Development Cycle Archive
Thread: AT-ST changes on Test Center
Zahnn72 wrote:
IN THE ORIGIONAL FAQ FOR STARWARS GALAXIES IT SAID.....
Player characters Willnot have the option to be "actual soldiers/storm troopers" in the imperial army, because if they were allowed to do this they would be AWOL all the time while persueing personal goals. So since we ARE NOT imperial soldiers, WE are NOT bound by the same restraints as real officers. We have proven our loyalty to the empire, we have built up our faction. And as a reward for our hard work and dedication to the empire, the Emperor has seen fit to allow me to use a MINISCULE portion of his Grand Army as I see fit, as long as I remain the the empires good graces.
If I am forced to use my AT-ST purely for PvP or Faction missins only, I want my own room in one of the Faction bases (military provided housing), I want a uniform appropriate for my skills. and I want a weelky salary based on my rank. And FURTHER MORE. if I outrank an officer at one of the factional bases I pass while on my way to a rebel town, I want to be able to commandeer the forces at that base (and any others I may find along the way). That way I will be A ranking officer taking command of a tactical situation, and exterminating rebels, NPC and PC alike.
Not only will I be bringing my AT-ST with me but the other 14 along the way. And the other 5 ranking officers that are traveling to your rebel town from other directions will bring the 10-15 At's they can commandeer along the way.
What the changes you are proposing willmake us regular army units. which contradicts what you said we were gonna be.
Excellent point Zahnn
DEVS FYI:
If you keep changing all the rules, this game WILL NEVER BALANCE OUT (is it meant to anyway). If you had left it alone from day 1 out of beta, the game would have balancedout naturally. If you keep changing the WORLD LEVEL rules it will never balance because everyone is trying to one up everyone else. Your job is to FIX BUGS, not rewrite the game every 2 weeks.
I think everyone agrees that nerfing stuff to create solutions is a bad approach, just give the reb's a cooler faction pet similar to the AT-ST, problem solved. Ex. gives them a Faction droid of some kind.
Please stop the nerfing rules, stats, etc its making everyone start over for all their hard work every time you do it.
RESOLUTION:
Give each side a balance perk (add something), or skill etc new stuff, do not nerfing existing rules and pets etc.
ty if you even read this
Ok I have read much of this and many other fine boards and again I ask the simple question? Why.
Why would I spend 10k (or god forbid a wookkie spend 28.5k) in FP pointsto get a unhealable faction pet.
Why did I start over.
Simple I was a wookie that had to pay 28.5 k to get a now useless FP AT-ST
Why bother to get one at all.
last month I worked my way up to to 6500 FP. as a wookie to get a fine and dandy Dark Trooper.
I took him into battle, Pulled my sword and watched him get his butt whooped hard by 1 rebel mission.
Fortunetly being a CM I was able to stop fighting, run back, heal his expensive, yet sorry, but up and finish of the single rebel mission wihtout loosing my 6500 fp investment.
ThenI looked at his mind damage. 3/4 of the way down, no way was he going to be worth anything to run the second mission.
Come to find out there is no way at all to heal his mind damage. (Oh Wait I said I an use mind heal from CM speed 4). Yeh great so as long as I am willing to run one mission run to Coronet starport from Dant and sit in the only cantina with a dancer on the planetfor ten minutes fly back to Dant finish another mission /loop over and over this cycle I could use him
Great thats sounds fun, 
So after dropping master CH to try somethign new I quickly released what most people have been saying.
The only class in this game that has any hope of doing anythign alone is CH.
So now lets see I suppose to come up with 9.5k of FP not counting rank adn 200 FP points to control one AT-ST thats not healable in any way to be destryed in one PvP mission by a DOT attack of a weapon thats broken.
Ugh No.
Lets see whats more realistic.
Hum what I ll do is again become CH, not al the way but even with new changes Ill get lets say T & T 4 and 4 of the CH bar this will give me a fine 34 cl heck mauler time.
Then I l'll get BH and do my best to fast tank away like crazy. Oh my maulers out of strenght whoo hoo no prob I can store what 10 of um so wee I'll just pull anothe rone of um.
40 misions later ill head to my favorite imp outpost and get my buddy the doc to heal um all up for me and back out ill go.
Why amI saying this.
Easy. I don't want to get CH Taming and Trianing 4, I want to play somethign new.
Yet I like many others here don't wan't to have to play all the time grouped with every other player just to survive.
So like every other person that likes to play by themsleves when there friends aren't available, I need support. Whooom lets see go CH and get repairable Tank pet with trick commnad or run 100 FP missions make rank buy unrepairable and worthless in PVE Faction Pet.
Whoops count me in for the CH ranks once more.
Ok Sarcasm off.
