Dancer Archive
Thread: So how do we deal with the AFKers when they're not AFK?
It seems like now all those AFKers are causing just as many, if not more, problems when they're ATK as when they're AFK, and I'm completely at a loss of how to deal with this.
I've been talking to some of my new crafter patrons, and by and large they like the new system except for one thing -- it's hard to find someone willing to buff. Notice that I'm not saying "it's hard to find someone ATK," but I'm saying "it's hard to find someone willing to buff."
For example, I was in Mos Eisley last night. A nice Armorsmith came in wanting a buff. He was polite, conversational, tipped well, and had been working on meeting and getting to know the ATK ents to know who to talk to (in other words, all the things we recommend doing to find a buff). I was in a full group of entertainers who were ATK at the time (though I guarantee from the way they were talking that they were NOT dedicated ATKers, and were generally AFK most of the time), most with at least one mastery and all with at least novice of an elite, and there were at least 4 - 5 others that were maybe AFK (okay, probably AFK..).
I was the only person to acknowledge that there was a patron in search of a buff.
Now, I understand that when people are ATK and actually playing the game, we have no right to dictate what they do as long as it's not griefing to other players. But how are we, as live entertainers who have the interests of patrons first in our minds, supposed to cope with the increasingly large percentage of entertainers who do nothing but socialize in group chat with each other while completely ignoring that patrons even exist?
I'm at a loss. I understand how it really only takes two "buffers" per cantina (one dancer and one musician) to cover all the patron needs, and that we really have a huge imbalance of too many entertainers to patrons right now.
But I also understand how frustrating it is to be ignored, and I also understand how even though those entertainers are in the cantina taking up space, they're ignoring patron needs. I don't want people to give up on finding buffs because they've been ignored too often by people who are obviously ATK and talking...just not to the patrons.
So how do we cope with this? Will leading by example be enough? Will they wake up and realize "Hey that twi'lek over there seems to be getting an awful lot of attention, maybe I should try talking to people," or will they continue to only notice patrons long enough to add the few who tip to their bio lists?
It seems like what I feared and tried fighting against when I first noticed AFKing taking hold has finally come true. I'm not ready to stop fighting, but honestly I'm out of ideas.
My problem is that I'm emphasing would and not could.
Message Edited by Doriana on 09-03-2005 12:14 PM
Considering that chatting with your ent buddies was the only thing entertainers had to do for the last 2-3 months, I don't blame them much for considering that to be "normal" entertainer gameplay.
As for the problem, simple greed might be all it takes. "Thanks for the 100K tip, DocJones!" is just about guaranteed to get some attention from those "cliques" that you're talking about.
I'm actually pretty amazed at how people throw money around nowadays. I used to think that 1k was a pretty awesome tip back in the "old days". Nowadays, people drop 50k - 100k on a buff without even thinking about it...
The answer to this is simple. Lead by example. Show them what a true entertainer is like. The ones who want to learn, will learn from your excellent example, and the ones who don't, you couldn't do anything about anyway.
C
Message Edited by PoetDancer on 09-03-200512:40 PM
Message Edited by PoetDancer on 09-03-2005 12:40 PM
PoetDancer wrote:
This is the problem with this "hodge podge" mechanic of active and passive elements. It wastes time, because its so inefficient. If we could just give it, and not have it take any time, nobody would go away from the cantina frustrated. If we could just have them take it, we wouldn't even need to hear "can u buff me" /tells, at all. And they'd be around, appreciating the things they like to see, and hear.
I agree! I like the idea that the active buffs are something only ATK entertainers can do. But the passive general xp buff for combat undermines any value we ganied from having a few active buffs. And the override of a passive buff causing you to lose specific buff is a pain. I'm all for getting rid of passive buffing. I'm not a big fan of the specific buffs since they don't stack (ex. would be that a tailor/chef has to keep switching buffs to get the bonuses--a detriment if you want to do more than one thing in three hours). I also think you should be able to actively buff more than one person at a time. We shouldn't have lines. More than one person can watch a dancer if she's giving a show and reap the benefits of that. And I hate the "can u buff me" /tells two. Forcing people to ask for things usually leads to rudeness. IDs certainly got a lot of that with Stat Migrations.
I think the problem is that earlier in the day no one gained the patron.
The other night I encountered an entertainer who was frustrated because not 20 minutes before I arrivedshe had been pratically begging one of the other entertainers for an entertainer buff. As soon as she asked the entire group went silent. Maybe it's because so many "entertainers" on my server are afk for the majority of the time so as soon as someone asks for the new buff they don't have the faintest idea how it works. Rather than admit to another entertainer that they don't know how to give the buff they simply act like they didn't hear the request. Maybe they don't want to buff and rather than come right out and admit they don't want to buff they just remain silent. I agree that the only way to proceed is just as you did. Try to continue to provide a good example. EIther it will make a difference or it won't but at least you will have tried.
