Development Cycle Archive
Thread: IC4: Path of the Jedi
Ok I'l assume the path to open the slot is remaining the same since your speaking about path to the jedi in the manner of jedi quest not quest to open the forceslot, too bad the grind thing has totally screwed up the game just look at all the afkers in the cantina and the economy has been totally messed inflation is crazy glad im not new here they dont have a chance without help. ok sorry for straying if you are changing the way you open the fsl then no quest at all all it will do is casuse a rush of whatever it is and have people running evrywhere doing the same things, lets learn from some of the more boring mistakes of this game, opening the slot hmmm i'd rather have it random lets say 1 a week or even month depending on how many people are online maybea 1/1000 ratio and use general xp as a way to enter them in a lottery no one will no about for example you want to be a scout then master ranger after master scout you shall be enterted into the lottery at a ratio of 1/1000 andafteryou become a master ranger and your scouting xp is maxed you'l be entered into the random drawing in a ratio of 2/1000 you'l have a little greater chance of winning each master either lower or higher profesions will grant you 1 or 2 entries. This will stop all the confusion and let people pick they'r own paths to profesions they enjoy and will keep them happier in the long run not to mention for non fighting profesions to stay a part of the system and have a chance.
After opening the slot again quests get really boring after a while so doesnt running around killing things for xp you should mix it up a little if its not too hard have a blue jedi spector placed in your data pad to guide you, after calling him he may randomly assign you a quest if he feels its urgent to the jedi cause or if its of a disturbing nature to him (or her hehe) or you may choose to see a list of quest that he can give you, I saw some nice ideas here at this forum on quest and i agree with the patience and thinking quest along with fighting, also solo is a defininte jedi should need to rely on a group of 10 people to do a quest if they dont want to not to mention its not a good way to avoid publicity which jedi arent supposed to want fame is not the way of the jedi. If you dont feel like doing any quest then roaming around the galaxy should account for something general jedi combat xp granted without quest is a plus maybe at a reduced rate also interaction with any npc is also good. just as we all can do now. ok heres where i get yelled at, jedi if grouped or in a faction after drawing theyr litesaber should be able to recievehelp from the'yr other members if luke gets attacked would han just sit there helpless. this would encourage the faction and regular grouping with friends and multi player interaction. also jedi's good or bad are a way of policing the population after drawingtheyr weapon they should be able to basically attack anyone who is armed but not grouped with you. no db's would be a plus and only one inc given in a 1 hour period per charachterto min abuse, it would help with people in opossing factions and such who stand there all day insulting others a penalty may be given in these cases where the jedi is not fired apon first of minus the combat xp and maybe cause a spawn of troopers to investigate the disturbance causing him to become more visible to bh. again we want the game to be enjoyed by all and some people feel they can do anything they wish this would add a little caution and maybe stop alot of the verbal abuse i see to people who dont deserve it. hmm oh yea jedi mind tricks for example ti influence people may be a good thing for xp while traveling the galaxy lets say your in a cantina and s-troopers come in and walk up to an entertainer and start harrassing them you could use it to influence them not leave them alone theyr not a bother to them, if it works they walk away repeating it if it doesnt they open fire hehe might be an interesting thing to try :-). for dark path people maybe at rebel areas like moenia or rori have rebel npc do the same to possible imperial's, hmm might even be nice to have this for pvp also again xp given.
Just some thoughts to try and bring some normal role playing and game experience back here since x-mas this place has been a mess and not much fun as it used to be when everyone was wondering how to become a jedi and not trying to become one.
A calm tone, and a open heart.........
A fewof the only quams I have about the Jedi system, is the lack ofundistinctive content, and the fact that because of that, jedi are now going to be popping up everywhere. I don't know jedi, nor am I one, but I believe that they should be MUCH less a marketing tool for the SWG unbiverse, and really, what they are supposed to be; the trial and test of a TRUE fan of Star Wars, and not the test of a power gamer.
So, origionally I believed that the Jedi-unlocking system would be an in-game algorithm based upon a functioning series of random requirements that would be met by those that "appreciate" the game, and not seen by those that "play" the game. When the holocron method was unraveled... I must say Mr. Devs.... that I felt very betrayed by all that you had lead us to believe about how to unlock the slot, and that itwas just a big over-inflation of the truth. I felt it met none of the actual ingenuity that I saw everywhere else in the game as far as programing went, and it was just simply the fastest way to implement the Jedi into the game before launch. I was actually rather heartbroken at the insane simplicity of it all, and felt it rewarded power-gamers far above those that really enjoy the game for it's content, and feel of being inside Star Wars itself (which I could be wrong, but there was a LOT of emphasis on that when the game was created orgionally. I mean the detail it took to create everything in the game down to the minutest level of truth to SWG lore. Hell look at wookie armor, look at the research going into that.) Plus with the current system, you have people taking away the deepest challenge of the game, as well as eliminating every possible roleplaying aspect of becoming a Jedi, by constant hologrinding. As a spinoff to this, you now have Jedi running all over the place, and they aren't rare at all, nor are they really "Jedi".
