Dancer Archive
Thread: Blues: Post Mortem of an Entertainer Guild (long)
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nvoigt
Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:47 am
#1
This isn't dancer only, but I didn't want to cross post 
When I logged in today, I had 27 Emails. 25 Bazaar Mails, a mail from our guild leader and a mail from the PA system. Our Guild had been disbanded. The mail from our guild leader didn't contain much. There wasn't much to say. We were two active players left and we had already talked about it. Blues would cease to exist. It didn't go with a loud bang and a party extraordinair. Blues died, slowly, lonely and hidden.
I have played many online games, Drakkar, UO, DAoC, Browser based games, strategy games, clan based FPS... people come, people go, membership numbers fluctuate and groups form and disband. Thats nothing new. People change, lose interest, lose internet access, lose funding for the game, lose contact to friends for one reason or another. Nothing is safe from change.
But this was different.
When I got the invitation to participate in the beta test of SWG about a year ago, I was stunned. I was to test the hyped, 1337 game that would finally give me a good MMORPG. After canceling my DAoC account earlier, that was a game that looked promising. When I started, I was overwhelmed. Great graphics. Star Wars. Everyone I met was friendly. Despite belonging to a kind of elite class of beta testers, no one behaved in any way elite. The first person I met gave me a non-cdef pistol for free when he heard I just logged in the first time and hunted with me. That was my first expericence in SWG and I thought WOW. This game looks great and has much potential.
After a few days of testing all starter classes, I joined the entertainers in Keren. In beta, that was a bustling hub and *the* place to be. Imagine Theed without spammers and AFKers. As soon as I walked into the cantina, I was welcomed to the entertainer group and quickly taught what flourishes are, how band flourishes work and who the Tailors are. The band stood in one corner, the dancers were lined up in front, the partons had a good chat with the tailors and medics on the steps. We were dancing basic mostly. Not the best xp, but the dance we could all do syncronized. It wasn't for xp, it was for fun. I never made it to novice dancer doing basic all the time, but I did not care.
After a few days of testing all starter classes, I joined the entertainers in Keren. In beta, that was a bustling hub and *the* place to be. Imagine Theed without spammers and AFKers. As soon as I walked into the cantina, I was welcomed to the entertainer group and quickly taught what flourishes are, how band flourishes work and who the Tailors are. The band stood in one corner, the dancers were lined up in front, the partons had a good chat with the tailors and medics on the steps. We were dancing basic mostly. Not the best xp, but the dance we could all do syncronized. It wasn't for xp, it was for fun. I never made it to novice dancer doing basic all the time, but I did not care.
My colleagues asked me what I did in SWG, if I had blasted a TIE already, or if I had killed tuskens. When I told them I was dancing most of my time, they looked at me as if I had turned into a pink frog. Dancing ? How was that helping with the galactic war ? It wasn't. But it was fun.
Special thanks to FlawedDiamond, who was the inofficial leader of the cantina at that time. You rocked ! I missed you when we chose different servers on release day.
When release came and characters were wiped, I started out as a male rifleman/ranger. This is the role I play when available in a game. Each time and pretty successful. One day my server was the last to boot up and I created another character on a server that was supposed to be the inofficial server for my fellow countrymen. Gorath. ( creating a character on Gorath because Ahazi was late with booting is like drinking a bottle of champagne to cure a hangover, but that's another story ). I was bored and created a character that I planned out as the direct opposite of my first: a female chef to play around with when I was bored. I got into a cantina looking for a chef crafting station ( a bar comes to mind ) and I was hooked again.
Kaadara Cantina. My "fun" character became my main and my sniper was forgotten. Dancing and music again. Kaadara was pretty busy when people found out mission targets where closer to town than in Theed or Keren. Entertainers gathered and lead by those who already knew the system, we had a lot of fun again.
Glorified Chatroom ? Yes, maybe. Why not.
The first masters I knew had a guild tag. Not many entertainers were guilded, guilds cost money and mostly favor crafters or combateers. These Masters belonged to BLUES. Babes, Love and Entertainer Services.( note that and in German is und, so BLuES ). BLUES was a group of entertainers with many well known members. Only masters of their profession could join, though no PA member ever refused to group with us lowly novices for non-guild events.
Becoming a member of this PA was my goal for the weeks from novice to master dancer and musician. And it was fun. We'd group in cantinas and dance and play and chat the whole evening. People came in and enjoyed the show. Not neccessarily because they liked their forced downtime, but because they felt that we had a good time and we were able to spread that feeling. Some people are jerks and no game or education or punishment will change that. But for the overwhelming majority, visiting a cantina seemed to be as much fun as it was for us.
Finally I made my masters and was invited into BLUES. That indeed was a proud moment. It wasn't so much a change in gameplay. I had hung out with them anyway. It was more of a symbol. A Tag symbolizing the success as an entertainer and the fun we had on our way. I was an active member, taking part in rehearsals, gigs and gatherings. BLUES had a small settlement and later moved into a player city, becoming the local band.
