CUEmu - Thread Posts

speardancer

Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:52 am

Is there some way this test can be duplicated on one of the live servers?

The load on the live servers vs the test server may have an effect on the results.

The other thing is, if 4% is the expected failure rate, why do our tools show us the risk as 0% on experimentation? I'd like to see that changed, after all, isn't a 0% risk mean I should have a 100% sucess rate? And since this is not the case, I'd like it to show at least a 1% risk to reflect this, unless I can actualy get a 0% risk.

Also, as an armorsmith, I notice higher failures on mabari armor, and certain pieces of other armor (bracers on composite come to mind) compared to other items. What items were used in your tests? were the crafters all doing a single item for the test, or did they vary across their avaliable schematics?

Can you also look at the "marginal success" message? armorsmiths get this while experimenting on the durability for armor (does any other crafter get this?), and the result is usualy some stats go up, and some go down. if we cannot get more detail, can this message be chages to something like "partial success" or something else more in line with what the result actual is?

Speardancer Master Artisian, Shipwright and 12pt Armorsmith *cancelation pending*
Garlyn, Master Tailor and 11pt Chef *Canceled, last day Apr. 24th*
Motas, Master Scout and Carbineer *Canceled, last day June 16th
*Waited 1 year for a combat fix, and all I got was this lousy T-Shirt*

MachineZed

Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:52 am

#119

I would also like to say Hello, haven't seen your welcome post.

Now back to the topic, I think the frustration lies in the Components (At least for me it does) I don't mind the failures I realize they happen. But as a DE most of our Droids take something like 6 different Components. Lets take a R2 Advanced for example the schematic calls for 90 Chemical, 190 Chemical, Droid Chasis, Droid Brain, General Module Socket Cluster (Optional), 2 GeneralModules (Optional) and 2 Defensive Sockets (Optional).

Right there that is 7 Components if I use all the Optional extras.

The Defensive Sockets take armor, some Droid Armor Sokets take Composite Arnor Segments, plus resources

The Socket Cluster takes 3 General Modules plus Resources

The Droid Brain and General Modules only take Resources, except for the Repair Module (which takes a Droid Brain)

The Droid Chasis needs Advanced Droid Brain, Advanced Droid Motivator, Manipulator Arm Package Set , Droid Sensor, and I think Advanced Droid Frame and Resources

That step alone takes up to 11 Components, but wait theres more....

The Advanced Droid Brain needs4Electronic GPs (From FactoryCrate) and 4 Electronic Memory Modules (FromFactory Crate) plus Resources

The Advanced Droid Motivator needs a Control Unit plus Resources

I will count the GPs and EMMs as one item because they are from Factory Items, so that will make it 3 more items.

For a grand total of 21 Components if I choose to load up my R2 with every bell and wistle that is at my disposal. Now imagine out of those 21 combines you will fail looks like 4% that comes out to .87 times you make a R2. Heaven forbid you fail on the Final Combine of the droid.

Again the resource lost doesn't bother me, its the component loss that irks me. When I sell a Custom Droid to my customer, they have to wait 10 minutes for me to finalize the droid, thats with out the Critical Fail.

I am implying when we Fail take the resources, but save the components

§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§
§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§
§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§
§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§
§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§§
X Machine'Zed X
Obsidian Dagger Squadron

cwhooks

Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:52 am

#120

I'm using the best tools and crafting station and crafting module for my server Bloodfin. I am a master weaponsmith and the 4% critical rate seems way to low for what I'e experienced... Strangely enough I get way more critical failures with my crafting station that I do with my driod so I have stopped using the crafting station... Also something seems to be wrong with experimentation in that the only way to reliably max one experimentation feature (say damage) is by experimenting 1 point at a time! Every time I've tried to do it all at once, I've *never* hit the max damage possible. I have 11 pointsto use thansk to skill tapes and it takes me 3 or 4 attempts to max damage for a schematic and it usually takes all 11 points. Other weaponsmiths say it usually only takes them 9 or 10 points to do that, however that has not been my experience. Also note that 2 moderate success with the experiment 1 point at a time method prevents you from hitting the max! Heck even 1 moderate or good success with your last experimentation point will drop your max damage regardless of which stat you are experimenting on for weapons! Your experimentation windows what appears to be a % chance of failure when experimenting... It's false suggestion is doubly frustrating!

