still need to be considered. Obviously a revamp of Mind would take some extra loking into.
Besides, many rifelman specail maneuvers cost mind to do. Having a Mind heal and/or buff would be pretty nice for keeping you going, don't you think? The other two combat classes get that advantage already for H&A.
Valk- im guessing one reason you dont think itsa problem is that you chose a species that has a massive mind pool and mind secondary stats. The problem with this mind damage thing is that the game heavily favors those who chose one of those species. As a human, ive maxed my mind stats at 1100, 600, and 600. This is nowhere near what you have. Since mind damage is unique in that it cannot be healed, any one species that is stronger in this respect is more effective incombat. Why should a fish be a more effective fighter than a wookie or a human? Sure, different races have their strengths and weaknesses...but as i understood things, the intent was to give some races a slight edge in their profession of choice, not to give one or two professions a huge advantage in combat on the whole.
What we need is some sort of equalizer. You got an equalizer to make up for your lacking health and action pools as a fish. Combat should be more about tactics than race!
Sure, Dev imput would be great. But the way I see it scattered on the boards, is mainly, they're looking to see how WE want it done...
Just a matter of time before they come to this board specifically right?
I think you are right, and I fear very much that will be their response. The problem is that we have a LOT of answers, including the kind that started this thread about not doing anything (in fact not doing anything is the first thing I mention on the Issues list, so you know I'm playing no favoritism there despite my interest in seeing something done.) The problem I see is that we are in effect gettign the same response Holo was posting in Beta, which was that we couldn't seem to make up our minds or come to a consensus as a community, and hence there was nothing they could do for us.
IMHO, that's just the worng answer. The right answer was that we needed guidance. We ned Dev reasoning why it shouldn't be changed. We need Dev reasoning on issues that might be involved if it was changed that we simply do not see or know about. The best we can really do at the moment is ask them to look into the situation. Without some guidance on the issue, though, we'll never reach anything resembling a consensus on the matter and the Devs will just point their fingers at US for not giving them a solution, even though we will have given them plenty of solutions, just not one that every seemed willing to rally around.
Technically it is a flaw in the game design that i hope they change.. any changes would be very drastic tho since it'd affect a lot of other professions.. but it isn't right the way it is now..
A: If a pool can be damaged then we should be able to heal the damage..
B: Any fightingclass that can affect said pool is overpowered in comparison to any other fightingclasses that can not affect it because the pool can not be healed and all the others can.
If you get hit in the head with a baseball bat, you don't go to a nightclub to get it fixed.
Lol im a CM and if the current mind damage system benefits any class its the CM...
and even i realize how poorly this mind damage system is working...
If it was just rifleman doing mind damage it wouldnt be an issue...
but its CMs and BH that benefit most from mind damage