When I joined BLUES, it had 40 members. I remember quite well, because I added every single one of them to my friend list. 40 people that in one way or another had fun entertaining.
Jump to now, maybe half a year later. The PA is gone. Why ? The obvious reason is that from the 40 people, only 2 are left. And both of us are no longer activly entertaining. But why is that ? Did entertaining get boring over time ? Did they all switch professions for holocrons ? Did the people change ? Some did. One followed the path of the blue box. One turned out to be not as friendly as we thought. One left the guild in the last days looking for another, more active entertainer guild.
Leaves 35. They did not change professions or servers. They left the game because of the current entertainer situation. We have no longer a fun athmosphere in the cantina and animating strangers to be happy is kind of hard when you aren't happy yourself.
As with most communities in online games, I am proud to have been part of BLUES. We had a lot of fun in the good times. Unlike all other communities I were part of in online games that disbanded, it hadn't been the people that changed. It was the game. "Gameplay" that was outlawed and one of the most objectionable things to do in all other online games was officially allowed.
I'm sure that the CS clan I was part of would have disbanded the day that aimbots were made legal tools. A roleplaying PA takes a lot longer to despair, mostly due to the reason that entertainers never played against each other. If someone has a higher dance... great. So cheats would not hit home directly. But degrading gameplay made most of them quit.
I'm sure that the CS clan I was part of would have disbanded the day that aimbots were made legal tools. A roleplaying PA takes a lot longer to despair, mostly due to the reason that entertainers never played against each other. If someone has a higher dance... great. So cheats would not hit home directly. But degrading gameplay made most of them quit.
To sum all of that rambling up: I still play. I still play an entertainer. Despite desicions from the developers. But I am alone. Of all entertainers I called friends, 87.5% quit the game. I cannot believe that this is tolerated by the team of developers. This game had a lot of potential. It was wasted.
This is no goodbye, because WoW is not out yet. But that reasoning in itself is enough to call the effort and years of development work wasted. I am overwhelmed by the potential this game has. I am ashamed what has been done with this enormous potential.
Soo Lin
Master Dancer, Master Musician, Master Entertainer, Expert Hairstylist and Novice Moneyprinter ( Surveyor )
Getting confirmation that this game is buggy and no one even cares every time I /setp.
Master Dancer, Master Musician, Master Entertainer, Expert Hairstylist and Novice Moneyprinter ( Surveyor )
Getting confirmation that this game is buggy and no one even cares every time I /setp.
Message Edited by nvoigt on 04-25-2004 04:51 PM
Message Edited by nvoigt on 04-25-2004 04:52 PM
Niza
Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:56 am
#2
Whenever it is pointed out that entertainers need some content to remain a viable profession it results in flames from the people who would benefit. Whenever we say, "hey our friends the other entertainers are dropping the skill (or game!)" we are flamed and insulted. Even here on this forum where we should agree that our content is lacking we get ridiculed and insulting for daring to suggest that some changes are needed.
Well.. The results have always spoken for themselves. Before anyone throws up a long winded "It's the fault of AFK holotainers post!" I had this same basic experience a month into the game long before the blue box decided to change how some people played the game.
Panthu
Sun Apr 25, 2004 7:26 pm
#3
/comfort Soo Lin *sniff*
I was lucky enough to learn from two great Master only guilds on Starsider. They made the game fun for me. I was mostly camp dancing and healing primarily when I started, but it was the time that I spent dancing with these Masters that made me truly love it. The more events based Academy of Arts guild broke up long ago and the other more RP based dancer guild has been steadily retreating into further RP and less socializing and performance mingling. I find this really sad. I want to see combat content and improvements as much as the next player, I think the game needs it to survive, but I do so hate to see it coming in at the same time this really new and exciting unique Gameplay option is floundering.
Niza is right I'm afraid. Many dancers were so caught up in keeping others out of their game, they forgot we need them to survive. We aren't much good dancing alone... it's just not as much fun anyway.
I think most of us see now that we need to be open minded about other playstyles and additions to our class, so that we can carry on and protect the things we love doing so much. I urge you again not to go down that tempting flamey path when someone posts about a playstyle you yourself do not desire. Think instead of ways you could make it work with and while maintaining your preferred playstyle. This will go much further in the way of keeping us safe. Different is not bad, as long as we are mindful of improving our Social playstyle.
Unlike some of you, I am not planning on leaving this game for another.
I beta and play many online games, but this is the only one that has ever provided me with a "Dancer" kind of fun. I am willing to support any new content or improvement that will help keep that safe (and get back what's been lost).