Crafting profession are already way more time consuming that fighting profession jsut taking the harvesting part into consideration! Having to spend an hour just to get a good, let alone great schematic is just to frustrating!

Battleaxe - Bloodfin galaxy.
Surveyor of Lok and 12 point Master FS Weaponsmith.
_____ Resources, Sliced Weapons, Skill tapes, Loot...
Mall.....800m from Theed starport at -5139 3399.
_____ Deliveries use any vendor named 'BA's ...'.

Colaboy

Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:55 am

#121

Chrysalide, masters should have critical failures down to 1% or less... Make master of any crafting profession mean something. Also, you could up the experimentation on masters too... I find a Master Weaponsmith isnt much better at crafting than oneat 4-4-4-4....

I have 3 accounts. Out of the three, 2 are crafting characters.. One is a Master Doc, and the other is Master Weaponsmith/Master Architect... Critical failures are a killer, especially for my Doctor...

"I will never be condescending - which means talking down to people."

VemaGara

Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:57 am

#122

The chance of failure is not properly displayed in the experimentation window. If I get a 4% failure rate, when the window says 0%, then there is a problem. We need meaningful numbers that accurately reflect failure rate.

Dr. Vema Gara
Master Doctor, Master Fencer
Imperial Ace (solo), Imperial Inquisition
Valcyn
(Sophitia, Trinidad on Test)

Songe

Tue Jan 27, 2004 1:58 am

#123

I just think that the % of critical failures should depend more on the skill of the crafter. So far, even if we get more assembly skill as we go up, I haven't seen a huge difference at all between novice and master.

------

Novice Lekku Stomper

DMFan

Tue Jan 27, 2004 2:28 am

#124

Sub-components shouldn't go waste if I receive a critical failure.

I mean, if i'm assembling an item made of sub-components how could I destroy them if I fail? It's absurd; I loose resources, which get obviously ruined, but sub-components should be recovered.

High-quality items need so many sub-components (and we speak of high quality sub-components) so it's frustrating loosing them just for a critical failure (which anyway a Master shouldn't receive).

Another thing I disapprove is the extreme difficulty Novice Weaponsmiths have to find credits for their job (but this affects Novice Armorsmiths also). In the beginning they craft useless items even with the best resources available. No one want their items...

If one can't sell what it produces, how can we expect him to survive?

I would also insert the chance to receive Weapon or Armor XP points when offline or on another planet, not only being in the area with the people using our crafted items.

"I was angry with my friend, I told my wrath, my wrath did end; I was angry with my foe, I told it not, my wrath... did grow." (W. Blake - A poison tree)

Danem Jy'viir - Old Denobia, Rori.

Alamandra

Tue Jan 27, 2004 2:58 am

#125

I think way to much emphasis is place on crafters having to make the best items that they can all of the time with regards to experimentations...

I play a master Tailor working towards Master Merchant and Master Armorsmith... The biggest problem i have is with any form of crit failure rendering a schematic usesless during experimentation even if you have points left to spend... Once the stat drops to 0 its no longer raisable no matter how many points you have left.

Id like this addressed please If you crit fail and have points left you should still be able to experiment on the item in an attempt to make it as good as possible.

Also id like to see accurate % to fail rates given during experimenting if it says 0% fail chance i dont want to see crit fails comming up at all otherwise its not 0% its 1%. Im asuming that your tool and crafting station directly effect the starting fail % rate on making an item along with your assembly Rating.

