Development Cycle Archive

As for population limitation, maybe 3 (number out of thin air) DBs should result in aclearing of the FSCS and the regular character's FS status/progress. Just a thought. It would need a certain amount of balancing to prevent them from being too easy to track down.

Good luck with it. It's going to be challenging to create something dynamic and satisfying.

I just want to voice my thoughts that I dont like the Idea of my main character to become jedi. I do want to open my Jedi slot. Now my main character has merchant up to add. 3 I have 2 vendor that I share, and Im able to have those venders show up on the world map. Also I have survaing 2, I sell power on one of the venders as well and Im able to locate the resourse that I need. As for combat I have a TKA master with a bit of noice medic and scout. Now in buying your game and in the Jedi faq it states that one opens up a FSCS on the same server it was achived. Please stick with that with the quest base system. Thank you.

Ok, now, the biggest problem as I see it, is the powergamers.

For the first 3 months, when no FS were showing up because nobody knew how to do it. So you put in holocrons.

A week later the hard core powergamers had FS, and every week since there have been new Jedi on every server. So this leaves you with a new problem, too many Jedi, and too fast.

So, we need a system of controling that, no?

Well, I believe I can fix all your problems, or at least make them a little better, hehe.

First, getting FS slot:

I think the biggest restriction here should be the time it takes to get it. The devs were expecting I believe about 1 month till the first Jedi post-launch, it took 3. Now, all things considered, I think a commitment of 3 months is fair to get Jedi.

So, what do I propose? Time limits on the quests. Each individual has a time limit before he is allowed to take the next quest. Now, as for the quests, I don't think they need to be all that incredibly hard. I would like to see them involve making the right choices to be Jedi. It was stated that the only way to become a dark jedi is to be a light jedi first, and then fall later. I think this should still be the case, so the only way to become a Jedi at all is to make all the right choices during your quests. The quest giver should be obscure about the goals needed to complete the quest, or maybe even give you false goals.

That would be where the difficulty comes in. You would have to do what a person with the character of a Jedi would do, IN SPITE of what the NPC who gave you the quest tells you to do. Say he tells you to go kill this bunch of slavers, but when you get there it is just a bunch of wary nomads, not slavers at all. You determine what the right thing to do is, and go back to the quest giver. He may say you failed the quest, and you may get discouraged, but you would actually be further along in your FS quest.

So, this means that the absolute minimum time to get your FS would be 1 month, 2 months, 3 months, or however long you want it to take to earn your FS. And, if you fail to advance with that quest, you will still have to wait a week to do it over. These quests should be dynamic as well, never a "cut and paste" where someone can post on the net "do this this way for this one, and you will advance toward FS". It should be random situations that the NPC gives, and it should depend on the player to behave like a jedi would. Remember, the Jedi council would simply not train anyone who had too much fear or anger, Anikin being a glaring exception, and you saw what came of that. So I think this is a good way to not only slow the process, but to get people with either much patience, or who has excellent character, or a mixture of both.

I also disagree with a previous poster (probably more than one, since this thread is so huge) that there should be a "FS meter". You shouldn't know that you have done everything right untill you actually unlock. A successful completion of a mission should not necessarily move you forward in your quest, but acting with the character of a Jedi should.

So, in this system the "powergamers" would be the ideal Jedi, since it really would have little to do with how long you spend at your computer working on these quests. With only being able to do them once a week, you get nice and spaced out.

Now, this will also lead to, eventually, many more Jedi, so I think the controlling part of the system should be AFTER you get jedi. Remember, Vader didn't hunt Jedi before they were born, he hunted them after they showed their Force Sensitivity. So I think getting FS should be a test of patience and character, and then surviving to Jedi Master would be extremely difficult (much more difficult than it is now), but still vastly rewarding.

So, what I propose for this, is to leave Jedi as is, leave the Bounty Hunter missions as is (no losing the ability to kill after the Jedi is killed), and start piling on all kinds of defenses onto the very last skills before master, I'm thinking something like +50 melee defense on two of the 4th tier Jedi Knight and Dark Jedi Knight skill trees, and +50 ranged on the other two, and a final +100 at master, as well as at least +100 to all state change (dizzy, blind, etc), and +100 to secondary defensive skills like dodge, block, etc. at master, or maybe just counterattack, that would fit Jedi well. Top level Jedi should be like the template stackers that were just nerfed, they should be uber. But ONLY top level Jedi should be like this. I also think an increased skill loss penalty is appropriate, so that within say 5 deaths, a 4/4/4/4 Jedi Knight should be busted down to initiate. Also, it should be very easy to get on the mission boards. Say any force powers used near an NPC of any kind gets your name on the boards.

I want to see Jedi that can take on 20 MBH's and win, like they told us they would before launch. Right now Jedi get owned by 2 MBH's, its sick. MBH isn't even the best template.

My thoughts anyway. I think the shift should be from making getting the FS hard, to making the life of a Jedi hard. Also, since we are switching this to the main character, I think pursuing the Jedi skillset and the resultant consequences should be entirely optional, and no action should ever be taken against one who decides NOT to pursue the Jedi skillset (i.e. an FS that doesn't train the initiat jedi skill should never, ever be put on a BH mission terminal or get a jedi TEF).

