Development Cycle Archive
Thread: Should Force Sensitivity be a known path or a mysterious one? (II)
Vegitaa
Tue Jul 13, 2004 3:25 pm
#703
My question has to do with the step before all of this... with how you actually become Force Sensitive.
The question to continue discussing is this:
Should the method of becoming Force Sensitive (not the path from Force Sensitivity to Jedi) be a mysterious, unknown mechanic orone that is visible and known to everyone?
Thanks for the continued feedback!!
My opinion is that Force Sensitivity should not be a "mysterious" path. First of all the last time they tried to come up with a "mysterious" path the best idea they had was grinding out 5 random prof's... yuck!
With that in mind I'd say the path should be clearly defined just like the way the Jedi advance to knight status now. They now exactly what they have to kill, so should we. Lord knows the only "mysterious" path they're gonna come up with now is kill X amount of a certain type of creatures like a laundry list. Kinda weak if you ask me. Even the hermit quest (which was once "mysterious") is now camped like a French Brothel.
On top of this I have a suggestion for a Force Sensitive Veteran Reward.
For those who have been in-game for a year they should just be given their Force Sensitivity status and be able to start working on those skills. Reason for this is that the Veteran reward ships are being given to anyone in-game 6 months which shafted the people who have been here a year. (And no, I have not been here a year... 9 months... lol)
Making the new path visible would make up for the holo-grinding mistakes, as well as leveling the playing field.
The Jedi are out of the box now, why not make it easier on us this time.
- Give those who have ground out X amount of professions their Force Sensitive status as a reward.
- Give 1 year veterans immediate Force Sensitivity as well (for stiucking with the problems over the past year)
- Make the path clear for those who want to either continue or begin their quest to be Jedi.
Either that or make it fair and change the way Jedi currently level towards being ranked, make their path mysterious and you'll hear screams like you've never dreamed on the forums.
Mitsew
Tue Jul 13, 2004 3:48 pm
#704
I really like Vegitaa idea after months of hologrinding me and a few of my friends gave up, and have got nothing out of those months and im still hoping that i get some sort of reward from my patronage
Sesar
Tue Jul 13, 2004 3:59 pm
#705
Here is what you need: a good story. If you have a good, entertaining, immersive story, it won't matter how obvious or hidden the path is. You'll keep the audience entertained and will, in the end, have much less of a headache coming from people bitching about "it's too easy" or "it's too hard".
Myphoss
Tue Jul 13, 2004 4:02 pm
#706
I'm sorry, if the things I will write here, have already been posted by another one. But there are too many posts to read them all. I just read all the posts from the first thread.
First of all, I think it should be mysterious. I'ld rather be suprised of the things that happen. Maybe you can ask George Lucas if he has an idea. He is the best man to solve this problem.
Have a look at the old movies. Episode 4,5 and 6. How did Luke become Force Sensitive and how did he get to the path of becoming a Jedi? It was an old single man who told him about his past and his future. But he still was ableto choose, whether he wants to become a Jedi, a dark Jedi ora simple farmer. His behaviour brought him to that, what he became later.
I think "Jedi" should be seen as the 34th profession. It shouldn't be something everyone wants to be. Like Droid Engineer or Rifleman.
Further, I think only players who like doing good stuff should become a Jedi. Their doing, acting should be responsible for their future path(dark or light side). It could be only one NPC that gives the quest and whether you will become a dark or a light side jedi, depends on thebehaviour while doing the quest. If you kill everything, you'll get darkside points and if you solve the quest by talking and dialougues you'll get light side points. Like in KOTOR.
Further, the number of dark Jedi should be equal to the number of light Jedi. It should be a very hard and difficult way to become a light Jedi and a more easy way to become a dark one(Because you can just kill things and don't have to talk annoyingly). So, if one light side FS Character appears, one dark one can appear.
It should be something like Ying and Yang. We need good people to fight against the bad people, we need artisans who craft the stuff to fight against each other and combat professions to support each other and medics and entertainer to heal our wounds after battles. What we will do in the Galactic Civil War should let us become what we want to be.
I'm sorry, if some of my words don't make sense. I'm german and it is 1 AM here....
May the force be with you
Monkeydeath
Tue Jul 13, 2004 7:02 pm
#707
Known. No question about it. Flailing about to figure the new system will drive many of us right out the door.
Those of us who have played since launch didn't unlock because:
1. we didn't want to grind a bunch of professions
OR
2. we were too lazy to grind a bunch of professions
Either way (or both), it's obvious we didn't like the old system. Many of us have been staying with the game only to get the new system, and therefore, our Jedi. Make this a crazy mystery, and I suspect I will extend a digit in your general direction and cancel both my accounts.
jedicouncil444
Tue Jul 13, 2004 10:30 pm
#708
ok... I guess I'll give my opinion. I figure ifyou make it hard enough to become jedi once you become FS, becoming FS should be known. When I say hard, I mean hard enough where it deters most people, perma death should be put back in. I dont want to become a jedi just to find half the server is also jedi... thats just unrewarding and I've been playing since beta 3...