Example failing start rate is 100% on an item you have +50 assembly a +13 tool and a +9 station then assembly fail % should be 28%

28% should be shown when attempting to assemble the item OR experimenting on it. If you go over the 100% you should maybe fail once in a blue moon

Masters i believe should never Crit Fail.

kErosion

Tue Jan 27, 2004 3:20 am

#126

As a long time crafter who has been heavily involved in Master Artisan, Master Architect, and Master Weaponsmith construction continually since release of SWG, I felt I had to throw in my two-cents.

The base critical failure rate seems fine. That it's breaking down to around 4% is hard proof that the basic failure rate is at an acceptable level. The problem lies with the interaction of Crafting Tools and Crafting Stations on the failure rates of assembly and experimentation. At the moment, there is a very negligable difference between the failure rates of extremely low-end Crafting Tools/Stations, and exceedingly high-end Crafting Tools/Stations.

Due to the rare resource spawns involved with making high-end Crafting Tools/Stations, the actual rate of improvement is far below what should be seen. The current rate of 4% failure is perfect for crafting utilizing average Crafting Tools/Stations. This rate should increase when using low-end equipment, and decrease to almost nothing (0.05%) with a perfect Crafting Tool/Station. I remember all too well the number of crafters who would come to me as an Architect dropping well over 100:1 in some cases for the highest quality Crafting Station possible, and being disappointed by the end result.

After being involved in various crafting professions, I still consider high quality Crafting Stations to be one of the most difficult to create crafts in the game due to therarity of the majority of the resourcesnecessary to produce 40+ effectiveness. They really should add some Experimentation bonuses, like an extra point or two at the very highest end, but I think the entire crafting community would settle for decreased failure rates. =)

kErosion Ral'Zek

cadof

Tue Jan 27, 2004 4:43 am

#127

So let me see the three main issues are:

Lag

Stations and tool quality does not make a deference

5% for a master artisans is to high

Master weapon smith I use a +12 tool, +43 station, + 1 experimentation tape and live in a research community if you are telling me I am going to have 5% rate of critical failures. 5% is way to high. Maybe it not the rate you should worry about it should be the erumpent and skill level should be fixed so that it works right. Instead of putting a Band-Aid on it fix the real problems. But thanks for see this as a problem. If I am wrong please let me know so I can be under stand how it works.

Cerene

Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:04 am

#128

I have been a Master Artisan & Master Weaponsmith, am presently a Tailor with 1-3-3-4, a Master Medic and a Novice Doc with 1-2-1-2... now granted, i'ma low level doc, but from what I see, the fail rate for meds is MUCH higher than it has been for anything else.

We need more info than you've given us...a breakdown by professsion would be a nice start to see if they all have the same fail rate...

_InnerLight_

Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:12 am

#129

With these numbers:

Assembly attempts: 1448
Assembly critical failures: 65
Assembly critical failure rate: 4.49%

Experimentation attempts: 1284
Experimentation critical failures: 54
Experimentation critical failure rate: 4.21%

You obviously were not crafting Krayt Weapons, Composite Armor or Enhance D packs. What exactly were you making in the above attempts? I have noticed an average of 2.5 critical failures during assembly or experimenation on a full suit of Composite Armor at the Master Armorsmith Level.

And also another problemthat I have seen NO feedback from the devs for over FIVE MONTHS on are the meaningless Amazing Success and the effects of Moderate Successes upon anything craftable of which any Moderate Success actually hurts experimention resultsand cannot be considered "Success".

Basically, the way the experimentation system works now, the only beneficial experimentation is Great Success. There are what 5 or 6 different possibilities? One positve and 5 negative isn't right.

And while you're at it, how about you fix the third problem of the mystery assembly, where you get major initial craft %'s increases over your typical assembly combine and after the mystery assembly all experimentation boxes open reguardless of the resources used.

WarNerve5776

Tue Jan 27, 2004 5:36 am

#130

I think that once a crafter is a Master in his/her profession there should be almost no critical failures.

And I really feel bad for the Jedi out there that have lost millions due to a critical failure on a sabre.

Baiyne

Development Cycle Archive

Thread: Crafting Critical Failure Rates