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bigjeff5 wrote:
Now, as for the quests, I don't think they need to be all that incredibly hard. I would like to see them involve making the right choices to be Jedi. It was stated that the only way to become a dark jedi is to be a light jedi first, and then fall later. I think this should still be the case, so the only way to become a Jedi at all is to make all the right choices during your quests. The quest giver should be obscure about the goals needed to complete the quest, or maybe even give you false goals.

That would be where the difficulty comes in. You would have to do what a person with the character of a Jedi would do, IN SPITE of what the NPC who gave you the quest tells you to do. Say he tells you to go kill this bunch of slavers, but when you get there it is just a bunch of wary nomads, not slavers at all. You determine what the right thing to do is, and go back to the quest giver. He may say you failed the quest, and you may get discouraged, but you would actually be further along in your FS quest.

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Heh. One of the most Jedi-like ideas ever posted.

The reason I never unlocked is because I wasted (yes, I consider that time wasted) the first three or four months of the game doing missions for field NPCs that acted nice, as opposed to field NPCs that acted nasty. Figured that reading the NPC mission text and only doing missions that were Jedilike was "a playstyle that few players would be able to do". (/shrug, so I'm a sucker. But then again, back in those days, didn't we all laugh at the guy who said "Well, grind every profession in the game!" because that was obviously the most non-Jedilike thing possible? :-)

I wasted a fourth month combing the deserts of Tatooine (and didn't even get the two working badges - never saw the once-in-a-blue-moon spawn) for the Hermit quests.

If I'd just been trying to master every profession in the game I'd have had my Jedi before publish 6. Publish 6 was the last straw, and I unsubscribed.

There were fun moments, but never once did it feel like Star Wars. For the sake of the suc^H^H^Hcustomers who come after me, I hope the quest system will require choices to be made on the part of the player, and that these choices be the ones that catassers are unlikely to make.

Of course, my hopes aside, I don't believe it will be. I believe the quests will be like the Hermit quests -- bugged, and when they're not bugged, they'll be the kinds of spawns that can only be found after a month or two of catassery, be it spawncamping or combing the desert. I believe the quests are more likely to be unfun than fun, because everything else in the game to date was more unfun than fun. So I screwed up my courage and pulled the plug.

I'd dearly love to be proven wrong, but at least I have $15/month that says I'm right. I'm glad SOE decided to open the forums, because I'll know in about $60 (4 months) whether or not it'll be fun. Anyone else care to bet - with me or against me?

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LeBob wrote:

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Thunderheart wrote:

Ready, are you? What know you of ready? For eight hundred years

have I trained Jedi. My own counsel will I keep on who is to be trained! A Jedi must have

the deepest commitment, the most serious mind.

This one a long time have I watched. Never his mind on where he was. Hmph. What he was

doing. Hmph. Adventure. Heh! Excitement. Heh! A Jedi craves not these things.

You are reckless!

Welcome to our In-Concept Jedi Thread! Please note: this is not a Jedi System question and

answer thread. This thread is for people who have quest ideas only.

The path to become a Jedi will be a long series of quests that will take place over a period

of time. Each quest will be of a different type and have different characteristics. There

will Force Sensitive quests, padawan quests, Lightside quests and Darkside quests and master

trials.

The developers are interested in hearing what you would like to see for:

Whole Quest ideas
NPC’s players might interact with throughout the quest
Progression quests and trial ideas
What skills a Jedi might use on these quests
Quests for different profession types, for instance, social quests, explorer quests, combat

quests, etc.
Player interdependencies and cooperation’s
Jedi Titles earned through the quests from Force Sensitivity to Jedi master
Request For Comments:

The community is invited to make comments through March. At that time, the thread will be

closed to further comments. Feel free to comment on any or all of the above items. Please

stay on topic.

This is sure to be a creative and exciting thread. Good luck and I look forward to reading

your suggestions and contributions.

Message Edited by Thunderheart on 02-19-2004 10:59 PM

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the way you are saying this makes me think that the FSCS will be removed and that the main

character will 'become' the Jedi........... will this be the way of the new system?

I like the present 'FSCS extra char' perspective...................

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I was right.

please let EVERYONE have two chars per server... it will not be fair to lock all the new people out of having two chars

thanks

At least now the devs have decided that the whole holcron thing just isnt any fun.. agreed it keeps the population down.. people with less determination than me turned thier nose up when 'artisan' turned out to be thier first holocron. but for those of us who envision oursleves as nothing BUT jedi it is a very very frustrating system. im on my silent holo now, and have no idea where to turn.. i ahve a massive total of a 3% chance of guesing my next profession to be the right one.. knowing my luck i will do 31 profs before i find the one that unlocks.. some jedi i know unlocked purley by accident, and only payed lip service to the whole holocron thing, then BAM ur a winner, welcome to the saber club.