If in 2 months there is a stupid amount of jedi running around, i'm out of this game... 5-10% is acceptable...
Best regards
Mantison
Wed Jul 14, 2004 12:15 am
#709
The path to FS should be shrouded in mystery... a system that is nearly impossible to map...
Given enough time, anyone COULD do it, but it won't be able to be ground out...
I would love to see the system take into account the players actions...
I have no idea how it would be coded, but those that abuse the system and are in general "not very Jedi'ish" should have a hard time becoming FS...
It should be an honor to be FS and Jedi, not a badge of "Uberness" achieved by any smart mouthed punked willing to put in long summer days of grinding and being vulgar....
Return the Honor to the Jedi profession, not the grind...
Oh, and an addenda: If any Jedi EVER utters "1337" speak, they are stripped of ALL Jedi XP and skills, and while you are at it, the character is deleted.
That would be a GREAT system.
WolfeTCK
Wed Jul 14, 2004 12:21 am
#710
maybe this has been mentioned, but i think some factors in the quests should involve things like how many ppl you've taught a master profession to, not jsut any skill, but master, each person taught master could get you a bonus in the quests
Quinnt13
Wed Jul 14, 2004 12:42 am
#711
I posted this in the GCW forum, but it went unnoticed...thought I'd throw it in here.
In the spirit of trying to conceive a fair, balanced and somewhat accurate Force Sensitivity unlocking system, I'm submitting this idea for the devs and players' consideration. Keep in mind a few things before you read:
1. I'm no programmer, and I have no idea how feasible this idea is from a programming point of view.
2. While I don't post alot on the boards, I've been playing SWG almost since launch (just over a year now) and I'm an active and well-respected member of one of the largest player cities on my server.
So, now that that's out of the way, let me start with my premise for the new Force Sensitivity Unlocking System. I'm obviously a devotee of all Star Wars movies and lore, and others like me can obviously see how this game departs from the Star Wars that we grew up with. Some aspects of this departure are welcome, and most interesting...Some aspects are....well, not. But let's leave all that aside for now.
So, what is the Force? Obi-Wan defines it as basically the "field" that surrounds us, penetrates us and binds the galaxy together. Becoming "sensitive" to this life force is to become aware of it. All awareness begins with one thing: knowledge. Thus, I submit to everyone that to become Force Sensitive is to become AWARE of the Force. Awareness does NOT equal control. Quite the opposite, the first time you become aware of the Force around and within you, I'm sure it's quite unnerving...for the first time, you become aware of an outside force that has enormous influence on you. The reason I'm adamant about the fact that awareness of the Force is so important will become clear.
It is this awareness that BEGINS the path to Force Sensitivity. Forget about Padawans, Jedis, all that stuff for now. The first step is to FEEL the Force around you. Now, here is where we must be inventive. Star Wars lore tells us that in the vast majority of cases, those who become Force Sensitive must be born with that innate ability. It's usually not something you can learn. Obviously, that's impossible to achieve for SWG purposes....everyone needs to have a chance to unlock their FSCS. Before Publish 9, it meant a ridiculous grind through random professions. As of Publish 10, it will mean something else...and here is my idea.
All beings in the galaxy are born with an inherent "Spiritual Mark" (for lack of a better term). This means that everyone, regardless of race, is bound to a particular location in the galaxy where their "Mark" is centered. The journey to Force Sensitivity begins with the individual finding the place where their Spiritual Mark is centered, thus first establishing awareness of the Force around them. This, however, is only the beginning of the journey towards unlocking the FSCS. This ensures that everyone, regardless of profession, can start themselves down the FSCS path. However, here is where it gets trickier.
The next step on this path is to gather knowledge. In its purest form, knowledge of the Force and its impact on the galaxy is the goal. Again, this must be accomplished without the person needing any combat skills. Combat is for Padawan and Jedi....not for those who have just started a quest for KNOWLEDGE. This quest must begin at various Force "hotpoints" around the galaxy. Not Jedi temples, but just random points in nature that can help the individual feel and learn the impact of the Force around them. Each "hotpoint" must pose a question to the person. But the question has no real answer...it's meant to stimulate the thoughts of the individual, to make them see things from a different point of view. The first hotpoint is given to the person when they find their Spiritual Mark location. From that point, they have 7 days to visit all the hotpoints and complete the unlocking of their FSCS. After 7 days, the Mark resets and they must begin again at a new Mark location.
The rub here is that each Hotpoint must have a different question...and they must get progressively harder. I need to leave this up to the players and devs at this point, as my creative ability is being pushed as it is. At the last hotpoint, the person receives their final test, which is a culmination of all the other tests at the prior hotpoints. IF they pass, they achieve their first real understanding of the Force, which unlocks their FSCS. The rest is history...