Now, to make Jedi rare, and to help incorporate a least a little roleplaying aspect to Jedi, I had this thought. Jedi are bearers of a larger-than-usual midichlorian (hope I spelled that right) count, which really, in the end, gives a Jedi his power. Why not make a player's primary character, over an amount of time, and through quests and such that he can achieve and complete, be rewarded more and more with a midichlorian count that goes towards his potential Jedi slot. There really should be no limit to the amount of midichlorians one can achieve when they finally DO unlock their slot, and the count should be an innate ability for the Jedi to, as a whole, be stronger; just like in SWG lore. Now this goes hand in hand with there being an incentive to NOT unlocking the force sensitive slot for at least a given amount of time, and thereby making Jedi rare. Just a random thought we all had one night, haven't expounded on that much farther.......
Actually unlocking the slot/ creating the Jedi character. whether it's a seperate slot, or just a spinoff with newfound powers of the main character, the path should be tailored much more to the players that can respect the game as a universe, and not to powergamers who just deflate the potential depth in "imaginated content" created by player interaction.It could be a list of over 100 requirements, chosen at random form a list of over 10,000 different things that the player must fullfill, or it could be a quest designed with a roleplaying aspect in mind for the character to achieve a certain feel of internal self awareness, thereby gaining the depth and insight into themselves that creates the basis of being a Jedi (ie, becoming force sensitive). Whatever the case, and I urge this strongly and passionately, that the method be chosen to cater to those that find the depth in the game, and not just a small, mindless, drone of the MMORPG world that wants to achieve status in the game cause it's the newest and hotest thing around. Create a living fanbase with those that you KNOW will be around for decades, through every update and new addition, because they live and breathe Star Wars; not becuase they are jumping on the newest and hotest band wagon trend. I've seen too much of the game shattered by people that just play, and not enough aspects of this INSNAELY beautifulgame enhacned by those that "live" this game like your slogan said origionally... "Live the greatest saga ever told.... yours". You have an infinite ability to create depth in this game by re-doing this Jedi system altogether; please have a mindset about your methods that will bring about not another platform of an existing dimension, such as an extension to the profession system, or an extension to pvp combat, but something that creates a WHOLE NEW level of depth that takes the game to another level altogether, and further bleeds away the feel of it being ... "just a game".
The roleplaying community, I'm sure, would really wish this kind of depthto be a part of every aspect of SWG, and if we had it our way, we would have made Jedi so hard and so challenging and obtuse, that only the people that love it,and want to stick around to seeany Jedi come about, will be the people that love this game to no end. Read the boards, they are filled with people that continually whine, and complain and holler back and forth at each other, while neverendingly treating the game like just a game. SOE, I've loved and lived this game onto every level since it came out, and I've always felt that no matter what anyone said about the lack of "content" the game had to offer, that it was the player's ability to create that content, day to day, move to move, and action to action that could make the galaxy a living, breathing place to exist. But upon the revealing of the Jedi system to me, I was really disheartened by the lack of ingenuity and ease that one could repeat the template required to become force sensitive. Then, furthering that, The Jedi boards filled up woth tons of people that took the time and effort into becoming force sensitive; months and months of work; and then didn't want to take the time to "play" the Jedi cause it was too easy to die and lose it all. These are the same people you cater to, thatmake demands and countless rants to how "crappy" your game is. These are the same people that have never sat andmarveledat aTalus sunset; never took the time to sit under an Endorian Mattberry bush, and watch the clouds pass by; never sat and listened to the frogs and crickets on Rori at night, and pondered life over a dimly lit campfire.
It's all just wishful thinking I guess, because I know your're currently running an enterprise that is fueled by money, and money is best gained through marketing techniques and such. But the biggest marketing technique is right under your nose, and that's the people thathelp you, as the drug dealers call it, on the "comeback". The people that no matter what happens to this game, and no matter how far down the road they travel with it, they will always be coming back because they absolutely, and unbelieveably, love, and live the Star Wars universe. It must have been how George Lucas felt when he was originally dreaming up all this stuff. Reward these people; reward the ones that you know love it. Let the rolepayers get their depth, and let the MMORPG lovers get their content, even if they can't see the depth in it atall.