The point i am making is at the moment mastering ur silent holocron is like winning a lottery. Pure luck... there are no known methods of working this out that are accurate, and just boils down to pure and simple luck... well lemme tell u.. if it wasnt for bad luck i wouldnt have any at all .. all i would ask is that u give us some indication of what to do next to work towards FSS .. a hint, a clue a puzzle.. anything.. but alas there are so many of us out there that want jedi badly that there will be a population swell if this should happen .. the way i see it there is little chance that the new system will be better than the old one... either it will make u wait too long, or missions will be impossible.. otherwise people could just do TKM and cruise them.. im expecting the new system to be just as dissapointing as the old one. .. and what of those people who are waiting to stumble across that silent profession to unlock, what sort of reward will we see for the time and effort put into 4 holos? ... i should like to think it will be some automatic advancement within the whole quest system.. afterall we are only 1 profession away from FSS so we should in reality be 1-2 quests away from unlocking...

either way, the whole system is gonna be difficult to revise without making it too hard, or too easy.. i'll just keep on grinding till i either unlock, or the quests start.. one thing i would like to see is to have an actuall Jedi guide you through the quests.. why not have a plyer Jedi accompany u on these quests, and guide you in your sensitivity? its all role play afterall. dont make this essential.. jedi would be in high demand considering the rarity explained in the time frame, but if u could get a jedi to help you for some reward to him, it would be cool... not all of us know any jedi tho.. not many of us have seen a jedi unless in passing.

This is the ultimate difficult question isn't it? How to do Jedi. Well, here's my idea and maybe a good shove off point.

Force Sensitivity is something that every species is born with is one form or another. Whether it's the ability to use it or just exist in it depends on your true ability and your midiclorian (sp?) count. The higher the count the more you can use the force as your shield, weapon, and companion. Maybe midiclorian is the key?

First, make your main also the jedi (or have the ability to obtain Jedi).

• Give people Midiclorian counts like they have skill points. Such as 250. Maybe even make this number cap for certain species lower or higher depending on that species. This way you can have your Jedi and not lose everything you have worked so hard on in your character.


• Make multi-part quests per skill that you can aquire. Each skill costs Midiclorian points (MP).


• When aquiring a skill for Jedi you do not ever have to lose your main skills (Artisan, Entertainer etc.) for any reason because the points are counted in their own bar. Because of this your character is becoming stronger than ever. But this is the way of a Jedi. A Jedi retains all knowledge and continues to learn (until the MP runs out that is).

First Idea

Here's the big change compared to the way that things are done now. Right now you must master your first entire profession to continue. This way would make it so you could hone your skills in one area (especially good for those species with lower MP). Ex. You have a Lightsaber line and once you hit lightsaber 4 you can continue up the lighsaber line all the way up to the highest you can obtain. In doing this though, you cannot get the master moves and you skip them on the way up (the most devistating moves should be in the master professions).

The same would include Force Powers and the other lines you already have.

Second Idea

Another way to do this is to make a 4-way master path. You go up lightsaber and get LS4 and you can move into the Lightsaber profession.Make is a 2 tree profession (strength and defense).Once you have mastered the first profession (1 bladed LS) you continue to the second profession for LS (2 bladed LS).

Novice Force Weilder

The next tree (force powers) would be basically the same way. You would go up the first tree under your first tree and then once you get Force Powers4 you get to another tree of it's own. Force Weilder. This would be a 2-way street. You need to decide if you are light or dark right now. If you go dark you have a choice on how to gain abilities (will be noted later in post). If you go light you use MP always. This tree would be in two trees as well. The first line would be lightning (dark) and heal (light). The second would have telicinetic abilities. Mind control and force push (dark) and Power of suggestion and push (light). Force run would be an ability you gained at Novice ForceWeilder and you would gain more ability in it as you went up the telicenetic line.

Force Lightning - You get this ability at Novice Force Weilder. As you continue up the line you get more power in it and then more ability in it (force lighting cone).

Force Heal - You get the main health heal and as you go up you gain abilities in other HAM areas to finally conclude at BF at master. This is not extremely powerful yet as you are still in the first tree of Weilder.

Mind Control and Push - As you go up you learn these and gain more power. Mind Control would last longer and be easier to pull off as you go up (like a warcry). Push will also become more powerful and have a greater range as you go up the tree.

Power of Suggestion and Push - These are the same as the dark Jedi just a nicer way to say it. We are light after all.

**Dark Jedi Points**

If you choose to become a dark Jedi you can spend your healeth, mind, action bars instead of MP. Maybe even make it so it HAS to happen like that. Since Dark Jedi are so powerful they have to give part of themselves to the Force. This would be an outstanding way to make sure this happens. Being a dark Jedi must be something to think about. Do I trade in my own health, strength, contitution etc for this ability? Is it worth it? YES! Or no. How evil are you? Do you sacrifice yourself such as Palpatine sacrificed his health to the dark side?

These are some of my ideas. The rest of the lines continue in the same fasion, but I am not any more familiar to teh Jedi system and powers as this. I do think this is a good starting point and base to the entire Jedi system.

more later if i can flush out some more of this for ya.

and yup, im looking for work too, as a dev for SOE on SWG would be great. LOL