The end goal is for each player to have as unique a journey towards their FSCS as possible. This is difficult to achieve in a MMORPG, as we have all seen with the old FSCS unlocking system. And odds are it won't be something that can be done before Publish 10, unless they delay it. But maybe the devs can use something in here to help them as they contemplate the future of the FSCS unlocking system.
Sorry for the length of this, just thought I'd throw it out there. Some of the terms I'm using are lousy, I'm sure there are better ways to describe some of the terms. Feel free to add on to it, it's just a starting point really.
Thanks for reading!
Q
Vintirizex
Wed Jul 14, 2004 4:10 am
#712
Don't let the door hit you in the ass on your way out council. Most of the rest of us who got the game only to be able to play a Jedi won't be missing you 
Getoc
Wed Jul 14, 2004 4:45 am
#713
@council There IS a stupid amount of jedi running around atm
Make the 'entry' on this path easy accessable maybe public knowledge so that people are not running frustrated around klicking every damned npc . Once this path is entered it should be really hard a challange .
I dont think it should be easy because all we who refused that ******* grinding will get a large amount of content where grinders are left out and really this is sooooo coooool .
Completly hidden would be aspit in the face of all people who kept this game upduring the time the game breaking grinders destroyed most of the starwars feeling .
NeoDaywalker
Wed Jul 14, 2004 5:05 am
#714
iskareot wrote:
TheNarcis wrote:
It shouldnt be a mystery like the old way. That just frustrates too many people.
But have it so it tells you something new to do each quest after you complete the previous one. And have it all random order for different people so the "walkthrough" isnt on the web.
Also dont make it uber harder now, because it wouldnt be fair for people that have been playing since beta and have not unlocked. It should be no harder than it has always been.
ROFL, now this is the first post to this... GUYS ARE YOU KIDDING?
DO YOU WANT THEM TO FREAKING HAND IT TO YOU? lol then what about all us that grinded harder longer since beta too...? Do we get extra extra UBERNESS? <----- yeah I know stupid .. I mean if you get yours then I want more(Do you get my point yet to this)...
Keep it a freaking secret good god, look at what the HOLOS did man. NOW ,you want it back and not only that you want it given to you... SO what about all of us that tried all kinds of crap to unlock? Do we get a prize?
I mean you played since beta , you knew the risks and when we all found out how to unlock it was called CHOICE.. simply that. Do profs or dont..I did got a jedi- I chose that.
MAKE IT A MYSTERY, JUST TO AT LEAST STAY CONSISTANT WITH WHAT WAS DONE IN THE PAST.
Good Grief , 10,000 kids want the easy way in.. I say crap on that make them work hard like we had to...
Just giving it away is what anyone would want, I mean why work at it right? Hell- I say this, if they want to give you that, then they should give the ones that did it the old hard way some sort of special status, I mean I say this with respect: "If you get yours then I want mine"...I earned this freaking JEDI... the old hard way..
/end rant
go out freaking side and get some air.................
This is exactly what I'm afraid of, some current Jedi that think they did something amazing because they had more time than me in game to hologrind. I hated the hologrind, I could've done it and would have been Jedi for a while now but I didn't want to.
NEWSFLASH: Hologrinding was in no way a reflection of effort, just excess time. Hologrinding did not prove you were a capable combatant or an accomplished crafter, thus proving you are a better player than the rest.
I'll say it again, hologrinding was known so the new way should be also.
FontiIce
Wed Jul 14, 2004 5:50 am
#715
Hi all!
Its a real problem for the the Devs to make what we (the gamers) want.
Because I read the complete threat and I see its about 50/50 what the players want.
Thats because there are two types of players: 1.) The alltime player who plays every free minute
2.) The family guy who plays one or two hours per day
So its logical that type 1 will have it unknown because he had the time to get force sensitive even if it takes 1000 hours.
If you are a type two player that solution will be worse to you because you dont want to play 3 years to get jedi.
Now I personally think you should make it known, BUT take away the second slot.
Why?
Thats simple: If every player knows how to get jedi everyone will get it because he can earn money with the second slot. Now take away the second slot and you will not have so many people who make jedi. Also make that a player has to choose: non jedi skills or jedi. Dont let jedis be other professions.
Then you shouldnt have an overrun of jedis.
with best regards
Fonti Ice
Its a real problem for the the Devs to make what we (the gamers) want.
Because I read the complete threat and I see its about 50/50 what the players want.
Thats because there are two types of players: 1.) The alltime player who plays every free minute
2.) The family guy who plays one or two hours per day
So its logical that type 1 will have it unknown because he had the time to get force sensitive even if it takes 1000 hours.
If you are a type two player that solution will be worse to you because you dont want to play 3 years to get jedi.
Now I personally think you should make it known, BUT take away the second slot.
Why?
Thats simple: If every player knows how to get jedi everyone will get it because he can earn money with the second slot. Now take away the second slot and you will not have so many people who make jedi. Also make that a player has to choose: non jedi skills or jedi. Dont let jedis be other professions.
Then you shouldnt have an overrun of jedis.
with best regards
Fonti Ice