So what can we really do to make everyones faction pets and game more enjoyable.
Faction Pets healable or replaceable. This is got to be feasible. I'm all up for a a Faction pet if I can use him but please having no way to heal him up makes him worthless. So what if I can fix 1or 2 bars of ham, if there is no way to repair all three he is WORTHLESS. If i am seargent in an army and I loose a man I get a new one to replace him, this sounds more feasible to me go back to recruiter recruit a repalcement and use him. Sure make it some type of restriction, No more than 3 replaements per day on lower level fp pets adn 1 per day on heeavies like AT-STs I can handle that.
OK fine I agree the AT-ST should not be repairable by health packs. That makes sense all the way but he sure needs to be healed some way.
SO lets look a t Fp pets repairablility options.
Ok lets balance this for PvP to start. I'mwilling ot pull my AT-St out in a PvP battle. **edit** straight I expect him to be vonurable to a commnado. Thast a Commnado job, So he knocks the crap out of him fast. He's down. I have no prob with that either but please make him store. Not be dead. (and this goes for all FP pets not just AT-ST)
Fp wounds Deaths should be eliminated.
Sure my At-St has had the crap beat out of it, Sure its useless but hey My graul got the crap beat out of him too and incap but I can get him up and goign quick enough Why shouldn;t other players be able to have pets that can also do this.
Make Droid Engineers viable for this. Let them create droid/FP repair modules/packs. I can buy them like vitality packs heal my pets wounds and go on about my business.
I have no prob with FP Pets having reducing Vitality each time the incap thats in line with the CH.
Rank being able to decided FP pet usage. This has been covered so much there is no need to beata dead horse. I have read Th's thread saying this is a future plan. Please implement it .
CH controlling pets. I have been a MCH, There not overpowered, By no means the best or most powerful class it the game, and cannot take down everyone easily. What they can do is survive. They can survive longer than anyone becuase they have a means to fend off attckers by use of tanks. This is great, please don't take that from them, but allow others in the game a means to have some ability to fend of an attack also.
Exmaple. I decided to drop MCH, try somethign new. SO I completed master CM made soem killer Mind poison and romped of to help my buddy on Yavin get Avian meat for buff packs. Within half our I was dead 5 times. Why what was I hunting. Whispering birds. (yes those pathetic cheesy no CL birds on Yavin) Why, well even as a Master CM that can heal myself constantl,y throw great poisons and shoot a descent bowcaster I could not overcome 4,5,6 or more creatures mass attacking me. And these guys are really not what I consider aslightly difficult Creature. Image how long zI owuld last on Dant taking on say Hurttons. 2 mins max the oops back to cloning staiton once more.
I needed a tank. Something to buffer me from the mass attack. I woudl have happily used a droid. (whoops no descent ones availbale). A FP pet. (wait that cost me a ton and he can't be repaired) or a creature. (got none dropped CH).
In turn what happened. I quit started over human dumped Wookie got some armor and started my way back to novice CH.
Ch pets adn Fp pets the same. Please and you want me to give up beocming CH why? New % of CH's on server to rise by 30% or more following new patch.
Sure allow Ch to control 3 pets at master heck give them 90 cl they need it to be moe ejoyable and have more options.
But to make it so i cannot pull but 1 non healable pet. Again I reiterate you want me not to go CH why?
Give me a tank of some sort. Not apet but a FP pet that is healable. AT-ST Droid Trooper they are all great choices.
Having a point system in place for control of fp pets would be far better to me then buying personal support.
I make corporal 1 low level fp pet.lets say a private. about as good as a novive marksman with say lvl 1 pistol skills
I make seargent I get a corporal and private combo. The corporal having skills again equel to saymarksamn class 2 rifle, pistol, carbine.
Ok so now I make Major.
I can have 3 pets. using point system I could have say 3 seargents lvl 3 in marksman or medic skills etc.
Or perhaps a Dark trooper with novice rifleman skills orpistoleer skills availbale to me. and a seargent, Out of FP points now so can only have two as CH can have 3 GSP but only 2 maulers at master
I make 5 star general. ( and yes this should take an aweful long time to achieve)
I can now command 3 At-St's as a MCH controlls 3 GSPs.
OK so for balance purposes how do we make this fair to to everyone thats not a CH. easy. If aCH becomes Overt he is unbale to pull non FP pets.
When Droids become more viable the restriction on CH to pull pets should be affected. say we give the droids a CL level also.
As other classes move up in a carrer path they gain droid CL control levels. SO lets say hey can top out at 40 giving them the abilty at master to use 2 good droids of equal abilty to say a Gran Wrinx. Or one great pet of the abilty of say a Mauler.