I was lucky enough to learn from two great Master only guilds on Starsider. They made the game fun for me. I was mostly camp dancing and healing primarily when I started, but it was the time that I spent dancing with these Masters that made me truly love it. The more events based Academy of Arts guild broke up long ago and the other more RP based dancer guild has been steadily retreating into further RP and less socializing and performance mingling. I find this really sad. I want to see combat content and improvements as much as the next player, I think the game needs it to survive, but I do so hate to see it coming in at the same time this really new and exciting unique Gameplay option is floundering.
Niza is right I'm afraid. Many dancers were so caught up in keeping others out of their game, they forgot we need them to survive. We aren't much good dancing alone... it's just not as much fun anyway.
I think most of us see now that we need to be open minded about other playstyles and additions to our class, so that we can carry on and protect the things we love doing so much. I urge you again not to go down that tempting flamey path when someone posts about a playstyle you yourself do not desire. Think instead of ways you could make it work with and while maintaining your preferred playstyle. This will go much further in the way of keeping us safe. Different is not bad, as long as we are mindful of improving our Social playstyle.
Unlike some of you, I am not planning on leaving this game for another.
I beta and play many online games, but this is the only one that has ever provided me with a "Dancer" kind of fun. I am willing to support any new content or improvement that will help keep that safe (and get back what's been lost). Let's work together to show the Devs what we need! 
bawler14
Tue Apr 27, 2004 8:35 pm
#4
Out of all the professions, Entertainers (Dancers and Musicians) have the largest desertion rate. More Ents have left the game or dropped the profession, than most of the other professions combined. Sure, other professions have problems, but no professions problems are as game breaking as ours. When the developers of SWG came up with the original concept of entertainers, they had an opportunity to make a new playstyle. The people who would enjoy this playstyle (social players) saw this, and had high hopes. Entertaining used to be fun, not only for us, but for the Non-ents, our patrons and fans, who frequented the cantinas as well. We are forced then to this question:
"What happened?"
A once popular and prosperous profession, filled with people who loved it and loved playing it, has turned into a profession made up of AFK's, Macroers, Buffbot's and Holohunters. When 90% of a profession is made up by characters who don't care about it, something is wrong. Players who lived in once lively cantina's were drowned in a see of lifeless corpses labeled AFK. Your story is only one, ableit a particular poignant story, among many. On my own server, I have seen a multitude of entertainers fade away, never to be heard from again. Some I didn't know at all. Some I knew too well. But not once, did I hear negative words spoken about an entertainer who left the game. The saddest part is that noone cares, not the Devs, not other players, noone.
I have come to the point, where the fun I get out of the game is the fun I make. Player created content and community is all we have left. I don't know how strong the Ent community is on Gorath, but on Bria we have a small, but thriving Ent group. Without the great people in this game, I would have left it long ago. These days, I spend my time planning events, hanging with TRUE Ents, and reminiscing for the Golden Age of Entertainment. Fun is in the eye of the beholder. This game is however you want it to be.
P.S. If Gorath doesn't work out for you in the end, hop onto Bria. We'd be more than happy to accomodate you.
nvoigt
Wed Apr 28, 2004 12:52 am
#5
Thanks for your support 
I'm on my own again and with the newadbarkers I'll try to position one at the starport and create a one-woman show in the hotel. Lets see how that works out...
ArgentWulf
Sun May 23, 2004 7:01 am
#6
bawler14 wrote:
. . .
I have come to the point, where the fun I get out of the game is the fun I make. Player created content and community is all we have left. I don't know how strong the Ent community is on Gorath, but on Bria we have a small, but thriving Ent group. Without the great people in this game, I would have left it long ago. These days, I spend my time planning events, hanging with TRUE Ents, and reminiscing for the Golden Age of Entertainment. Fun is in the eye of the beholder. This game is however you want it to be.
P.S. If Gorath doesn't work out for you in the end, hop onto Bria. We'd be more than happy to accomodate you.
This is another thread I can't believe I've missed for so long.
Truer words were never spoken, Doasa. We do make our own content and you for one do a bang up job. ***hugs***
I also know the feeling of a guild passing. While it was not an Ent guild, they were all my friends and I will never forget the members of the wolf pack andI feelyou loss.
Please forgive the following slight departure from the topic. . .
I also know what its like to be discouraged and become overwhelmed with despair at whats happening. Like I stated before in another thread I was thinking of leaving and was actually gone for several days, but I also thought about not "seeing" and talking to the friends I've made and it brought me back. Its been stated before, we play the game to have fun, but its the friends we've made along the waythat keep us coming back day after day. I just passed my1 year anniversary with SWG the other day. For the first 5 months I was a lone wolf. Strange and curious circumstances altered my path. If it were not for thefriends and "family"I've found since I came to Bria I would have left months ago. I now look forward to my next year.
This is the person behind Lei's eyes talking now. To all my friends and family (you know who you are)on Bria, thanks for being there for me and putting up withmy all too many faults and foibles.
/applaud interdependancy
We return you now to your regularly scheduled thread.
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