How that works, hell, I have no specifics to offer. Butwhat I am trying to offer is thebase template for launching these new revamps. Let the ideas that come about, always fall back to this spot; "creating the depth of the living universe that you've always tried to create based on Star Wars lore," and the rest will fall into place in due time.
- Colonel MarrickBurton - Chilastra -
- Holocrons acting like Treasure Maps - The treasure map design could be adapted to lead players to NPC mission givers or events that start the moment the player comes into the area. The player Holocron (which I think should be a non-tradable and reusable prize of an early FS quest) would tell the player, "You are to go to the Jundland wastes (-xxxx, -xxxx). There you will take another step." Or something along those lines. This method should not be used exclusively in that a player could grind their way through these in short order.
- NPC requests - This mimics the mission assignments from other RPG's (most notably Knights of the Old Republic). When a player is in there house or at a starport or other area that they will likely be at often, have an NPC approach the player with a request. This could be a simple, short mission or a complex mission that the player might need to recruit some assistance in completing. It could also be the start of a chain of missions (large and small) that lead to an important milestone in their progression. Player finishing the chain missions would be additionally rewarded for completing it by having the Holocron give some information on the Jedi (light or dark) that would be accessable from that point on to that player. This would need to be run by Lucasfilm and probably George Lucas himself but it could really add to the Jedi story.
In looking at the ideas here on this thread, I can see that to properly implement a truly interesting and engrossing quest that the Developers hope to, it only seems logical that SOE and LucasArts assign a small project team exclusively for this purpose. This team would focus their 40+ hours a week on the Jedi quests. Given the large profit margins SWG has already realized as well as the potential if this content strikes a cord with the players; I believe this expense would be easily justified.
These quests would have numerous parts, and you would be able to work on them during multiple sittings. They could involve simply escorting someone, but groups of mobs are programmed to attack along the way, and if you don't take them down in 15 seconds or so, the npc you're escorting will be killed by them and you will lose that mission permenently, and assigned another mission from the 200 pool. In this fashion, if someone failed 101 times on quests, they would never, ever, be able to reach Jedi Master. This encourages Jedi to only take missions they are 100% sure they can handle. For example, if there are two missions, one to escort a low level criminal to a holding facility, and you can expect low level mobs to attack, versus a mission where you are escorting a high level opposite faction NPC to a jail, and you can expect a large scale attempt by highly trained soldiers to free him, a Jedi wouldn't risk taking the high level mission until he was a Guardian or so.
The 10 highest missions (which you could be required to complete at least 5 to advance to Jedi Master) could involve both NPC's and players. For example, when a Jedi is ready to take one of these missions, a systemwide message is sent out to the opposite faction about intelligence that's been gathered which shows an important movement from location X to location Y, and that all attempts should be made to intercept the transport. Granted, Jedi would have to receive their much needed boost in order for this to be accomplished by any Jedi.
The harder the mission, the more Jedi XP you are awarded. You are assigned missions however, based on the 100 that have randomly been selected, and you are dealt them lowest to highest. This would prevent people from taking the highest missions first and doing them with friends, to almost instantly get to Guardian.
The first 10 missions might give you enough Jedi XP to get to Padawan, and take about 15 hours total time.
To get to Knight, it could take another 25 missions, and 35 hours or so.
The final 65 missions could be required for Master, and take over 75 hours.
Jediforcefighter wrote:
I have to agree with Inferno_Intellgence about you getting jedi footprints from everything that you do. But the flaw is that players would have to be trained by another jedi is not a good idea. If that were to happen there would be a complete imbalance in the force because players of opposing faction, that know your guild, or who you are, they wont want to train you. And to add, mostly one faction side would achieve jedi, which would be unfair to others.
The simple solution to this is as follows:
Don't let Jedi know the alignment of a player when they are looking for a padawan. This would follow well with the Star Wars story, because altough the Jedi MASTERS can tell somewhat the path of a Force Sensative person, they can not truely tell. Also, not me ephasis on MASTER, and Jedi in this age, that is not a Master, and looking for a padawn would not have the ability to see if they are good or evil. So, as long as the Dev's give Jedi's thier own faction, so they can't tell who is Rebel vs. Imperial, it won't be an issue.
so if i understand its no any longer Holocrons can give u the FSS?
cool 
My personal belief is that there should be a jedi path that allows for characters to get there solo, without the need for grouping. perhaps it would be longer, and a bit more challenging for a solo character, but part of the fun of the game is the ability to not need to be around people if you don't want to be. Independence, resourcefulness, and the ability to overcome personal challenges, in my opinion, are much more important than simply getting the right number of people together to kill a mob for a piece of equipment you may need.