By doing this the CH can still pull 3 pets 2maulers and a med lvl battle droid of 22 cl l(giving them 90 CL as suggested earlier) lets say but I as a BH could also pull a 40cl droid capableof tanking as well. Still presenting the CH with a good reason to master but not forcing everyone to go Ch to survive.
This in turn works with the MCH getttig 90 CL, heck their tanks are there lives they need them to be able to hit hard. Give them pets that can I want the MCH and master BH to have good firepower they earned it let them enjoy it. Same for any fighting class let them rock hard at master or for that fact any class that master should rock at what they do.
Also last but not least I am Imp, or will be again soon, Give the Rebs some good Fp pets also. Let them enjoy somethign of value. Sure they don't have AT-STs but I'm sure they have some firepower of value that can be givien to them that fits the Star Wars saga. use the cost in Fp points to balance the game out, If the rebs are 65-35% then make the cost of FP point usage to gain the pets higher for them, More people fighting more people using the supplies up mor cost to replace. IE reb Seargent has same FP points ot spend as Imp Seargent but since ther is almost 3 times as many of them the cost is far higher so he can only be assigned 2 privates or one corporal. This give the Dev team and open ended great means to balance the game without constantly nerfing it. And a awesome means to persuade folks to switch sides.
Also make it so someone who wants to switch sides can. If someone has mastered say captain in the rebs then the not only have to loose all that but works backwards to get rid of it. Why would they change. They shoudl be allowed to come to IMperial Outpost recruiterrequest assilume and loose all negative FP and start from scratch. (perhaps allow side swapping once evry thirty days)
Ok you rebs stop complaing about that for one i never even seen a kryat dragon let alone farm one you are just happy cuz the imps advantage is gona go away will it s not a advantage aganst commandos but in starwars sense when do rebs get to be bigger then the empire? maybe they should give rebs some kinda of good faction pet.
anyways about kryat farming for one u can be master tk and hunt holos on your own i know cuz im one when i was a reb id kill dark troopers whitch drop holos alot and ive never seen kryat dragons so i dont even try
For those of you saying AT-St's are worthless and will become worse:
Are you really saying that solo'ing a Krayt with just 3 pets is worthless?
Gee, fire hurting a mechanical object.. you ever seen a RL tank burn? it's not pretty.
basically you are complaining about not being able to control three level 75 pets not to mention if there is a MCH IMP with 3. (two of my friends) Don't get me wrong.. it's a beautiful sight.
I can see limiting FP's to 1 out. I disagree with it but sure for at-st's but not for the piece of crap npc's
Being a Reb I think the imps SHOULD be able to have some serious firepower to kick our superior numbers butts with.
Why nerf theAT-ST itself? That thing should not be unbeatable but it should be able to wholesale slaughter the average rebel or 5. Leave it tough to hit.. Crap, it SHOULD be tough to inflict dammage to all but the UBER l33t professions you talk about investing SP's and time...
I actually agree (write this day down in your calandar)with the whole not to be used for PVE. These are for wars not for hunting trips or profit.
I think a simple not for PVE would have been appropriate. Maybe with the only one AT-ST out at a time but to drop it's armor?? that's plain stupid. The no poison or disease was a no brainer. I've never seen a machine get sick.
Yes, I think the AT-St nerf fest sucks. I hope you guys get stronger AT-AT's soon.To say that they were already worthless?? Cry me a river!
-H
KaylBreinhar wrote:
Thrive wrote:
No rebels can post in this thread? Thank you Captain Totalitarianism!
Yeah - Rebels can post in the thread, but it's pretty obvious what MOST of your viewpoints are. You want a game where the Rebels always win.
Hmmmm, which side is saying "We want a death machine that cannot be killed"? I don't think it's the Rebels.
Im disapointed to see SOE give in the cries of nerf for the at-st, but not to any of the other things that need to be fixed/nerfed/un-nerfed.
Zahnn72 wrote:
DeQuosaek wrote:
Here's an idea... while the commando is trying to stack the flames on your AT-ST (which should not be very fast, have you seen the speed of most flamethrowers?)why don't you use your character to kill him?
colsankey wrote:
Whats the total.. non-75%-reducaed damage on an ATST per tick? I as a player take up to 800 with several flames stacked on me when im buffed. Im guessing closer to about 3k a tick when its not reduced.. 48k hp more?!?!!? whoopty Fing doo. 24 ticks of UNHEALABLE damage and my ATSTs burned to the ground.
Because the fire is already started and IF I killed said commando 10 times in a row for setting my AT on fire, what would that accomplish?
A 10% reduction in the quality of his items. (which he then could replace after torching a few mission NPC's)
or perhaps he looses nothing except the time spent in the hospital healing his wounds which in most cases will be minimal cause he has cloned nearby anyways. That way he can keep running out and torching it again so it will burn faster. And nothing will stop him from repeating this until it dies or he gets bored.