PoetDancer wrote:
But there is a limit, no?
If I am a musician/dancer, I have to stop my ability to "dance buff," if a weaponsmith comes in. If I am buffing the weaponsmith, I cannot just give a dance buff, if a Bio Engineer walks in.
It may not seem like much. Just a small nusiance. But add all the "thousand paper cuts" together, and it makes entertaining too much of a hassle to be fun, and be seen by anyone as "entertaining."
You can't stop being a Dancer and start being a Musician mid-buff..no. Nor can my architect/tailor stop being an architect while a PA hall is building in the crafting tool and start being a tailor just because someone came into the shop wanting a mangy vest. I can talk to the tailor customer and explain why I can't make the mangy vest for a couple of minutes..and similar scenarios have occurred many times.
You know Sirii, you've been presenting one arguement after the next against the new Inspirations since beforetheir release. Why don't you run a poll and see if the majority of posters here would like for me to simply ask that the functionality and interdependency we have been given be taken away?
I don't know if the devs would remove them if we asked. But if the majority of posters in a poll voted in favor of removal of Inspirations, I would ask for it on their behalf..whether I agree with the assessment or not.
TheSillyOne wrote:
I'm not really seeing the problem. They were partying and having a good time with each other (not a bad thing) and in the process they gave you the opportunity to gain a patron (also not a bad thing). Live entertainers in the cantina dancing and socializing and patrons looking for buffs then getting them from a live entertainer who is also in the cantina dancing and socializing seems like the optimal situation.
No, the problem was that a patron would come in and say "Is there a live entertainer who could give me an AS buff?" and all the people would ignore him. Not say "Oh, I don't know how the new system works yet.." or "I'm not master, I can only give a 2.5 hour buff," and not "I really don't like to buff but This_Person could.."
They refuse to acknowledge that the patron even exists. If I hadn't been there, the patron would have not gotten a buff, and he had been ignored and unable to get a buff previously at that cantina.
The system can accomodate a few people doing that in a cantina that has multiple live entertainers, and there are times when I just sit back and do my own thing myself. But I NEVER do that if there is a patron looking for help, be it a buff or information or just to talk. I only ever stay quiet if someone answers before me.
The problem that I'm concerned about is that the patrons are having to travel from cantina to cantina, are finding groups of active entertainers and all of them are ignoring anything other than their entertainer cliques and the patrons are leaving with no help and without even being acknowledged. This is not hypothetical, this is based on what patrons have told me in game and what I've gone to see myself.
Message Edited by Doriana on 09-03-2005 04:17 PM
RyFord wrote:
Just because I am a Doctor doesn't mean I buff anyone. You CHOOSE who you want to buff. Just because you provide the services doesn't mean you are "at work" 24/7.
Agreed. But do you just ignore the person asking for a buff or do you say "Sorry I'm not buffing." Like it or not our profession is perceived as one that will at least respond to people when they speak to us. No one likes to simply be ignored when they ask a question. In fact, where I come from it's considered down right rude. If the person asking for the buff is told "Sorry I'm not buffing" and then they get abusive about it then that's a different scenario. But surely entertainers who don't want to buff can at least be polite enough to respond to the request.
Then that right there shows a problem, and indeed, one of the problems with the whole "redefinition" of this game.
We don't even know how to play anymore.
I was on today. I even put on my tags, and started dancing in public.
All I gained by doing so, are 2000 credits of system money. But in that time, I saw a bunch of AFK patrons in the cantinas like Theed, and a "semi attended" musician at the MO, spamming "I'm not one of those AFK entertainers. High bank tips get on my bio. I can do profession-specific buffs. PST for your buff."
I saw patrons come in, but frankly, I didn't know what to say to them. Maybe I just lost "the knack," but its just that there are so many reasons to go there now that have nothing to do with "resting," and "relaxing," that I am actually waiting for them to tell me what they need.
I am good at being a "distraction from the mundane." That is what made me a good entertainer in the launch days. What I am not very good at being is "a short order waitress," that gives the patron the confidence that their order is being taken seriously, and with care.
Its hard to actually go into the story about my days at Tyrena Secondary School, when more likely than not, the patron will say, "cut the crap, can u buff me, plz?" 
What frustrates me the most though, is that this whole "new philosophy" of entertainment did not come naturally, in a way that makes sense. It was imposed on all of us from a cadre of a few who thought "this will be a neat thing to try." And now I see those same activists scrambling to "make it work" because its obvious to everyone its not working like we need it to.
They tellus to give it time. How much time? Frankly, do we have an "exit strategy," in case its not working out for many of us?
The truth of the matter is,we'll never admit this was a failure--even if it ends up being a failure.We were all just "so sure" this would work. But what is the definition if this "works," or not?