So why not call for the removal of group revenge TEF? Wouldn't that make more sense than crying that the AT-ST should be stronger?
First off, let me just say that yes I am Imperial and I do posess an AT-ST. (the second one I've owned)
With that said, here I go
A vast majority of us imps don't use our walkers for Holo Farming, and I agree that we shouldn't be able to. So the no PvE part is fine by most of us. To accuse all of us of doing this is just not logical or fair. To only be allowed to have 1 AT-ST out at a time is fine also, but don't restrict any of us (Rebels included) from having 3 troops out. It just makes no sense. I'm a colonel, but apparently I can only command the respect of a single stormtrooper? what are the other guys in my datapad gonna do? lol, sorry sir, tk-232 is out, so we don't care what you say, we're on coffee break, blow.
As for what the real problem is IMO it's not the AT-ST at all. It's the flame throwers, they just do too much DOT to that poor machine. Now I'm a firm believer that a commando has every right to be the guy to take one down, the problem is that a majority of the rebel players that participate in PvP have the ability to use the 1 weapon that can really mess the AT up. To see one of these machines out in PvP right now is a rare sight due to the amazingly high faction pt cost to ease of destruction ratio. I lost my first one in less than 30 seconds. I'm human, but still 9000 FP gone in less than 30 seconds is an increadibly painful experience, especially when you are helpless to stop it. I'd be fine with the AT's not being changed HAM wise, if they lessened the power of the Flame Thrower DoT on it, and/or give us the ability to get it repaired. Even with the new changes, a flame thrower will still make a 9000 FP pet next to useless after a flame attack due to unrepairable wounds.
I'm against the armor reduction, and I'm against the vulnerability to flame throwers(the way it is now)
I'm for us being able to repair or heal these machines and for us not being able to use them in PvE.(most of us will survive)
My final 2 credits worth is quick and painful...
At this point in time, the Empire is SUPPOSED to have a tight stranglhold on the galaxy, not the rebellion. There will come a time when we should fear being Imperial, but it's not supposed to be right now! Give us the equipment we need to fight the GCW, don't keep making our best machine so much walking scrap. Give us a stronger Imperial NPC presence in at least the capital cities, make the rebels afraid to walk around Overt for once. I can't say how other servers are, but on Radiant, we Imps are the ones fighting the war from underground bunkers. It's a sad day when a single rebel MCH with a flame thrower can camp outside the Emperors retreat farming holos from the dark troopers and laying waste to the AT-ST'swith his rancor and graul mauler out...
I'm usually quiet on the boards, so flame away. I know there will be some rebels who just won't be happy until they can 1 shot kill us all and we can't scratch them...
Somebody mentioned that this isn't a good way to promote the Imperial faction... Well, I'll admit, you're right, to the existing players. What happens when you take the rattle away from a baby? It cries. (Just a metaphor, don't take it personally.)
Before they can promote any faction, they need to balance it out a bit. I'm sure that the faction costs for AT-STs will be lowered in time. But honestly, Imperial players were spoiled with a pet that was frankly too powerful.
In addition, instead of wining about the AT-ST "nurf." Why don't you guys put up more posts about turning these things into player driven vehicles? Now that would certainly entice players to join the Imperial faction, and I'm sure you guys would have more fun with it too. It's been hinted that this "might" happen in the future. Asking for it w/o insulting our hard working CSRs and Devs just might motivate them to add a little focus to it.
Anyway, just my 2 cents.
Ok...I've been quiet about all the changes until now, cause I've had no problem with them. I'm Imp and I have no AT-ST, so that's all cleared up first off. But, 2 of my freinds just called and cancled their accounts after reading these threads, which pisses me off, so I reveiwed this thread and will now rant good and bad on this issue...
First off: tying the faction "pets" to CH is a BAD idea...period. Faction and rank mean nothing right now except that I can get PvPed..so if this goes into effect I'm quiting the ranks of the Imps and going back to neutral. Now if I had to work hard to get my 3 Storm Commandos out, I wouldn't mind that...but not on CH, on faction rank.
Second: I appluad the idea of only using the AT-STs for faction missions and factional related things, they are machines of war...not vermin clearers. If the same was said for my StCs...I wouldn't mind at all. Certain ranked troops should be generaly usable and others should be specialist roles.
Last: Gimpin' Imps isn't a good way to get people into the faction...and Rebs too. If you want a galactic Civil War, let 'em grab their troops and fight it out! Taking away troops and firepower form both sides hurts the game, and the feel of SW in general, I'd hate to see more good players quit because of this.
Just my Opinon though
Dessk'Ssan Basskin, Smugglin' everything, everywhere, anytime!